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Minderwiz  Minderwiz is offline
Student of Astrology
Join Date: 20 Apr 2002
Location: Wigan, UK
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Originally Posted by RohanMenon View Post
Ok so review from the last day


[A]How can a planet be classified into 'rising' or 'setting' in the Valens scheme, unless they are near the Eastern/Western horizons at moment for which the chart is made? Valens asks us to see if a planet is rising or setting. Most or all planets could be neither rising nor setting?

[B] In the rule above Valens examines the first and third triplicity lords. In the following paragraphs he seems to reccomend examining all 3

e.g: "If the Sun is found in Taurus, Virgo, or Capricorn (for day births), it will be
necessary to investigate first how Venus is configured, second the Moon, and
third Mars, and to see what stars they have in aspect. In the same way."

How to reconcile this?

[1] I am using my horoscope, not because I think it is a great or illustrative one, but because I can confirm or deny any events predicted by this system.
You've got the main guts of the story, so far. On your second question, you're interpreting Valens as being inconsistent by taking the terms 'helper' to mean the third Trigon ruler and then taking the term 'succesor' to be this same third Trigon ruler. But Valens has been quite clear in his section on the Triangles, that for the Aries/Leo/Sagittarius triplicity by day, the Sun is the first ruler and Jupiter is his succesor (not Saturn). And later on in his next section on the Distinguishing Characteristics he's quite clear that the primary ruler by Sect in to be considered for the first part of life and the Successor for the second part of life. So with Sun in Sagittarius in a Day chart, the Sun rules the first part of life, and then Jupiter rules the second. Saturn is not irrelevant, it contributes to both part of life.

On your first question, by rising or setting Valens is referring to the phase relationship with the Sun. Thus a rising planet is one which has just completed its helical rising and can now be seen in the sky. The opposite is its helical setting when it sets into the Sun and can no longer be seen. Between the helical setting and the helical rising the Sun is under the beams. This is usually seen as a debility, especially in the medieval period and later by Lilly but the Hellenistic authors allow a planet in one of it's own rulerships (Domicile, Exaltation, Trigon, Confines or Decan) to be seen as 'being in its chariot'. That's not a war chariot but one with a canopy to shield the occupant from the Sun. So the planet in its chariot is shielded from the debility of being under the beams. There's no remnant of this idea by the time of Lilly, so you won't find it in horary.

Rising and setting are joined by stations Retrograde and Direct as the othe important phase points in relation to the Sun (called phasis). Any planet that undergoes a phasis change within (from memory) 14 days either side of birth, is significant in the chart and hence the nativity.

Phase points, though are not as important as angularity in determining the quality of life. If both the predominant Trigon ruler of the sect light and its successor are badly placed, it's necessary to turn our attention to the Lot of Fortune and its Lord. The native might be very lucky and offset the poor forecast.
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