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Quote:
Originally Posted by RohanMenon View Post
....Valens later explains that the sect malefic causes trouble even when positive

" For night births, however, if Saturn is configured well and has a relationship
with the house ruler, it will also cause the loss of what was gained, reduction
in rank, and infamy. Let the same considerations be true for Mars: for night
births it grants leadership, generalship, public commands of the masses; for
day births (if Mars is in operative places), it brings about the previously
mentioned circumstances, but it then turns them into reversals, fears, and
oppositions; it makes leadership subject to factionalism and terror. It brings
attacks of enemies and uprisings of the mob, famines and plagues on cities,
assaults, fires, dangerous crises."
Valens is actually referring to the Out of Sect Malefic - Saturn in a night chart; Mars in a day chart.

You have a range here from worst to best. The out of sect malefic shows where life will be most difficult, that's followed by the in sect malefic, which is not as bad or even approaching neutral, Sun, Moon and Mercury, which are relatively neutral, the out of sect benefic, which is neutral to rather positive and the in sect benefic, which shows where life is at its best.

In other words, Hellenistic Astrology (and the tradition in general) is not black and white; bad and good. There's shades of grey in between (though possibly not as many as fifty LOL).

Quote:
Originally Posted by RohanMenon
10. [NEW] The out of sect malefic can be positive if configured well to triplicity lords, aspects benefics, or is angular. (Saturn for day births, Mars for night births.
Valens is talking about the malefic of Sect. As you say, Saturn for day births, Mars for night births.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RohahMenon
11. [NEW] If both the primary and secondary triplicity lords are badly situated, then we need to look at the staus of the Part of Fortune. (details to come)

12 [NEW but]I didn't understand this paragraph at all

"In the same way the benefics will take on the character of malefics whenever they are situated badly as house rulers. If they happen to be at angles while their house ruler just precedes an angle, their ability to do good will be weakened.
In any type [of forecast/nativity] it will be necessary to examine
how the house ruler of the house ruler is situated and what stars it has in
aspect. If the overall house ruler is unfavourably situated, but its ruler
[=ruler of its sign] is configured well, then the native will have help and a
basis of livelihood and rank proportional to the position of the star"

I *think* what is being said is

The benefics will be positive *unless* their triplicity ruler (I'm consistently interpreting 'house ruler' as 'triplicity ruler') are cadent, in which case their ability to do good is reduced. The 'house ruler of the house ruler' is a bit confusing, and it would have been good to have a concrete horoscope here)

This finishes section 3 of Book 2.
By house ruler Valens means the ruler of the Sign in which Venus or Jupiter is placed. For example Venus in Gemini is in the House of Mercury - so Mercury is its house ruler.

In the same way the benefics will take on the character of malefics whenever they are situated badly as house rulers...

This could mean several things, all of which are consistent with the tradition.

Certainly in the later tradition Jupiter ruling the eighth, or the sixth or the twelfth, is an accidental malefic. And as such it can harm. I'm not sure that's exactly what Valens means but it seems close to it. The benefic Jupiter, is the house ruler of a bad place.

Alternatively he might mean that Jupiter and Venus in the sixth, eighth or twelfth are considerably weakened. That is also true in the later tradition and is true in Hellenistic Astrology. A second alternative could be that Jupiter is in Scorpio in a Day chart - it's ruled by the out of sect malefic, Mars. If Mars itself is badly placed, say in Libra in the sixth place, then Jupiter is weakened even more.

Sadly we don't have Valens here to explain which of these he meant, or whether he meant something different. It's a short sentence and, as the original was in Greek, we are also dependent on the translator (Mark Riley and his knowledge of the Astrology of the time).

If they happen to be at angles while their house ruler just precedes an angle, their ability to do good will be weakened.

He immediately goes on to say that even if they seem to be well placed, things might not actually work out that way. For example Jupiter in the Seventh is angular but if it's in Taurus and Venus is in Gemini (the preceding Sign) Jupiter is weakened because Venus is in the Sixth Place, which is one of the bad places. Venus in any cadent place, would have the same sort of affect. Worse in the sixth or twelfth not as bad in the third and better still in the ninth (though still reducing Jupiter's strength somewhat.
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