Can Tarot really foretell the Future ?
ravenest
It is a type of magic and a type of psychological 'science' and both might be the same thing. But again ... magic is a psychological process and many people that want to get stuff or predict stuff (like the lotto numbers) that assume 'waving a wand around' a la Harry Potter are going to be disappointed or stay in dissillusion.
Sorry if that isnt original or exciting enough. I do use Thoth and Crowley says to invoke an angel before you do a reading ... and all that stuff. But that too is 'psychological magic' or 'imagination' and even Crowley admits that in much of his other writing.
Its hard to hold a conversation with some (no offense) as the basics groundwork needs to be understood first. And things often dont make sense without the inter-related background knowledge ... and to explain all that each time is tedious and off topic ... at times, I dont mind ... but others seem to ... especially the off topic bit.
For example, some might take offence when I say it is 'imagination' .
But what IS imagination ? Here is starter ;
http://www.amazon.com/The-Philosophers-Secret-Fire-Imagination/dp/1566634857
Flames
ravenest
.... < delete >
errr - PM you instead.
errr - PM you instead.
Annabelle
Goodness, yes. Tarot can be used to foretell the future. I use tarot for that purpose quite often.
Nikita_
What is the "future"? Bear with me while I explore or "unpack the concept"...
So...I think of someone I haven't seen in a long time...the phone rings and it's them. Was I seeing a glimpse of what's to come or simply seeing what already IS?...because I don't know what the future looks like until after the fact, anyway. And if this person hadn't called, they would have just been a thought and nothing more.
I find that most people who come to the tarot are trying to read a chapter ahead of the one that they're actually living. It's constant negation of what IS in favour of a desired future (isn't that why people often ask the same question, ad nauseum - me included), one that will "one day" make them happy? The implication is that they think their life is written in stone - pre-determined, pre-written, pre-filmed - and they want a sneak preview...versus....those who come to the tarot looking for guidance and insight into personal tendencies, patterns or potentials, for example, which suggests that if they don't take certain actions, life will follow along in the familiar trajectory. This category includes people who use the Tarot as a tool for self-knowledge, as opposed to a pure literal reading of the "future."
OK, sorry for not replying to your post earlier, but there's a lot going on here...I will start with what, to me, is the core of the issue; what you wrote up here.
I've always believed destiny exists, and that everything is mostly pre-determined, with some space for free will, mainly, how we choose to face and handle what we are presented with. I also used to think-and I still do-that tarot is a tool to help us prepare for what's to come, or help us understand when we shouldn't insist in pursuing a path that was not going to lead us anywhere, be it a wrong relationship, a carreer, whatever. In short, to help us avoid wasting time-years of our lives, sometimes- fighting windmills....needless to say, I also think, in that sense, that tarot is an instrument for guidance and self-exploration, self-knowledge and so on...I don't think these two uses of tarot-wanting to know the future, or the next chapter, or our path, destiny, call it as you wish-and wanting to know oneselves and look for guidance, is a contraddiction at all...
But I do think it is impossible to reconcile the idea that you can foretell the future, and therefore that it is pretty much written-if not in stone, then something else - with the idea that tarot -or anything else, really-can be used for divination purposes. People who believe that free will, multiple destinies, multiple futures, a Matrix structure or similar, exist, should not, in my opinion, use tarot for anything other than meditation or self-knowledge. But they should be very clear with their clients, that they cannot, in any way, predict the future, because everything and anything is possible, and open. If they do that, they end up in the ridiculous contraddictions that ravenest point out repeatedly, and which I will therefore not repeat, of insisting that tarot is right even when it's wrong...in short, if we come to the conclusion that indeed there is free will, multiple possibilities, winds blowing all over the place that change things, we should have enough consistency, and intellectual honesty, to tell people we read for-and ourselves-quite simply, that Tarot CANNOT SEE or FORETELLTHE FUTURE..... That is my modest, maybe simplistic, un-philosophical and uneducated view on this....
Zephyros
Wouldn't it be the exact opposite? If someone does not have a deterministic point of view, a predictive reading might have some use, because there is a chance to change the future. If the future has already been decided, not only is there no point in predictions, but even self-improvement is a moot point. No matter how much you improve yourself, it won't have any effect on your future.
Nikita_
If the future is undecided, and it can literally change any minute, what's the point in trying to predict it ? I't's impossible ! And if your belief in free will and determination is so strong, then we can do whatever we like if we really want to, so what's the need for a tarot reading, or any other form of divination ?
Zephyros
Well, because it doesn't change every minute. Some futures do in fact change in a blink of an eye, while others take a little more time to manifest. I mean, sure you can ask how your day will be, and there could be a freak earthquake and you might die, despite any prediction, but it is still a question of probabilities.
Same goes for any question. You ask if someone is interested in you, and whether they will make a move. As small as the chance is, they could be an alien from another galaxy, interested only in androgynous four-breasted specimens of their own kind... but there is a very low probability of that actually being the case. Anything that happens has millions of different threads that lead to it, and you can never be omnipotent and know all that there is to know, but you make predictions all the time, with or without Tarot.
I predict that in a few minutes I will go into the kitchen and make some eggs. Although my prediction is based on foreknowledge (I bought eggs) I could still be wrong. My roommates might have eaten them all, they may have gone bad, I could drop all of them on the floor, etc. If one or all of those things eventually keep me from eating eggs, I won't make excuses for my powers of divination, I'll just chalk it up to life being against me.
Even if Tarot is "magic," as you say (although ravenest commented on the validity of the definition of magic) it still doesn't mean the magician is all-powerful and all-knowing.
Xrysalida
Well this is one of my issues at the moment with tarot qnd I have several things to say
I m coming to agree with you that tarot are better of analyzing/describing the present, the current on going energy of tge situation, one reason might be the one of choices, like change the course of things, and I have seen this happen with me some years ago,
The other reason I think is that tarot have changed energy at the time we are living, the energy is so high now around us that I feel that we have the chance to reach a higher intuition ourselves without the help of any divine tools, (mind that this is my own feeling our this)
The other reason i think is that we have some standard meanings for the cards and very often can mean something else than the one we are used to see,
I ve seen a prediction made for a night that everything would be over in my relationship, i made several readings and the answer was the same, all the cards indicating loss, separation, ends, transitions were coming i combination, it was yes a difficult time that got through....
I also think that tarot can take a part only of the energy of a situation, they can't see the whole picture, so even if they tell you e.c. That there will be end they don't tell you that this will be get through....i can give many examples on this, i will start a thread soon on this subject, just gathering my thoughts now.
Last to add, a friend of mind really insists that some people shouldn't read for the selves cause their energy is not attune somehow with predicting the future
I m coming to agree with you that tarot are better of analyzing/describing the present, the current on going energy of tge situation, one reason might be the one of choices, like change the course of things, and I have seen this happen with me some years ago,
The other reason I think is that tarot have changed energy at the time we are living, the energy is so high now around us that I feel that we have the chance to reach a higher intuition ourselves without the help of any divine tools, (mind that this is my own feeling our this)
The other reason i think is that we have some standard meanings for the cards and very often can mean something else than the one we are used to see,
I ve seen a prediction made for a night that everything would be over in my relationship, i made several readings and the answer was the same, all the cards indicating loss, separation, ends, transitions were coming i combination, it was yes a difficult time that got through....
I also think that tarot can take a part only of the energy of a situation, they can't see the whole picture, so even if they tell you e.c. That there will be end they don't tell you that this will be get through....i can give many examples on this, i will start a thread soon on this subject, just gathering my thoughts now.
Last to add, a friend of mind really insists that some people shouldn't read for the selves cause their energy is not attune somehow with predicting the future
