Death in a chart and more on Ron Arad

Hm...
Gloria's comment on the trines?showing death, is very interesting...
He definitely didn't have an "easy flow" death!!!!, so that makes sense too...

Regarding the little spread I did, if Ace of Swords stands for Death, then the Ace of pentacles could stand about the attempts for prisoners exchange, and the fact that the issue always "starts" with no end...even if he's dead...
The Fool? Maybe it stands for us??? All out there to discover what will be, and maybe it leaves the other people interested in this, including the family, to be open and wonder? And since he's so talked about, then maybe he's doing MUCH in that other plane...

Minderwiz-regarding "where is the body", what kind of an answer do you expect to get that indicates a place?
(I must say, that once I was looking for something at home, couldn't figure out where I put it, so I drew a card---I got Death! I stopped looking!!!!
But if i was to get the Queen of Cups, where would look? in the bathroom?????

It's possible to use horary to indicate geographic direction and also the nature of the area and placement. I'm not sure how productive that would be in this case as usually the reference point is either in relation to where the Astrologer is or where the client is. A geographic direction from the UK is not that helpful. The type of area or building may throw some light on the issue but again there may be many areas matching the description.

For example, in my chart the Sun, his significator, is in Scorpio - Scorpio is a Water sign so the body may well be near water. The also signify lowlands, Scorpio tends to indicate stagnant or poisoned water or oily water, so the body might be buried in a lowland area near some stagnant water. Scorpio also geographically is taken as North by East (the question of course being North by East from where?)

The Houses also have geographic directions - the eighth is West South West. Now this is virtually the exact opposite of the direction given by Scorpio. However if we measure from the Seventh (his House) he would be in the second House, suggesting East North East. The sign on the seventh (his House) is Leo and Leo geographically is East by North.

All of this suggests a direction that is East by North through to North by East. Perhaps a bit more Easterly than Northerly. This might be from his point of capture but that's something of a leap.

Your analysis of "goods" is very impressive Minderwiz... (I'm stuck with this word with you...)

I believe, that his body must be anywhere between Lebanon and Iran, bust most likely in Iran, where he was transfered long ago.
That makes sense with your findings too...

The other question though is, whether the physical location of the body can change anything... Unless someone says "hey, he's dead, and here is his body", there can not be a closure...
If he's barried under water or under polluted water, or....close to some oil... it will not solve the mystery and give this an end...
Somehow this issue lives on an IDEA, and what powerful idea... and not on facts and bones... Somehow these are barried...

I feel like in an Agatha Christie story now...while discussing this here....

As you say it really depends now on whether someone volunteers the information or there is some intelligence about his whereabouts.

The occupation of Iraq may lead to better intelligence or someone coming forward but I don't think that that is a highly likely outcome.

Will the body ever be discovered and closure be gained? Well we could always do another horary

Until there is closure, as you say, Ron Arad is a symbol, more than just a missing airman.

Minderwiz said:

Will the body ever be discovered and closure be gained? Well we could always do another horary

Until there is closure, as you say, Ron Arad is a symbol, more than just a missing airman.

Click to expand...

M? I must say you are a most inspiring teacher, as well as a teaser...

Inspiring because although I thought of the Ron Arad story as an idea, i didn't think of it as a SYMBOL, and that takes me to a whole different place...

---So, What does Ron Arad stand for, as a symbol?
I'll have to think of it for a while, but what first comes to my mind is the never-found resolution in the middle-east... That too, is something that seems to be dragged-and will go on, for ever and ever...
And let's not forget that according to Freud, "although there is an enormous number of symbols, the objects or ideas symbolized are limited in number"...

---And why you are a teaser????? well, look at the cute little smily in your post!
of course we could do another horary...
and what should we ask?
whether, ever there will be a closure to the issue and when? (maybe finding the body is not the main point...) maybe also something about the impact that will have? (probabaly a big blast!!!!)

Another thought I just had, is that you too (like me), have a generous amount of Scorp...Who else would look for the dead?????

Well given what you have told me, I think Ron Arad is a symbol so the issue of closure is more than just a mundane matter.

To be honest whilst in princple another horary might help, I'm not quite sure of how we would phrase the question.

Asking if the body will be found is not quite enough - what I think we are looking for is postive news of Ron Arad's fate that will answer the 'mystery'. Also that news would need to be publically known, at least in Israel.

I'm not quite sure what house governs 'answers to mysteries' - so I'll have to think about that one.

If you have any luck with Ron Arad's natal details we could have a go at trying to do some transits, progressions or use other prediction systems.

Hm...
Very interesting question...
"Which house govers answers to mysteries...?"

Wouldn't that be the house that govers mysteries???
since in astrology all the edges are contained within the same one? (like marriage and open enemies?)

Of course, the 8th is also a possibility...
Would an aspect like Sun conjuction Jupiter poor light in any of these houses, and thus show a revelation?
When this will bw resolved, it will bi BIG-very BIG...I'm sure of that...

I always felt that Ron's natal Sun must be then in the 12th house...
It's all about HIM, but without him.... He's HIDDEN...
here a couple of the links, that show the interest in him (who I'm sure is mainly Israel's interest, but not only. This is an international matter. There just have been no other story like that before, or anywhere else...
http://news.google.com/news?q=ron+arad&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=nn
http://www.ron-arad.org.il/eng-story.html
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satell...le/ShowFull&cid=1068697367951&p=1008596981749

The only way I can think of to get his time of birth, is try and email his brother. Of course, I don't have his email address...
and let's say I find that (that is possible), then I'll have to give him this link, so that he can see and even follow...
I'm afraid that can be misunderstood, especially since I have a feeling that these must be "practical" people, and the whole thing is so sensitive...Especially now, that they want to free Ron's capturer-Mustafa Dirani...
So, I'm not "fully a YES" doing that right now. I would love to find out, but stay anonymus and unseen (12th house too!!!)

Ok, I'll let that perculate...
maybe if I found why I'm so passionate about this, it would be easier...(the SYMBOL...)

But thank you...thank you for your cooperation...

M-Press,

Thanks very much for the links, I'll have a look at them.

Your intuition may well be right and Ron's Sun may be twelfth House.

After a bit of thought, I think that in a horary the mystery solution (if there is one) may well lie in the fourth House. This is often seen as the House dealing with the 'end of the matter' and Al-Biruni links it to what succeeds death and what happens to the dead.

So I may have a play around with that idea.

hm...hm... interesting, interesting...Minderwiz...
Seems you may be right, there is somehting there, about this 4th house...
Isn't this also the house of "home", and maybe then "back to home"?
it feels that there is also a patriotical thing here... maybe that's why the "people-of-home" are so interested in this (supporting and personally involved)?

and I have more news...
After my post here today, I emailed a friend, whether he had any idea how I can get Ron's time of birth, without asking for it...
I got back 2 links in hebrew...
One is someone that did a tarot reading asking about Ron...
the other is a numerological approach to what happened to Ron...
and then i'm sure there is more....this mystery is one that touches very wide...
other than that, these messages were not very clear (hebrew...!!!), i don't know what cards the tarot guy got...

The new info that i did get, was the date and time he fell into the "enemy hands":
This was on 16 October, 1986, at 16:45, in Lebanon.
can that help for anyhting?

Well, let's see what else will come up....Looks as if there in a "stiring" going on...I'll keep looking for the time of birth...I'm wondering...

Thanks M-Press,

The date of his capture is very useful - it can provide the basis of an event chart. I'll have a look at it and get back to you.