Horary Readings

Thanks niki - that helps a lot. From what little I know of arranged marriages, from Asian friends here, the job of the parents is to find suitable candidates, but you do the final choosing (or not, if you don't like any of them) - it should work like a Western marriage bureau but with a much more personal and friendly service.

So I have to factor in your parents role and they must like 'him' too.

I think it would help to have your natal details - date of birth, time and place. Sending them by PM is the best way.

Minderwiz said:

Thanks niki - that helps a lot. From what little I know of arranged marriages, from Asian friends here, the job of the parents is to find suitable candidates, but you do the final choosing (or not, if you don't like any of them) - it should work like a Western marriage bureau but with a much more personal and friendly service.

So I have to factor in your parents role and they must like 'him' too.

I think it would help to have your natal details - date of birth, time and place. Sending them by PM is the best way.

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you have a pm dear..thanks so much

Thanks for the details

Reading for Niki

The chart has 2 degrees of Virgo rising, so that suggests that it might be too early to present a definitive answer. You are signified by Mercury, in Gemini and in the tenth House. Mercury is strong in essential and accidental dignity by placement but is combust (within 8.5 degrees of the Sun). Remember that you do indeed control the process and the choice is yours, don't be 'outshone' in this process.

The prospective fiance is given by Jupiter,in Aries. Jupiter has essential dignity so the 'fiance' will have good characteristics, but is not well placed in the eighth.

Your parents are signified by the ruler of the fourth House, Mars, which is in Virgo and in the first. Your parents first thoughts in this process are for you. and they also acknowledge that the final choice is yours - you rule them, in terms of this decision.

The first thing to look for is any receptions between the main significators. Mercury in Gemini is in the detriment of Jupiter, which suggests that whoever the first candidate is, you won't like him, even if he ticks all the other boxes. Strangely, Mars is also in the detriment of Jupiter, so it seems that your parents won't like him either. Now the only way I see that panning out is if their initial 'spadework' identify him as meeting all the criteria you and they are looking for but when a meeting is arranged, you and they are not impressed by him in the flesh. Or there might be something which you and they don't like, which puts you off him, even before a meeting.

Jupiter on the other hand is in Aries, the sign of Mars. So the prospective fiance really wants to impress your parents but is in none of the dignities of Mercury, so he's not really concerned about you.

As his parents are probably also involved, they are signified by Venus, and Mars is in the triplicity of Venus - your parents see them as beng eminently suitable as prospective inlaws. So it may be that the intial attraction is to his family, not to him personally. Venus is on the twelfth cusp, so that is not a good sign.

There's also one other interesting indicator in this chart. The fortunate North Node is in the fifth House of Romance and is conjunct the Part of Marriage. So there is some indication of marriage here but in the context of romance.

Now Mercury is applying to an aspect with Jupiter, by square. Squares suggests difficulties, delays and obstructions with an end result that is not really what is wanted. So if things do fall in line with the reading, please do not allow yourself to go for an engagement with someone that neither you nor your parents really like but seems 'attractive' because of his family status.

I stress that there must be some doubt over the reading because of the early degree rising but in essence it seems to suggest that neither you nor your parents, will find a candidate you really like in the time period. If you were desperate to get married a candidate will be there but I don't think proceeding with the engagement in those circumstances will provide any satisfaction with the outcome.

There's also seems to be the possibility of something hidden going on - Mercury is combust the Sun, who is Lord 12 and therefore an accidental malefic. The twelfth is concerned with the hidden or secret. Venus (his parents) are ruled by the Sun and in the twelfth, and Jupiter is in the Triplicity of the Sun (and has a mutual reception with the Sun through exaltation.

Please make sure that you and your parents are are completely sure about things in this period and that there isn't anything that is being concealed from you and nothing going on 'behind the scenes'.

I hope I'm wrong on that, and the considerations suggest that I can't be sure but please make sure that you (and your parents) are really happy with things and know everything before making any commitment in this period.

Minderwiz said:

The chart has 2 degrees of Virgo rising, so that suggests that it might be too early to present a definitive answer. You are signified by Mercury, in Gemini and in the tenth House. Mercury is strong in essential and accidental dignity by placement but is combust (within 8.5 degrees of the Sun). Remember that you do indeed control the process and the choice is yours, don't be 'outshone' in this process.

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yeah you are right that i control the whole process..its just i have given the responsiblity happily to my parents.

minderwiz said:

The prospective fiance is given by Jupiter,in Aries. Jupiter has essential dignity so the 'fiance' will have good characteristics, but is not well placed in the eighth.

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hmmm..having good characterstics is a good point..

minderwiz said:

Your parents are signified by the ruler of the fourth House, Mars, which is in Virgo and in the first. Your parents first thoughts in this process are for you. and they also acknowledge that the final choice is yours - you rule them, in terms of this decision.

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absolutely right,they just want my happiness..and leave the ultimate choice to me..for that i am so gratefull to them.

minderwiz said:

The first thing to look for is any receptions between the main significators. Mercury in Gemini is in the detriment of Jupiter, which suggests that whoever the first candidate is, you won't like him, even if he ticks all the other boxes. Strangely, Mars is also in the detriment of Jupiter, so it seems that your parents won't like him either. Now the only way I see that panning out is if their initial 'spadework' identify him as meeting all the criteria you and they are looking for but when a meeting is arranged, you and they are not impressed by him in the flesh. Or there might be something which you and they don't like, which puts you off him, even before a meeting.

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i am sorry i am a little confused here,by first candidate you mean to say that whoever i first meet or consider after today or the first candidate i have met..?????i have already seen quite a few guys in the past months..but nobody i found suitable enough to be my"husband"...

miderwiz said:

Jupiter on the other hand is in Aries, the sign of Mars. So the prospective fiance really wants to impress your parents but is in none of the dignities of Mercury, so he's not really concerned about you.

As his parents are probably also involved, they are signified by Venus, and Mars is in the triplicity of Venus - your parents see them as beng eminently suitable as prospective inlaws. So it may be that the intial attraction is to his family, not to him personally. Venus is on the twelfth cusp, so that is not a good sign.

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i can only say anything once my cofusion is clear..i hope you dont mind..sorry

minderwiz said:

There's also one other interesting indicator in this chart. The fortunate North Node is in the fifth House of Romance and is conjunct the Part of Marriage. So there is some indication of marriage here but in the context of romance.

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so according to you what does this mean..a love marriage..???but i dont have anybody around me for that..

minderwiz said:

Now Mercury is applying to an aspect with Jupiter, by square. Squares suggests difficulties, delays and obstructions with an end result that is not really what is wanted. So if things do fall in line with the reading, please do not allow yourself to go for an engagement with someone that neither you nor your parents really like but seems 'attractive' because of his family status.

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oh this is a very good point..i will surely keep this in mind..

minderwiz said:

I stress that there must be some doubt over the reading because of the early degree rising but in essence it seems to suggest that neither you nor your parents, will find a candidate you really like in the time period. If you were desperate to get married a candidate will be there but I don't think proceeding with the engagement in those circumstances will provide any satisfaction with the outcome.

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hmmm..i get your point..i really want to be happy in the marriage..but i can wait for the right person to come along..

minderwiz said:

There's also seems to be the possibility of something hidden going on - Mercury is combust the Sun, who is Lord 12 and therefore an accidental malefic. The twelfth is concerned with the hidden or secret. Venus (his parents) are ruled by the Sun and in the twelfth, and Jupiter is in the Triplicity of the Sun (and has a mutual reception with the Sun through exaltation.

Please make sure that you and your parents are are completely sure about things in this period and that there isn't anything that is being concealed from you and nothing going on 'behind the scenes'.

I hope I'm wrong on that, and the considerations suggest that I can't be sure but please make sure that you (and your parents) are really happy with things and know everything before making any commitment in this period.

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oh thanks for giving this warning beforehand..although here we enquire as much as we could..but i guess i will make sure that some more effort should be put in knowing the other family..

i am so thankfull to you for this reading,you have given me so much info and warned me beforehand of negative..it really means a lot to me..if you dont mind can i ask you something through pm.

god bless you

Niki: i am sorry i am a little confused here,by first candidate you mean to say that whoever i first meet or consider after today or the first candidate i have met..?????i have already seen quite a few guys in the past months..but nobody i found suitable enough to be my"husband"...

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Please excuse my intervention, but if this is a Horary chart then the 'first candidate' would most likely be the current candidate - the one who is there at the time of the chart.

Impressive delination Minderwiz . You've been a great help to me for my interest in the traditional approach. Books are one thing - but your hands-on explanations are illuminating! Thank you.


Bee

Hello Minderwiz are you still taking questions?

If yes I would like to ask if we are going to be able to move next month or is it going to drag until aug and are we going to be able to get the house we want. We need to move, my husband is already in another state and it has been really hard on me and the kids. I am hoping the move will be smooth but so far we hit some bumps.
I can pm you my chart if you want .. Thank you

niki frm india said:

i am sorry i am a little confused here,by first candidate you mean to say that whoever i first meet or consider after today or the first candidate i have met..?????i have already seen quite a few guys in the past months..but nobody i found suitable enough to be my"husband"...

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As Bee points out above, the Horary reading relates to the current and future situation, not the past, so here 'first candidate' is the one that you are either currently considering or, if there isn't someone currently being considered, then the next one that you look at during the period of the horary. Horaries can give information about the past, to provide some additional context but the purpose is to deal with present or future decisions.

niki frm india said:

so according to you what does this mean..a love marriage..???but i dont have anybody around me for that..

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I think it means that you expect that the person who emerges from the selection process is someone that you can have a good romantic relationship with - I don't see any necessary contradiction between an arranged marriage process and love between the two people, involved.

As you say later on, you want to be happy in your marriage and I think this is an indication of that.

niki frm india said:

i can only say anything once my cofusion is clear..i hope you dont mind..sorry

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My impression here is that on first sight his family appear to be just the sort of people that your parents like - there is a compatibility between the two families, enough to get the process started. He is certainly impressed by your family but the attraction seems to be to your family, rather than to you personally. Now that might be normal, within the early stages of this process, so please forgive me if I'm stating the obvious but within the context of Western culture I'd expect positive receptions between your significator and his. I also need to remember my own warning, the chart has early degrees rising and so it may be premature to draw fixed conclusions from it.

I also don't want to over dramatise the issues - the 'hidden' or 'secret' may well be something that doesn't show up till you meet but is then obvious and it doesn't have to be anything terrible, just enough to put you off him - such as bad breath, or some mannerism that you don't like, or his views on certain topics.

I've kept to 'him' and 'he' which is singular, but I realise there may be more than one under consideration during this period. If so then I don't see any of them as being suitable, in your view.

A couple of general points to conclude:

Firstly, I'm using a traditional approach but it is firmly in the Western tradition, and uses the tropical zodiac. I'm not sure how it would work in Jyotish Astrology, but you need to be aware that the two traditions do have significant differences, as well as common features. The main difference here would be that the Ascendant and planetary positions would be shifted back some 24 degrees, which would have given a different Ascendant sign and different significators. So if you asked a local Astrologer for a second opinion, you'd get a different chart for the same place and time.

Secondly, I can't stress enough that the early Ascendant casts doubt on the reliability of the chart. It could well be a false alarm but as the message seems to be 'take care in the process' then I think that message is worth stating - though I have little doubt that you would do just that anyway.

Please feel free to ask any follow up questions by pm.

Minderwiz said:

As Bee points out above, the Horary reading relates to the current and future situation, not the past, so here 'first candidate' is the one that you are either currently considering or, if there isn't someone currently being considered, then the next one that you look at during the period of the horary. Horaries can give information about the past, to provide some additional context but the purpose is to deal with present or future decisions.

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oh thank you for this clarification..

minderwiz said:

I think it means that you expect that the person who emerges from the selection process is someone that you can have a good romantic relationship with - I don't see any necessary contradiction between an arranged marriage process and love between the two people, involved.

As you say later on, you want to be happy in your marriage and I think this is an indication of that.

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yes yes this is what i exactly want,i want love in my relationship..and i really wish and hope i get that..cause i believe love plays a vital role in spending a lifetime with someone..

minderwiz said:

My impression here is that on first sight his family appear to be just the sort of people that your parents like - there is a compatibility between the two families, enough to get the process started. He is certainly impressed by your family but the attraction seems to be to your family, rather than to you personally. Now that might be normal, within the early stages of this process, so please forgive me if I'm stating the obvious but within the context of Western culture I'd expect positive receptions between your significator and his. I also need to remember my own warning, the chart has early degrees rising and so it may be premature to draw fixed conclusions from it.

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well i would like to update you that i have a meeting with a guy and his family tomorrow..so can this description be applied to the outcome of meeting..??..if so,then i will keep this in mind and act accordingly..

minderwiz said:

I also don't want to over dramatise the issues - the 'hidden' or 'secret' may well be something that doesn't show up till you meet but is then obvious and it doesn't have to be anything terrible, just enough to put you off him - such as bad breath, or some mannerism that you don't like, or his views on certain topics.

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hmmm..ohk..lets see what comes up tomorrow..

minderwiz said:

I've kept to 'him' and 'he' which is singular, but I realise there may be more than one under consideration during this period. If so then I don't see any of them as being suitable, in your view.

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ohk..so this also indicates..that tomorrows meeting will not get to finalisation for marriage...

minderwiz said:

A couple of general points to conclude:

Firstly, I'm using a traditional approach but it is firmly in the Western tradition, and uses the tropical zodiac. I'm not sure how it would work in Jyotish Astrology, but you need to be aware that the two traditions do have significant differences, as well as common features. The main difference here would be that the Ascendant and planetary positions would be shifted back some 24 degrees, which would have given a different Ascendant sign and different significators. So if you asked a local Astrologer for a second opinion, you'd get a different chart for the same place and time.

Secondly, I can't stress enough that the early Ascendant casts doubt on the reliability of the chart. It could well be a false alarm but as the message seems to be 'take care in the process' then I think that message is worth stating - though I have little doubt that you would do just that anyway.

Please feel free to ask any follow up questions by pm.

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actually i am not so literate about astrology,but i do understand how the western and indian astrology differs..i believe when a message has to reach somebody,it will reach..whether its through western or indian astrology..or any other method..so i really thank you for this reading..

will pm you shortly..with some query,i hope i am not being a burden..

god bless you

Interesting that you have a meeting lined up - As it wasn't specifically mentioned in the question but presumably was being set up when I cast the chart, I'm not sure whether it is covered by the reading. I'm going to presume that it is, simply because the chart suggests that, if anything, things are too early - if he will become your fiance, the chart should have said that the question was too late - that is an Ascendant in the last degrees of a sign. The question would have been too late, because the right process was already under way, with the right person.

If the reading is accurate, then I doubt the meeting will lead to marriage or at least within the time frame. It is possible that it will but after a longer and more difficult process (the two planets are forming an aspect by square) and he may have to change in some way to win you over.

I'd certainly be interested in learning how the meeting goes.