franniee
dadsnook2000 said:
oooooo excellent! Thank you! I love the Tycho story! Thanks
Franniee's Solar Return
oooooo excellent! Thank you! I love the Tycho story! Thanks
Minderwiz
Some questions and observations
Thanks for the exposition Dave, I've left it for nearly a day to see if anyone else wanted to raise issues or ask questions. I suspect that without some strong understanding of the basis of method and application, it's difficult to do that. I remember when you first began to explain your methods I had a great deal of difficulty getting a clear distinction between your daily charts and the transit chart for the same day, given that you are progressing the Sun between two solar returns - it's not a method that is easy to get first time around.
So perhaps it might help if I raise some 'novice' questions here, which might help others to follow your closely argued analysis.
Firstly how sensitive is your method to birth time 'errors'? We often get charts where the time of birth was either not recorded or we go on relatives recall. This might mean errors of several minutes (even where there is an 'official' record of the time) to a couple of hours. Would a difference of half an hour make any significant difference in the angles not only in the SR chart and natal chart but also in your daily charts?
Secondly - how do we understand the Ascendant and MC in your daily charts - Do they correspond to 'real' clock times or are they in some way 'just' symbolic of the day? (and 'just' is in inverted commas for the reason that a symbol can be highly important)
Thirdly - is it necessary to share your approach to Astrology and have your level of knowledge to use the method? I've tried precessing SR Charts and find that I can apply my own approach meaningfully to the chart and get results which point in the same direction as you, our examination of the Camilla charts being a good example.
OK, some observations:
Dave took the date of 25th November because it was the first noteworthy date (in terms of chart features) since the Solar Return in September. Oddly the day after 26th November, was an important date in terms of her profections - and the discrepency might (and I mean might) be simple error (in the statistical sense) that we get with dynamic data. On that date Franniee's profected MC entered the sign of Pisces and came under the benefic influence of Jupiter. The profected MC was moving through the natal 11th House of friends and also hopes and aspirations. So around this date we would expect Franniee to be quite optimistic not just in the modern sense of career expectations but in the wider sense of the 10th house - social status and one's role in life. It's also the house of the Mother - so all of these are areas which will appear to be 'bathed' in some optimism (I stress 'some'). The account of a friendly family meal seems to fit in with that, where Franniee is acting as hostess. So both methods seem to point to this being a happy time, which also provides corroboration to both.
On the issue of illness, accident and disease. Dave is quite right we would expect different significators, depending on the nature of the problem. It's always dangerous to try and be specific based on general information. Even something that appears clear, like a 'back' injury, may not be adequate for making a retrospective judgement. A 'back' injury, may be spinal, in which case we would expect Saturn to play a role, but it might related to damage to nerve damage or sensory loss (Mercury). Issues relating to disease illness, etc are one of the few areas where signs and house placements can have an equal role to play in diagnosis - thus the eighth, is also a significator of the spine and Libra can signify 'great heats in the back' and kidney issues.
There's no confirmation that Tycho Brahe was poisoned, let alone murdered - though there is evidence that he had much higher than expected levels of Mercury in his moustache. How that came there is the subject of some controversy and there's currently further work being done on his remains. If Mercury (the metal) was the cause of his death we would expect Mercury (the planet) to be prominently placed in an appropriate chart. Of course Neptune might be up to his old tricks of fogging the issue and indicating that the theory is a fantasy LOL.
Thanks for the exposition Dave, I've left it for nearly a day to see if anyone else wanted to raise issues or ask questions. I suspect that without some strong understanding of the basis of method and application, it's difficult to do that. I remember when you first began to explain your methods I had a great deal of difficulty getting a clear distinction between your daily charts and the transit chart for the same day, given that you are progressing the Sun between two solar returns - it's not a method that is easy to get first time around.
So perhaps it might help if I raise some 'novice' questions here, which might help others to follow your closely argued analysis.
Firstly how sensitive is your method to birth time 'errors'? We often get charts where the time of birth was either not recorded or we go on relatives recall. This might mean errors of several minutes (even where there is an 'official' record of the time) to a couple of hours. Would a difference of half an hour make any significant difference in the angles not only in the SR chart and natal chart but also in your daily charts?
Secondly - how do we understand the Ascendant and MC in your daily charts - Do they correspond to 'real' clock times or are they in some way 'just' symbolic of the day? (and 'just' is in inverted commas for the reason that a symbol can be highly important)
Thirdly - is it necessary to share your approach to Astrology and have your level of knowledge to use the method? I've tried precessing SR Charts and find that I can apply my own approach meaningfully to the chart and get results which point in the same direction as you, our examination of the Camilla charts being a good example.
OK, some observations:
Dave took the date of 25th November because it was the first noteworthy date (in terms of chart features) since the Solar Return in September. Oddly the day after 26th November, was an important date in terms of her profections - and the discrepency might (and I mean might) be simple error (in the statistical sense) that we get with dynamic data. On that date Franniee's profected MC entered the sign of Pisces and came under the benefic influence of Jupiter. The profected MC was moving through the natal 11th House of friends and also hopes and aspirations. So around this date we would expect Franniee to be quite optimistic not just in the modern sense of career expectations but in the wider sense of the 10th house - social status and one's role in life. It's also the house of the Mother - so all of these are areas which will appear to be 'bathed' in some optimism (I stress 'some'). The account of a friendly family meal seems to fit in with that, where Franniee is acting as hostess. So both methods seem to point to this being a happy time, which also provides corroboration to both.
On the issue of illness, accident and disease. Dave is quite right we would expect different significators, depending on the nature of the problem. It's always dangerous to try and be specific based on general information. Even something that appears clear, like a 'back' injury, may not be adequate for making a retrospective judgement. A 'back' injury, may be spinal, in which case we would expect Saturn to play a role, but it might related to damage to nerve damage or sensory loss (Mercury). Issues relating to disease illness, etc are one of the few areas where signs and house placements can have an equal role to play in diagnosis - thus the eighth, is also a significator of the spine and Libra can signify 'great heats in the back' and kidney issues.
There's no confirmation that Tycho Brahe was poisoned, let alone murdered - though there is evidence that he had much higher than expected levels of Mercury in his moustache. How that came there is the subject of some controversy and there's currently further work being done on his remains. If Mercury (the metal) was the cause of his death we would expect Mercury (the planet) to be prominently placed in an appropriate chart. Of course Neptune might be up to his old tricks of fogging the issue and indicating that the theory is a fantasy LOL.
dadsnook2000
Reply to Minderwiz's questions
An error in the natal chart of 12 minutes of time would move the MC about 3 degrees based on the MC moving one degree in about four minutes. That small discrepancy would reflect itself in the S/R chart as well as in the Progressed Daily Angles charts.
The daily chart's angles should be seen as "symbolic" as they are advanced at a rate that moves the MC some 450 degrees per year -- or one and a quarter circles (chart's 360 degree circle). This is the average rate of advance each day by progression. This is not to be confused with the fact that the MC, like the Sun, rotates across the meridian in a constant manner such that it appears to make a full rotation plus a degree-or-so each day --- this being in real time.
The only difference in the constant symbolic rate of daily advance is that it varies according to the equation of time variables. If you don't know what the Equation of Time is, then don't worry about it for now unless you intend to actually do these charts.
If you do intend to try these charts, then you should download the free RIYAL software http://www.expreso.co.cr/centaurs/riyal.html If you do download this software, e-mail me and I'll give you the check list to set it up for this form of charting. If you download this software, set it up, and can enter chart data, then you will get the same charts that I do.
You can use my interpretive methods or your own. I prefer simple direct meanings such as those found in the Combination of Stellar Influences by Ebertin. If you start with that approach you will learn basic astrology much faster. Once you are confident and get consistent results you can go on to try any method you want or just continue to refine and add to your own skills.
Once you calculate a natal chart in Riyal you will find that Solar Return charts are amazingly easy to call up, and once you have one you can obtain a yearly listing of daily angles and any "hits" of those angles to natal, solar or daily transits. You scan down the list and find dates when clusters of hits are noted for a date. You then use your regular software to give you a transit chart for that and mark the Riyal Angles in with a marker. There's your daily chart.
In Franniees case, the first date with stuff at the angles was Nov. 25th, Thanksgiving Day here in the U.S. I called the angles and planets as they would read in any astrological book. In a separate post I noted the problems with applying standard approaches without knowing the context of the subject's life. A planet tends to have very personal nuances in its expression in one's chart. Further, the context of one's life will shape the level and the intensity of that planet's expression. It is only those who live life large where the symbols play out strongly. We who read typical normal lives don't have terrible, catastrophic and transformative explosions occur in our life every time Pluto transits an angle. Scale and common sense has to prevail.
Dave
An error in the natal chart of 12 minutes of time would move the MC about 3 degrees based on the MC moving one degree in about four minutes. That small discrepancy would reflect itself in the S/R chart as well as in the Progressed Daily Angles charts.
The daily chart's angles should be seen as "symbolic" as they are advanced at a rate that moves the MC some 450 degrees per year -- or one and a quarter circles (chart's 360 degree circle). This is the average rate of advance each day by progression. This is not to be confused with the fact that the MC, like the Sun, rotates across the meridian in a constant manner such that it appears to make a full rotation plus a degree-or-so each day --- this being in real time.
The only difference in the constant symbolic rate of daily advance is that it varies according to the equation of time variables. If you don't know what the Equation of Time is, then don't worry about it for now unless you intend to actually do these charts.
If you do intend to try these charts, then you should download the free RIYAL software http://www.expreso.co.cr/centaurs/riyal.html If you do download this software, e-mail me and I'll give you the check list to set it up for this form of charting. If you download this software, set it up, and can enter chart data, then you will get the same charts that I do.
You can use my interpretive methods or your own. I prefer simple direct meanings such as those found in the Combination of Stellar Influences by Ebertin. If you start with that approach you will learn basic astrology much faster. Once you are confident and get consistent results you can go on to try any method you want or just continue to refine and add to your own skills.
Once you calculate a natal chart in Riyal you will find that Solar Return charts are amazingly easy to call up, and once you have one you can obtain a yearly listing of daily angles and any "hits" of those angles to natal, solar or daily transits. You scan down the list and find dates when clusters of hits are noted for a date. You then use your regular software to give you a transit chart for that and mark the Riyal Angles in with a marker. There's your daily chart.
In Franniees case, the first date with stuff at the angles was Nov. 25th, Thanksgiving Day here in the U.S. I called the angles and planets as they would read in any astrological book. In a separate post I noted the problems with applying standard approaches without knowing the context of the subject's life. A planet tends to have very personal nuances in its expression in one's chart. Further, the context of one's life will shape the level and the intensity of that planet's expression. It is only those who live life large where the symbols play out strongly. We who read typical normal lives don't have terrible, catastrophic and transformative explosions occur in our life every time Pluto transits an angle. Scale and common sense has to prevail.
Dave
Minderwiz
Thanks for the response Dave. I raised the point on accurate birth times because as we know from posts in this forum, many people are unaware of their birth time - not all countries record them (England and Wales being a good example). It also becomes an issue with 'historical' births such as Tycho Brahe when even attempts to record a birth time might well produce inaccurate results because of the technology of time keeping. Much of medieval or even sixteenth/seventeenth century Astrologer's time was taken up by attempting to rectify birth times in some way. Rectification is not really something to go into here but any reading of Lilly or Morin shows the problems that were faced in terms of trying to establish birth times in those days. Lilly used something similar to a modern rectification using key dates in a person's life but did write about other methods and their efficacy.
Dave raises some very good points on the issue of planets that are 'activated' in a chart seemingly having no effect in 'real' life. This is an issue that has 'haunted' Astrology throughout its history. Context, involvement and intensity are good words to bear in mind when you are interpreting a chart.
There are other possible issues to consider as well. Much before the nineteenth century Astrologers worked for people who could afford them and those tended to be the rich and powerful, especially for those Astrologers who were important enough to write books and influence students of Astrology. The rich and powerful are much more likely to lead lives in which major events take place at 'regular' intervals.
In the present time, many influential Astrologers work with people who have psychological problems or are in some way psychologically disturbed. Just like the rich and powerful they do not lead 'typical' lives, yet some of the interpretations of the outer planets are based on their problems, just as some of the traditional interpretations were based on the rich and powerful. Dave is very right to counsel against some of the heavy interpretations given to Pluto transits (which often become self fulfilling because of the dread of them happening, rather than any real event that actually happens).
Lilly has a phrase about tempering Art with reason and this I think sums up Dave's message.
One other reason for planets seemingly not having an actutal effect is that Astrology, like most things is not subject to simple cause and effect.
Most events have a whole series of causes. Scientists make reference to necessary and sufficient causes - necessary causes must be in place for an event to happen but do not guarantee that the event will occur. Sufficient causes produce the expected event. So for an event to occur, we may need a complex of necessary causes in order to tip into sufficient cause for the event to manifest. In Astrological terms Mars at an angle may be a necessary cause for an event but may not be sufficient on it's own or even in combination with one or more other planets to produce the event. Some Astrologers operate on a rule of 3, requiring at least 3 indicators of an event happening before committing to a prediction but this is at best a rule of thumb rather than a hard and fast feature of Astrology.
This approach to multiple causes can be modified to allow for a hierarchy - some Astrologers will claim that transits won't work unless there are similar indicators from SR charts or from profections or primary directions, or other longer term method. Again I'm not aware of any 'proof' of this but it's something that chart readers should bear in mind.
I'm going to pick up the thread on predictions to look at a couple of long term methods - planetary periods an primary directions and the medium term method of profections. I've written about them before, so some of the posts will simply be a cross reference to those posts.
Dave raises some very good points on the issue of planets that are 'activated' in a chart seemingly having no effect in 'real' life. This is an issue that has 'haunted' Astrology throughout its history. Context, involvement and intensity are good words to bear in mind when you are interpreting a chart.
There are other possible issues to consider as well. Much before the nineteenth century Astrologers worked for people who could afford them and those tended to be the rich and powerful, especially for those Astrologers who were important enough to write books and influence students of Astrology. The rich and powerful are much more likely to lead lives in which major events take place at 'regular' intervals.
In the present time, many influential Astrologers work with people who have psychological problems or are in some way psychologically disturbed. Just like the rich and powerful they do not lead 'typical' lives, yet some of the interpretations of the outer planets are based on their problems, just as some of the traditional interpretations were based on the rich and powerful. Dave is very right to counsel against some of the heavy interpretations given to Pluto transits (which often become self fulfilling because of the dread of them happening, rather than any real event that actually happens).
Lilly has a phrase about tempering Art with reason and this I think sums up Dave's message.
One other reason for planets seemingly not having an actutal effect is that Astrology, like most things is not subject to simple cause and effect.
Most events have a whole series of causes. Scientists make reference to necessary and sufficient causes - necessary causes must be in place for an event to happen but do not guarantee that the event will occur. Sufficient causes produce the expected event. So for an event to occur, we may need a complex of necessary causes in order to tip into sufficient cause for the event to manifest. In Astrological terms Mars at an angle may be a necessary cause for an event but may not be sufficient on it's own or even in combination with one or more other planets to produce the event. Some Astrologers operate on a rule of 3, requiring at least 3 indicators of an event happening before committing to a prediction but this is at best a rule of thumb rather than a hard and fast feature of Astrology.
This approach to multiple causes can be modified to allow for a hierarchy - some Astrologers will claim that transits won't work unless there are similar indicators from SR charts or from profections or primary directions, or other longer term method. Again I'm not aware of any 'proof' of this but it's something that chart readers should bear in mind.
I'm going to pick up the thread on predictions to look at a couple of long term methods - planetary periods an primary directions and the medium term method of profections. I've written about them before, so some of the posts will simply be a cross reference to those posts.
franniee
I thought things were a little more black and white but I am finding it is more intuitive than I figured.
The back injury was a spinal injury and it was caused by an accident where my spine got compressed. So if I were to look back on that day I would expect to see a Saturn aspect somewhere along the line? The thing is Saturn is such a slow mover that the window of opportunity for the accident, should have been wide. Right?
Could I have been forewarned? I wonder.....the accident was very random. I was in the back of a taxi cab that hit a metal plate on the road and bucked - the car literally almost flipped tail over head! I hit the roof of the backseat and among other injuries injured my lower spine. This was completely random, this was my usual route home - I would hail a cab and go up 10th avenue. The driver wasn't driving out of control (hard to believe but true
). The weather was fine. There was no indication that something bad was coming - so I wonder if I could have been forewarned - not because I regret anything just because I want to understand.
There are big points that I can look back on and name a date and sometimes a time and I would love to see if I can see a pattern with specific aspects etc..... I am curious to find links. I do understand that hindsight will be 20:20 and predicting forward - not so much but I do believe in fate so I believe I should be able to see patterns. What do you think?
Since Saturn is strong in my chart, as it is, I would bet that it would be involved during significant times in my life. I am generally well but I have had a lot of structural injuries, I bet that is all about Saturn. Saturn/MC/Jupiter conjunction is a strong player in my chart and so is the Moon/Merc/Mars conjunction. Right?
I do understand this. Truly I do. I can't say I live life large all of the time but there have been moments. Dave picked November 25th as a day that had some important aspects. The thing is that day was an easy, warm, happy day. Nothing sparky. Yes everything played out as it should have and that is cool but I wonder if we picked a day that had an explosion or something more polar what we would see?
For instance..... my 40th birthday.....HUGE Explosions!
It is a lot to understand. I know..... but I am trying. Thank you both for being such wonderful teachers!!!!
Gotta run I am having another astrological reading. My husband thinks I am insane.
He's right. But I want to understand and sitting with this guy may help me gather more info.
The back injury was a spinal injury and it was caused by an accident where my spine got compressed. So if I were to look back on that day I would expect to see a Saturn aspect somewhere along the line? The thing is Saturn is such a slow mover that the window of opportunity for the accident, should have been wide. Right?
Could I have been forewarned? I wonder.....the accident was very random. I was in the back of a taxi cab that hit a metal plate on the road and bucked - the car literally almost flipped tail over head! I hit the roof of the backseat and among other injuries injured my lower spine. This was completely random, this was my usual route home - I would hail a cab and go up 10th avenue. The driver wasn't driving out of control (hard to believe but true
). The weather was fine. There was no indication that something bad was coming - so I wonder if I could have been forewarned - not because I regret anything just because I want to understand.There are big points that I can look back on and name a date and sometimes a time and I would love to see if I can see a pattern with specific aspects etc..... I am curious to find links. I do understand that hindsight will be 20:20 and predicting forward - not so much but I do believe in fate so I believe I should be able to see patterns. What do you think?
Since Saturn is strong in my chart, as it is, I would bet that it would be involved during significant times in my life. I am generally well but I have had a lot of structural injuries, I bet that is all about Saturn. Saturn/MC/Jupiter conjunction is a strong player in my chart and so is the Moon/Merc/Mars conjunction. Right?
Dave said:
I do understand this. Truly I do. I can't say I live life large all of the time but there have been moments.
Dave picked November 25th as a day that had some important aspects. The thing is that day was an easy, warm, happy day. Nothing sparky. Yes everything played out as it should have and that is cool but I wonder if we picked a day that had an explosion or something more polar what we would see?For instance..... my 40th birthday.....HUGE Explosions!
It is a lot to understand. I know..... but I am trying.
Thank you both for being such wonderful teachers!!!! Gotta run I am having another astrological reading. My husband thinks I am insane.
He's right. But I want to understand and sitting with this guy may help me gather more info.Minderwiz
franniee said:
Well I'd say more 'forensic' it's assembling a case based on examining and weighing the evidence and that evidence may point in different directions, so in the end it's a balance of probabilities. Applying the method, evaluating your experience and learning from examples helps produce an understanding that can work on a sub-conscious basis - intuition if you like.
franniee said:
Well, you are assuming there that it's Saturn's movement that is the trigger and that we are talking about secondary movement (through the zodiac) - it could be transiting Mars that aspected natal Saturn that was the trigger, or the indicated by a direction
However it is likely to be more complex than that - remember simple causes are very rarely translated into events, there's more likely to be several Astrological significators involved and the actual trigger for the specific event might seem trivial but it's that last 'straw' so to speak. So there might have been a Primary Direction pointing to an accident during that period, plus a combination of profections/solar arcs/secondary progressions/solar returns (take your choice) that built up to indicate that event at approximately that time.
There's also a presumption on your part that we have to be talking about a car accident on a specific date that results in spinal damage - but the indication might be less precise - simply a violent accident over a limited time period and there might have been sevral possible triggers the one that actually fired determining the nature of the event.
This means that you might be aware in advance of a possible risk of accident over a particular period and you might spend your time avoiding Mars transits of Saturn, only to find that it was a Moon to Saturn transit which was the trigger.
Some Astrologers claim to be able to be very precise all the time but to be honest I don't believe them. John Frawley had a very good run predicting football results which earned him quite a bit of fame. But eventually his run broke down. His methods may have raised the prediction to a probability well beyond pure chance but I think there's always a margin of error.
However speculation here won't help or provide a good learning experience as there are many other possible indicators which might have built up.
Perhaps you could volunteer to be a guinea pig again and we can look at some of your Planetary Periods and Primary Directions for the periods in question.
franniee said:
Well Saturn is strong in your chart but we would want to see something more particular than that, otherwise your life would be a series of 'structural' accidents on a daily basis.
Again, looking at some of the planetary periods, directions and profections will help, And I'm certainly not ruling out Solar Return and Dave's methods as identifying such periods (or indeed other techniques).
franniee
Thanks Minderwiz.
I know I am trying to simplify it way more than it can be. I do understand this - it's kind of how my left brain works.
I just got back from my appt and he did his predictions using a progressed chart with transits. I got to ask a bunch of questions. I am putting the pieces of this puzzle together - it's just that it is a HUGE puzzle with tiny tiny pieces.
He actually attributed the taxi accident to a Uranus moon direct conjunction. He seemed to really concentrate on Uranus with the accidents. I guess I can understand that. He said that at that moment of the accident transiting mars was squaring pluto and saturn opposing mars at the same degree of my mars 16degrees. Of course this was a very quick look and he said he would have preferred a little more time to look at it very carefully but this was for me to just get an idea. Very interesting.... so like you guys said it is far more complex than I was making it.
Another factor that should be brought up is the astrologer. How they see the chart. What is their outlook on life etc. The first person who read my chart a couple of weeks ago had a very optimistic approach. This fellow today is sober. That colors the way they both interpret the chart - in my opinion. I understand they both used different techniques but leave that be for a moment. He is dark. Physically as well as emotionally. That is why I hesitated going back to him. I prefer to view the world from light..... when all is DARK and bleak I will find that ray of light as tiny as it may be and move toward it until I get into it! We discussed the earlier reading and he said she was being overly optimistic. Of course he would say that in part it's his disposition. He saw the transit that she probably focused on and while he mentioned it earlier, as well, he didn't paint a rosy picture.
BTW I will be a guinea pig anytime you guys want.
I know I am trying to simplify it way more than it can be.
I do understand this - it's kind of how my left brain works. I just got back from my appt and he did his predictions using a progressed chart with transits. I got to ask a bunch of questions. I am putting the pieces of this puzzle together - it's just that it is a HUGE puzzle with tiny tiny pieces.
He actually attributed the taxi accident to a Uranus moon direct conjunction. He seemed to really concentrate on Uranus with the accidents. I guess I can understand that. He said that at that moment of the accident transiting mars was squaring pluto and saturn opposing mars at the same degree of my mars 16degrees. Of course this was a very quick look and he said he would have preferred a little more time to look at it very carefully but this was for me to just get an idea. Very interesting.... so like you guys said it is far more complex than I was making it.
Another factor that should be brought up is the astrologer. How they see the chart. What is their outlook on life etc. The first person who read my chart a couple of weeks ago had a very optimistic approach. This fellow today is sober. That colors the way they both interpret the chart - in my opinion. I understand they both used different techniques but leave that be for a moment. He is dark. Physically as well as emotionally. That is why I hesitated going back to him. I prefer to view the world from light..... when all is DARK and bleak I will find that ray of light as tiny as it may be and move toward it until I get into it! We discussed the earlier reading and he said she was being overly optimistic. Of course he would say that in part it's his disposition. He saw the transit that she probably focused on and while he mentioned it earlier, as well, he didn't paint a rosy picture.
BTW I will be a guinea pig anytime you guys want.
Minderwiz
Yes modern Astrologers will tend to attribute accidents to Uranus because the appear to be 'sudden' add in Mars for violent and you get the symbolism. As I operate from a traditional approach I can't use that LOL. Mutual application would be the traditional definition of sudden.
You are quite right, the temperament of the Astrologer influences the reading. Now I keep mentioning that Dave and I approach Astrology from different directions but we do tend to have a similar temperament in terms of our approach, which I think is a Saturnine one. We both like structures, analysis, following our own rules, using Astrological authorities and being careful in our delineations. I suspect that we both see Mercury as the ruler of Astrology, not that mad and unpredictable scientist Uranus. Mercury is the planet of reason, careful communication and mathematics.
OK, I'll start the next leg of the predictions thread tomorrow.
You are quite right, the temperament of the Astrologer influences the reading. Now I keep mentioning that Dave and I approach Astrology from different directions but we do tend to have a similar temperament in terms of our approach, which I think is a Saturnine one. We both like structures, analysis, following our own rules, using Astrological authorities and being careful in our delineations. I suspect that we both see Mercury as the ruler of Astrology, not that mad and unpredictable scientist Uranus. Mercury is the planet of reason, careful communication and mathematics.
OK, I'll start the next leg of the predictions thread tomorrow.
