Which of the modern decks has more historical authenticity?

I've been looking around for an appropriate tarot deck to examine for my term paper. The dictionary of symbols I am using (Cirlot 1973) makes positive references to Oswald Wirth, while discrediting The Thoth-Hermes decks. Through google, I've noticed that the Wirth deck seems heavily based on the Marseilles deck (and is somewhat clearer visually).

Does anyone have a better deck to suggest? Is the Wirth deck a nice balance between readability and historical accuracy? Are there major problems with the Wirth?

Thanks all

Nick

Editions de l'Aigle Le Tarot de Oswald Wirth
is the proper representative of this fine deck:

http://www.chez.com/alkast/wirth_jeu_1927.html

Bearing in mind that a youthful Wirth was inspired
by his enthusiastic companion, Stanislas de Gauita,
the few qabalistic flourishes may be understandable.

undergraduatenick said:

I've been looking around for an appropriate tarot deck to examine for my term paper.

Click to expand...

Nick, what course is it and what is the term paper orientation? These factors may affect the deck suggested.

The dictionary of symbols I am using (Cirlot 1973) makes positive references to Oswald Wirth, while discrediting The Thoth-Hermes decks.

Click to expand...

So does Jean Chevalier/Alain Gheerbrant's symbolism dictionary (translated from the French into English under the title The Penguin Dictionary of Symbols).

Through google, I've noticed that the Wirth deck seems heavily based on the Marseilles deck (and is somewhat clearer visually).

Click to expand...

If you decide to go with the Wirth deck (and even if you decide to go with a Marseilles deck), be sure to check out Wirth's book Le tarot des imagiers du Moyen-Âge, translated into English as Tarot of the Magicians.

"excerpts"

Rusty Neon said:

If you decide to go with the Wirth deck (and even if you decide
to go with a Marseilles deck), be sure to check out Wirth's book
Le tarot des imagiers du Moyen-Âge, translated into English as
Tarot of the Magicians.

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Le Tarot des Imagiers du Moyen-Âge

http://www.chez.com/alkast/
Interprétation kabbalistique d'après Oswald Wirth

Symbolisme
D'après Oswald Wirth:

Une synthèse éclairante sur la Philosophie Hermétique et ses Symboles
Une définition de l'Androgyne
Le Tarot des Imagiers du Moyen-Âge d'un point de vue kabbalistique
Le Symbolisme des vingt-deux clefs de la sapience secrète du Moyen-Âge
La Consultation des Tarots

A helpful deck for comparative purposes is the modern recreation:
Le Tarot de Marseille by Alexandre Jodorowsky and Philippe Camoin

http://www.camoin.com/en/look/look.asp

NOTE: This is the new link to the 22 Major Arcana cards.

Here's a suggestion or two

..the term paper might state,

"For his time, Oswald Wirth spent most of his adult years trying to refine his early Marseilles-based experiment and also encode what he learned of esoteric teachings from his circle in the 22 majors.

The link Fulgour gave you was one version of Oswald Wirth's tarot and its a very pretty one. It's probably the correct one and only has 22 plates.

Here's a link to a discussion of someone who found a copy of the pretty one, probably an antique version:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=31751&page=1

The one many Americans get look like the one below:

http://www.learntarot.com/osdesc.htm

Or some Europeans not able to get the pretty version available in France or Quebec, they also have to get this same one:

http://www.trigono.com/tarots/TA02TAOW.htm

I haven't been able to buy the correct and pretty 22 majors version! But when I do, I would pop into Marseilles variations and see what one would be good to compare it with. I like odd Marseilles variations though, my only one that seems to agree with Marseilles fans here seems to be the one that you can get at discount (the book that comes with the set is not historical, it's based on the authors reading style. The cards are what the historical Marseilles fans say is okay):

http://www.tarotpassages.com/TarotSet-mf.htm

You have a great theme of just working with a French Marseilles and these online images of an Oswald Wirth deck to check the design differences with your symbolic dictionary. I might suggest that Mary Katherine Greer had once called the Marseilles-Milanese historical decks as "The Continental Tarots" as a regional outgrowth, as opposed to the "English School" which includes "Golden Dawn Occult" decks.

I am guessing you might truly enjoy focusing on the strengths of the Continental Tarots designs and Oswald Wirth's variations.

I don't know if I could discredit the "Thoth-Hermes" decks of the twentieth or twenti-first century in the long run or in my own opinion-- because I believe the strength of the design variations in the minors led to a brilliant revival of interest in tarot as a whole.

My best wishes on your work, whatever form you choose to focus on. My opinions might not be helpful--I am hoping my suggestions might be.

Cerulean

The beauty of considering the Wirth deck for a term paper is that is comes prior to the plethora of decks arising in the 20th century, and is itself influential in their development. At the same time, Wirth himself has written materials easily accessible.

A comparison to both earlier decks such as the Marseille will quickly illustrate where and how Wirth begins to not only deviate, but shows both originality and leanings to esoteric considerations from both E. Levi and de Guaita.

Best wishes for the paper...

Thanks for everyone's help. After going to 5 or 6 stores that sold tarot decks, I ultimately bought a replica of the 1930 Paul marteau edition of the Marseilles deck.

The names are in french (I am francophone so no problems there) but have already noticed discrepencies between this deck and the descriptions in the dictionary of symbols I'm using at the moment (Cirlot).

I'm having a blast already.

I am taking a third year Anthropology (my major) course called Culture and Symbol.

For those of you wondering what exactly my project is, it's not exactly a term paper. The prof wants us to keep an observations journal on a subject, to be handed in at the end of the term. On the right-handed pages, we jot down our own comments, observations etc, and on the left pages, back up our claims and discoveries with scholarly sources. So I'm approaching every major arcana card and trying to exctract as much of the symbolism as possible.

One useful reference (to which your own reflections would of course be welcomingly added) are the threads in the Marseille section, each locatable via the Marseille Forum Table of Contents.

undergraduatenick said:

For those of you wondering what exactly my project is, it's not exactly a term paper. The prof wants us to keep an observations journal on a subject, to be handed in at the end of the term. On the right-handed pages, we jot down our own comments, observations etc, and on the left pages, back up our claims and discoveries with scholarly sources. So I'm approaching every major arcana card and trying to exctract as much of the symbolism as possible.

Click to expand...

Wow, what an interesting project to work on! If you have the Marteau TdM, then the Jean Chevalier and Alain Gheerbrant classic Dictionnaire des Symboles (in French or English) already mentioned by Rusty Neon uses that deck. Its bibliography is very rich too. You might also want to have a look at books that study specifically the symbolism used by the imagiers of the romance and gothic periods.