Your take on reading for a third person : ethical or not ?

I *try* not to do third party readings where the querant isn't involved in some way. If querant is A - but asking about how X feels about Y - either because they want a relationship with X or because they want to tell Y about how awful X is....that's a nope. However, if A is a really good friend or brother/sister of Y and sees that they are being negatively affected by their relationship with X and want to figure out the best way to support/help Y - I'm ok with that.

I also have "blanket" ok's from some people to do readings regarding them for practice - but I'm not super intrusive into their personal thoughts and feelings. I might pull a daily card for them, do a weekly read like I sometimes do for myself, or do a kind of "progress report" (that they want) on an incremental basis (bi-weekly for instance) on a specific ongoing situation.

There are just some things I don't like doing readings about, 3rd party or not - so I just avoid them altogether.

I was just thinking that, because I don't ask my clients to tell me in advance what question or subject they want answers about, they could very well be asking about a third party and I would never know. All I advise them to do is concentrate on the question or subject while they shuffle the deck. Then, between us, we "dial in" what the cards are saying in ways that make sense to the querent without really touching on the specifics of toward whom and in what way the answers are pointing. So I never have an ethical dilemma because I don't have enough information to postulate one. Even when the client reveals bits of the background during our dialogue, it hasn't been enough to warrant concern. They think their own thoughts, make peace with their private gods or demons, and go on their way.

Sulis said:

This is how I think of it.. Ethics aside, I just don't think cards or card readers are very good at reading the mind of someone who isn't there, often someone who the querant hasn't seen or had any contact with in ages (if they're reading about an ex).
Asking what someone feels about you or what someone thinks about you also assumes that they do think about you or do have feelings for you and if it's an ex, as it often is with this type of thing, they may have moved on and not be thinking or feeling about you at all.

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Yes - and if you say you think they aren't thinking about you, it usually annoys. It is a "second-guessing" sort of question, and I don't do them partly for that reason.

Sulis said:

I think that we can only change or control ourselves so it's best to keep ourselves as the focus of the reading. You can still see other people in the reading but the focus needs to be on the querant and that has nothing to do with ethics.

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This last, very much. What's the point of asking how he feels about you - you can't change it, even if the cards clearly showed it.

That said - I am one of those who doesn't like to do third party readings. It does feel intrusive, to me. I'd actually include the child in school situation here. I MIGHT read on how I can help him find his way in school, or how I can help him be the happiest he can be there. If a reader told me he was miserable - the only way I could progress that would be to ask him what's up - and if he hadn't chosen to talk before, why would he start now ?

My goal in doing readings is empowerment of the Querent. "Is John in love with me?" and "Is Joe thinking about me?" type questions aren't empowering for the person asking them. I would flip those questions to be "What can I do to help John to fall in love with me?" and "What can I do to make Joe think more (or better) about me?" as they empower the Querent and give them steps to achieve their ultimate goal.

Rodney

rwcarter said:

My goal in doing readings is empowerment of the Querent. "Is John in love with me?" and "Is Joe thinking about me?" type questions aren't empowering for the person asking them. I would flip those questions to be "What can I do to help John to fall in love with me?" and "What can I do to make Joe think more (or better) about me?" as they empower the Querent and give them steps to achieve their ultimate goal.

Rodney

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That's how I see it too. Give them something they can actively work with, not just try to satisfy their idle curiosity. It seems to me what they're really after when asking "What does Joe feel/think about me?" is "Does Joe like (or love) me?" but they're afraid they won't like the answer. They can kind of slide around it the other way.

gregory said:

Yes - and if you say you think they aren't thinking about you, it usually annoys. It is a "second-guessing" sort of question, and I don't do them partly for that reason.

This last, very much. What's the point of asking how he feels about you - you can't change it, even if the cards clearly showed it.

That said - I am one of those who doesn't like to do third party readings. It does feel intrusive, to me. I'd actually include the child in school situation here. I MIGHT read on how I can help him find his way in school, or how I can help him be the happiest he can be there. If a reader told me he was miserable - the only way I could progress that would be to ask him what's up - and if he hadn't chosen to talk before, why would he start now ?

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I realize after all the years of this topic being discussed, you are firmly entrenched in your position, but how would it be intrusive to ask about how your own child was feeling at school lately? Explain how, and since we are using a word like intrusive, which carries a negative connotation, what harm do you feel it would actually cause? I've already stated, any info I might come up with through a reading wouldn't be used in any official capacity, so let's not create scenarios in which I or any other parent barges into school, saying things like, I know my Billy was picked on this week due to a tarot reading!

If I saw cards indicating upset, strife, defensiveness, failure, it might just let me in on how things are going. If I saw positive cards, it could also help me to be less stressed out and not as quick to assume the worst. Either way, it could lead me to figuring out how to talk with my child about the things he struggles with in a school setting. There's also something to be said about not being blindsided by terrible reports from school that my kid did this that or the other. The only way I could see this as intrusive would be if I believed Tarot worked like a CCTV camera or perhaps like hiring a private detective to dig deeply into computer history or just straight up following and spying on the third party in question. I'd just like an explanation, based on the reality of what tarot can actually do[/b], rather than on incongruent comparisons and hyperbole.

I would find it intrusive for someone to do a reading about me without permission, just as I would be if someone tried to intrude on my life in any other way. How would you feel?

Ahhh this subject divides readers in such a major way!

Third party or not, I feel that ethics and intrusiveness has already been compromised the second we begin flipping cards, so to me there's no ethically safe point to stop at. I'm a firm believer in doing my best to provide *possibilities* to my sitters with questions they have. If their quest is for me to help them "dig" for gold, we are going as deep as we can until we hit something hard. There's no benefit to my sitter if I say to them that we are going to dig for the treasure they seek but we can only dig sideways.

Zephyros said:

This question has popped up before, although I can't find any threads right now. Still, my take is that there's no problem with it, and I do it indiscriminately, even on things that don't concern me. Were Tarot as effective as hidden camera I wouldn't, but it isn't so I don't consider it snooping at all.

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Me too.

Fortune-telling/divining is thousands of years old. I can't imagine what the result would have been if Napoleon and Josephine were to have been told "I won't read for you about that. It's not ethical. It's a third party reading."

We don't live in a vacuum. It's not possible to keep totally to the sitter to avoid third, fourth and even fifth or more parties when you read cards for others. If you use the cards to give advice or to empower, you're still reading on others besides the sitter because you're saying "this is what will work to make your boss consider you for a promotion"---this is getting into the boss's head (third party)or "if you do this, you'll have more success in your romantic life" (multiple others) you're predicting what others will probably do if she follows the advice you give and that gets into the heads of other people as well.

When reading for others, I can't help but be telling the future because everything not in the present moment is either past or future.

It's alright to do whatever you feel you can do while still feeling you're true to your personal ethics, though. My way isn't everyone's way. If I'm not supposed to know something from the cards drawn, then I won't be seeing it.

I read professionally and I read on pretty much whatever the sitter wants to know. There are a few situations where I'll redirect the question toward something more productive for the sitter. Like, if a person wants me to read about what's going on in somebody else's marriage or relationship because they're involved in a love triangle, I don't feel like that's okay to read about. I don't make judgments about the sitter for being in the triangle, but I don't think it's my place to read about the marriage of the person they're involved with. I've been asked that question quite a few times.

headincloud said:

I would find it intrusive for someone to do a reading about me without permission, just as I would be if someone tried to intrude on my life in any other way. How would you feel?

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It depends on how we define "intruding in any other way" into one's life, I'd think. You can intrude in the middle of the night into someone's home while they slept, that's pretty intrusive. We could plant hidden cameras in their home, that's also very intrusive. Wondering how your child's week at school was going and using cards to do so? I'd prefer to use a word whose meaning actually jibed with the reality of that scenario, rather than one as ill fitting as "intrusive".

Honestly, if someone chose to read about me, without my permission, I'd be more curious about what they thought they "saw" than bothered that they did it. I'd also very likely laugh a bit, wondering why on earth they'd want to read about me? I'm just not that interesting. Of course, if they said they saw my husband and I doing x,y and z in our bedroom last night, I'd be incredibly impressed and change my tune on third party readings. At the same time, I'd now have someone whose reading skills I'd trust for the odd occasions I ever ask another person for a reading. In a way, that would be a win win.