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Vinculus  Vinculus is offline
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In the Sepher Yetzirah, the Alef is referred to as a breath of air which reconciles water and fire.

“Now air is considered a reconciler between water and fire, which is why the Pillar of Mildness is attributed to air. Then Malkuth, which holds a sort of special status on the tree as being the receptacle of all the energies of those that came before, is attributed to earth, and earth is also the receptacle of the three other elements.”

http://slcgddiscussion.blogspot.com/...ral-triad.html
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Abrac  Abrac is offline
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Vinculus, to be honest, having never seen the Waite-Trinick I wasn't exactly following what you were saying, but I finally found them here:

http://www.britishmuseum.org/researc...25678&partId=1

I see exactly what you're saying now. Here's a picture of The World for those who haven't seen it.

Trinick World

It's hard to say exactly what Waite had in mind, but if you assume he kept the traditional correspondences, some interesting things come to light.

Air = North
Earth = South
Fire = East
Water = West

Air and Earth oppose one another, as do Fire and Water. The whole picture is balanced. The N-S axis corresponds to the middle pillar. The other two could correspond to the other pillars. The Lion falls on the pillar of mercy and the Eagle is on that of severity. But if the orientation is reversed to match that of the woman, the pillar of mercy (right hand) would correspond to Water and the pillar of severity (left hand) to Fire.

In his introduction to the first edition of The Golden Dawn, Regardie, describing the grade of Theoricus says:

"The Kerubim are described in that ritual as the presidents of the elemental forces, the vivified powers of the letters of the Tatragammaton operating in the elements."

and,

"It is always through the power and authority and symbols of the Kerub that the elemental spirits and their rulers are invoked."

I tend to think Waite would have kept the GD elemental correspondences though he's arranged them somewhat differently. Waite rewrote the rituals when he became head of the GD, but to what extend he changed the details I don't know.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abrac View Post
.....But if the orientation is reversed to match that of the woman, the pillar of mercy (right hand) would correspond to Water and the pillar of severity (left hand) to Fire........
Which is how Waite depicted the outer pillars of the Tree with respect to the Adam Kadmon in The Holy Kabbalah,. http://mattstone.blogs.com/photos/es...resagrada.html
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinculus View Post
In the Sepher Yetzirah, the Alef is referred to as a breath of air which reconciles water and fire.
Yes, as I said, that is a system of 3 elements ... the same as is in the Tarot Trumps ... where there is no obvious Earth element ( that isnt a card doing 'double-duty')
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinculus View Post
“Now air is considered a reconciler between water and fire, which is why the Pillar of Mildness is attributed to air. Then Malkuth, which holds a sort of special status on the tree as being the receptacle of all the energies of those that came before, is attributed to earth, and earth is also the receptacle of the three other elements.”
And I dont say the above because of just what it says here ... there are many other examples from many traditions and examples in nature. I think that is a restrictive or 'only one way' of explaining it. When the three are set up (in the triangle) the triangle itself becomes Earth. Or, as sometimes depicted earth is a 'pendant' to it, or 'generated' from it (as in alchemical symbol for sulphur ). The other principle of three that is within it is that it generated from 1 in the first place so it still contains that ; 'Centrum in centri trigono ' - the eye in the triangle; “The World deluded by these Three Gunas does not know Me: Who is beyond these Gunas and imperishable.”


Its probably too obvious to mention but ... the top of the ToL has this symbol, it is then reflected upside down, then again to make a triple triplicity and Malkuth hangs like a pendant from the last triangle.

It looks like the arrangement in question

The four is something different again and here fire comes first , one set of 'workings' acts by the tarot arrangement : Fire water air earth ... but another (in the old Hermetic concept of Spheres and {in some respects} the modern one of 'specific gravity' - which are basically the same except the ancients saw the Earth as the centre {of everything and hence attraction} but nowadays we realise everything has a centre of attraction) arrangement is fire air water earth.

Four is as in this .... and ... seasonal attributions could relate to this (if not locality)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fo...esentation.svg

IMO the SENSIBLE ordering of the elements in different ways relate to different processes ... a bit like the variation in Egyptian God forms due to, not just time and locality but to describe variation of function (even though they are are all talking about the same thing) ... not that one is right or the other wrong eg; The Hermopolitan Ogdoad (manifesting in four pairs generated by duality) and the 'Solar Triad' (Sopdet, Ra, Khepri - in a downward triangle - a pair generates a unity) both seem to be an expression of the World of Manu and respectively describing Formation and Fluctuation. In the world of Aakhut the Memphite and Esna Triads ( both down triangles) : articulation and construction. Yet, following the model in the world of Rostau, the Heliopolitan Ennead (9) starts with 1 (Augmentation) and the Funerary Quarternary is (of course) 4 square and represents sublimation. Describing principles within the concepts of the World of Ament all are triangular relationships (upward pointing - generated from 1 , not a pair) ; Theban Triad - Differentiation, Initiatory Triad - Domination, Cyclic Triad - Separation . It's not as if one is wrong because it says Atum is the creator while in another part and time of Egypt it was Neit and Khnum.

I know the Australian Aboriginals have a similar system ... if one says Biame is the creator and another says it is Wallengie ( and both had totally different stories - ie. its not just a name variation) they dont say each is right or wrong ... many non-aboriginals dont get this ... we tend to see in black and white: right and wrong.

Anyway ... rave, rave ... perhaps in this case this was what the arrangement signified, assuming it was made with knowledge ( I think the aboriginals and Egyptians knew more about this (elemental ordering concepts) than us or even the Medieval Hermeticists.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LRichard View Post
Which is how Waite depicted the outer pillars of the Tree with respect to the Adam Kadmon in The Holy Kabbalah,. http://mattstone.blogs.com/photos/es...resagrada.html
So ... 'you' become the figure in World card ? Well my feet are on earth ... my head is in air

< Looks at left and right hands> ... hmmm ... that doesnt help ... one has 'hospital' tatooed over one set of knuckles and 'morgue' over the other
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Vinculus  Vinculus is offline
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Thank you for this, Abrac.

This resolves a question I had asked on another site vis-à-vis a statement from Paul Hughes-Barlow who, in his book “Tarot and the Magus,” writes:

“The Golden Dawn elemental attributions for the directions are: 1. North, Air, 2. East, Fire, 3. South, Earth, 4. West, Water.”

In his online article, “New Views on Enochian Magic,” Hughes-Barlow also writes:

“Air should be in the North, Water in the West, Earth in South, and Fire in the East. This order is actually the same as in the Tablet of Union.”

I sought corroboration for this view because it is the same arrangement of the elements as was taught me by my (Franco-Hungarian) tarot teacher over thirty years ago. Unfortunately at the time, she never elaborated on it, so I was surprised to find it referenced in Hughes-Barlow as well as (apparently) on the Trinick World card.

It all seems to make sense now. Thirty years later, of course.
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The Universe doesn't have compass directions, nor does a human being. If they are metaphorical, it seems a poor choice of terminology.

Sometimes Hughes-Barlow's information seems about as reliable as Payne-Towler's. I think the Golden Dawn's elemental attributions for the directions is the same as that of Ptolemy's Tetrabiblos, but I could be mistaken, of course.
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Vinculus  Vinculus is offline
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No compass directions? I beg to differ. I thought everyone knew that the Restaurant at the End of the Universe is East of the Garden of Eden.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LRichard View Post
Which is how Waite depicted the outer pillars of the Tree with respect to the Adam Kadmon in The Holy Kabbalah,. http://mattstone.blogs.com/photos/es...resagrada.html
It's true, Waite oriented his deck to be structured from the "inside out," so to speak. That is shown by the positions of the Fool and the Magician, and totally blew my mind when I gave it some thought. If I recall there was a thread about it, or maybe I'm wrong.

ETA: Ah, yes, of course there was a thread, mine.
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Quote:
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No compass directions? I beg to differ. I thought everyone knew that the Restaurant at the End of the Universe is East of the Garden of Eden.
Mixed locality metaphor isnt that ?

Besides, we now know the location of 'Paradise' / Garden of Eden .... closer to the Pamirs region of Tajikistan, east of the Chinese Xinjaing Uygur Autonomous Region of far western China than the end of the Universe.

http://www.heritageinstitute.com/zor...s/location.htm

@ Airyana Vaeja as Paradise. Shambhala / Shangri-La
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