Lying

morphine

has anyone faced with the fallout of a situation with a person who has lies and manipulates to such a point that it becomes impossible for the person on the receiving end to function?

I have reviewed this person's natal chart many a time - he's a relative, and has an unfavorable Mercury-Neptune aspect......because i have struggled to grasp as to why he's gone so far, its now clear to me that, something much greater than this-or-that aspect or sign.
but his harshness (putting it very lightly) and cold way of maneuvering has put the family close to rock bottom.

if someone, astrologically knowledgeable could please assist with his upcoming transits? Just looking for a little clarification with this horrifically hard time.
 

dadsnook2000

Question

I'm sure you have chart data to go along with this questions.
 

Ronia

I'm a bit lost, what ks the question? Some people are just more into lying and manipulating than others. As you noticed, it may be the natal promise. Some are willing to work and improve, others embrace the natal promise, positive or negative, and keep going on like that all life. Do you expect a cnange? Is that what you're looking for? I doubt a transit or two would bring it if the person is not consciously willing to change. From what you share, it doesn't look like it.

Anyhow, what are we looking for?

Also, progressions may be helpful.

Just took a quick look at the chart. He is Cancerian with square of the Sun to its ruler, the Moon, in the 1st. The Moon itself is a very unsteady influence. People often forget that. She is ever changing and in the first, it may make a person a bit manipulative as it expects the others, then7th, to reflect her ever changing nature. With a square to the Sun and Sun in Cancer, this influence gets stronger. But I'll look closer later. It's a beautiful chart, though, like a diamond. .
 

dadsnook2000

Observations

n/Mercury opposite n/Neptune can be prone to lying if other conditions support this practice. The placement of n/Saturn makes a T-square pattern which suggests one who is prone to dark thoughts, harsh judgments and a pessimistic view of life. (I'm nuancing the possible interpretations to fit your question)

Now, the n/Moon is in the opening square to the n/Sun. This suggests one who struggles to find their way in life, a path that breaks from the traditions of the family. This often leaves one with a chip on their shoulder, so to speak, but not necessarily a bad attitude. Typically they are strivers, although a bit rought around the edges.

With n/Venus opposite n/Pluto we have a possibly tough aspect to deal with. One's sense of balance and harmony in life seems to be up against a wall. Threats everywhere of one sort or another.

The Asc. and MC ruler is Mercury. Since Mercury opposes Neptune, noted above, we might give this some emphasis. How will self deceiption and imagination work with all of these other tough aspects? There are too many hard aspects. It might be easier for this person to just retreat into a world of their own creation rather than deal with five issues at once on a constant basis. Yes, there are trines and sextiles in this chart, but one gets the sense that the hard aspects seem to shape the perceptions of life, and the easy aspects open the door to avoidance.

These are just some quick observations. I'll wait until you can share some context on this persons life and personality before adding anything else. This should be enough to get you started in understanding this person. In the end, to answer your question, lying may be part of a solution to being overwhelmed by life, by being jealous or feeling threatened by what seems to be 'too-much-life.'
 

Minderwiz

He's seventeen and a half, so lying is something that is not uncommon in male teenagers who feel (no matter how unreasonably) their newly achieved independence and privacy is being threatened. So first of all it's probably a 'phase' rather than something inherent.

I had to do some reverse engineering to find his approximate natal details, because I use different methods than those expected by astro.com, et al.

His is a day chart which makes Mars, the planet that is likely to cause the most difficulty. Mars is squaring his Ascendant, in a dominant square (in the order of signs). That suggests that he's a prickly sort of character (though there are other factors which might overcome this). Mercury rules not only his Ascendant but also his tenth, where Mars is located but Mercury is not placed well, being just inside the twelfth house (I use whole sign houses) and is averse to the Ascendant. That suggests that (at least initially) he has some difficulties finding his direction in life. Furthermore, Mercury is squared by Saturn in Taurus. This too is a dominating Square. Saturn isn't a major threat in a day chart but it does indicate difficulties and things that can be surmounted through effort. The Saturn/Mercury square makes him defensive and perhaps wanting to exclude the outside world if he sees it as intruding.

The squares from Mars to the Ascendant and Saturn to the Ascendant Ruler, which itself is badly placed, are the key indicators of difficulty in his chart.

Given Mercury's natural rulership of communications and that it can be a 'trickster' I think we have clear indications of lying, from these aspects (this, as Dave points out above is nuanced to your description of the situation, there are other meanings and manifestations that are possible).

There is hope and quite a bit of it. Jupiter is the benefic of sect (most helpful or rewarding planet in his chart). Jupiter is angular in the Seventh and is in it's own sign of Pisces. It rules his Lot of Fortune (in Sagittarius) and whilst it squares Mars, it is in the dominating position. So he can overcome his Mars tendencies but that won't necessarily happen automatically. That being said, he's only just on the verge of adulthood, and he's a lot to learn.

One last general point, Mercury rules his Lot of Spirit which is in Gemini and so co-present with Mars. Fortune indicates the 'slings and arrows' he will face from life (factors outside his control). He looks likely to be quite fortunate in these.

Spirit indicates his ability to assert himself over those factors and take control of his life. That sadly is rather weak. I think he's likely to be someone who does well in life, not so much by his own efforts but by being in the right place at the right time. If he uses some of his positives, he can be quite charming and attractive. The issue is whether he's going to be able to do that.

OK, so much for the generalities. Were you looking for something more specific?
 

morphine

A huge thank you to dadsnook2000, Ronia and Minderwiz for your helpful inputs.
 

Minderwiz

Context

Thanks for the detailed backgound, it helps a lot.

From my cursory reading I noted that Mars squared his Ascendant and Saturn squared his Ascendant ruler. What I didn't explicitly mention was that in my Whole Sign chart, Saturn sits in the ninth house. Among other things the ninth signifies higher education (many modern Astrologer treat this as beyond primary education). So his education could (and from your description 'was;) affected adversely. Saturn also rules his fifth house which again, amongst other things, is associated with short term romance, affairs, and sexual encounters. Saturn naturally represents older people (often but not exclusively men) so a romance with an older woman which has an adverse effect on him (Saturn square his Ascendant ruler) fits with your description.

Mars his key problem planet lies in his tenth house of career. Your description shows that his career prospects are indeed suffering (something I would not normally have picked as a primary meaning at his age).

Incidentally Venus, a natural significator of relationships is co-present with Mars. Venus rules his ninth house - his education. Venus, when in poor condition, is also associated with overindulgence and 'pleasures', which includes drunkeness and drug taking. Again this isn't something I would take as a primary meaning, without your background information

Your information helps to tie down specific planetary significations in his chart. The next thing would be to see if the trends in your description will continue for any length of time from now.