Planet Series: The SUN & Mercury

wizzle

States of consciousness

For those of you who are familiar with the various states of consciousness, I thought I'd offer the following equivalences:

Sun = alpha/theta state
Mercury = beta
Moon = lower theta/delta

or qabalistically

Sun = Neschamah
Mercury = Rauch
Moon = Nephesch/G'uph

This is strictly my own idea and may not be valid, but it does seem to fit fairly well.
 

squeakmo9

My Mercury is 16 degrees tau and Sun 18 degrees tau so I am also in "Combust", Mercury being behind the Sun by 2 degrees.
When I look on my chart, I see under Mercury..."Dist"- 14 and "Speed"-129' 8".
Is that 129hours and 8 minutes?
Is that really slow??
Since I have a "Combust", would that also put me in the Domingo, Marlon combo, Dave?
 

dadsnook2000

For squeakmo9

Your daily motion, at time of birth, for Mercury is just over 2 degrees -- very fast. Your in there with Katheryn Hepburn, Pope John Paul and Placido Domingo. This isn't to say that you act well, pray well or sing well, but there are other attributes that may occur to you. A drive for excellence, achievement, doing the best you can, etc. Let us know what your thoughts are. Dave
 

squeakmo9

dadsnook2000 said:
Your in there with Katheryn Hepburn, Pope John Paul and Placido Domingo. This isn't to say that you act well, pray well or sing well,
LOL! Well said Dave, all true.

dadsnook2000 said:
but there are other attributes that may occur to you. A drive for excellence, achievement, doing the best you can, etc. Let us know what your thoughts are. Dave

Funny, the other day a customer of mine was speaking to me about Placido Domingo (she has season tix to the Met) and how he seems to overwork himself to the point of exhaustion. She said he not only sings at the Met but conducts and is also associated with another opera place on the West coast. Sometimes it irks her that he'll to Don Juan or was it that other Don with the windmills and then fly out to Los Angeles, do something there then come back to NY and be too ill to perform. The guy is about 70 y.o. Crazy?!
Mercury wise, he is a world traveler as are Pope John and I guess to a certain extent K. Hepburn.
I made only one, but very important trip in my life and that was to this country(USA)...it changed my life, forever. I also manage to travel with my mind, by way of inner journeys having to do with the esoteric.
Ms. Hepburn seems to possess an unorthodox way of thinking, expressed in her lifestyle preference. She seemed to be easily intrigued and enamored by the usual traits in others, her relationship with Howard Hughes, Spencer Tracy. She took a more masculine role in thought and lifestyle, doing just about anything she well wanted. For someone who appeared to be so “different”, she somehow always remained the “same”.
I find that the men I do attract all possess a keen mind and even sharper wit, which I admire and envy at the same time. My lifestyle is plain and quiet, I do feel more comfortable being “initiator”, try to be more assertive than aggressive, and feel VERY comfortable in pants. LOL!
Both Pope John and Kathryn Hepburn were great communicators, so that being said, good listeners as well. They had an ability to draw people in via there mode of expression. Something for everyone to relate to.
Communication is a big thing for me, I don’t know how I would function in this world without the ability to speak or write. It is the one thing I feel I can offer, like, it’s an asset for me…not being a raging beauty or brainiac…I feel safe being able to express my being through my mind. Sounds weird, doesn’t it??? Not sure if I explained that right, anyway…
Mr. Domingo, being a great tenor, can integrate passion, sadness, disillusion with every aria he performs, regardless of the language.
I, given enough concentration, can make someone feel my emotions through words and convey to the listener my sincerity.
Am I on the right track Dave?
 

rcb30872

Sorry for my total ignorance, but I have been thinking about this, but how are you supposed to calculate whatever we are supposed to be calculating? I have come back to this thread on quite a few occasions, and it does not matter how many times I read what has been written I am none the wiser!!!

Bec
 

dadsnook2000

For rcb30872

It is really quite simple. We have a little planet that orbits so close to the Sun that it move fast, is hard to see, and never gets very far away from the Sun so as to be able to make any aspects such as those we see with the outer planets (Mars, Jupiter and beyond). The only things we can determine about this little planet is that it is sometimes on one side of the Sun for several weeks, then on the other side of the Sun for several weeks and inbetween its either behind or infront of the Sun where it can't be seen.

So, what can we make of this fast moving rock? Does its apparent speed mean anything? Does its position near, behind or ahead of the Sun mean anything? How can we tell what these mean, if they mean anything?

We find the charts of a bunch of well known people, determine where in the scale of position and scale of speed they are, then we compare us (those on the list who participate) with them and see what common traits we might have.

To join in you have to determine how many degrees there are between your Sun and your Mercury at birth, as well as whether you are ahead in terms of zodiac sign/degree, behind in zodiac sign/degree. You can also run your birth chart for successive days and see how much distance Mercury covers from one day to the next day -- this is the speed or daily motion. With position and speed found you can see who you might be similar to. Then, we sit down and we think, think and think some more about our traits and their traits. Maybe we'll learn something, maybe not. Dave
 

rcb30872

Thanks Dave for that,

I have gone to my chart, and my Sun is in Virgo 7 degrees and 24 minutes, and Mercury is in Leo 20 degrees and 24 minutes. So if I have got the idea of what you are saying right, then would I be right in saying that there are 17 degress between my Sun and Mercury?

Also, somewhere in here, you have mentioned that Mercury was BEHIND my Sun.

Now just to find about the speed.....

This is after one day added to my birth chart:
Sun 8 Vir 07
Mercury 21 Leo 32
So this would 16 degrees and 35 minutes

After two days:
Sun 9 Vir 05
Mercury 23 Leo 06
So this would be 15 degrees and 59 minutes

After three days:
Sun 10 Vir 04
Mercury 24 Leo 44
This would be 15 degrees and 20 seconds

So I guess the speed is 1/2 a degree then??

Is that right???

In which case the closest that I can find according to your map or chart, would be Louis Armstrong

Or is the speed minus 1/2 degree?

In which case, then I would probably say Michael Jackson, or is it Clint Eastwood?

HELP!!

:love:

Bec
 

dadsnook2000

For rcb30872

For determining Mercury's daily speed or motion you just compare Mercury's position from one day to the next. Your Mercury is moving a little over one degree per day. This and your distance from the Sun places you in a similar position to Bill Gates and Louis Armstrong and Condolezza Rice. Each of these excelled in their chosen careers. They may have other traits that you could identify with also. Each rose to their positions of leadership against all expectations of their peers and family. So, what do you see? Dave
 

rcb30872

Thanks Dave

Wow!! Good news for me then, hey? :grin:

Well, I want to rise, not necessarily to a place of leadership, but not in the way that is expected by my family and my peers. My family, especially. And the fact that they have excelled in their chosen careers, gives me great hope, as I would like to do the same, even though the chosen career, at the grand old age of 33, is not exactly known at the moment.

:love:

Bec
 

dadsnook2000

A summary of Mercury, approaching an understanding how it works.

We have been looking at the Sun as it relates to Mercury. Mercury never leaves the Sun’s zodiac territory due to its close orbit, it also doesn’t form any classical aspects for us to use as we might for other astrological work. We have seen that Mercury can travel direct or retrograde, its apparent speed or daily motion can vary greatly in a few days time, and we have seen that this little planet has to be in one of three zodiac signs relative to the Sun – the sign behind, the sign ahead, or the sign of the Sun. Some of us have also taken up the challenge to compare our natal Mercury-Sun position and speed/motion to that of well known people in order to see what common traits we might have.

While this aspect of examining Mercury relative to the Sun has been lengthy, it should prove helpful as Mercury is hard for many astrologers to understand. For the length of this thread and its complexity, I apologize.

We have discussed the traits of Mercury: the process of communication, the structuring of thoughts, perceptions, short and long-term memory, thought associations, etc. We haven’t spent as much time on travel or mythology or actual communication modes. Mercury represents all of these as well – as outer expressions of inner workings. SO, LET ME TRY TO SUMMARIZE THINGS UP TO THIS POINT.

Remember, we are talking about the Sun and its relationship to Mercury, we are not exploring just Mercury alone – that’s another thread in the future.

POINT ONE: In my first posting I noted that Mercury typically covers about four signs of the Zodiac along with the Sun, before it (Mercury) turns RETROGRADE and re-travels part of its previous path through the signs. Signs are a measuring tool for “collective experience” – we all share the same signs. It is only where they are sequentially arranged within our chart or house system that gives them/us a particular place/attitude in the world. This back-tracking symbolizes an important Mercury function. We have a problem, we work at it, we struggle, we can’t make the progress we hope for. Then we stop thinking, relax, and bang! The solution pops up! This is how Mercury can work if given time to go within yourself and re-arrange associations and to find and bring forth what is asked for. So, this collective call to rethink, let-go, and be open to new paths can work for all of us. This works on an individual level as well. The House position for Mercury retrograde shows how we might rethink/re-solve issues in our life, the Sign position shows how we also share in the collective-everybody problems around us. This is what MERCURY RETROGRADE seems to mean.

POINT TWO: Does Mercury’s relative position to the Sun have any particular meaning? When Mercury is BEHIND (ZODIAC POSITION) the Sun, it communicates the Sun’s purpose quite clearly. What one says is what one is in terms of purpose and character. This Mercury phase collects and solidifies the experiences and purposes of the Sun. We might say that this is Mercury at its most practical and pragmatic, acting as a true messenger of the Sun.

When Mercury is AHEAD (ZODIAC POSITION) of the Sun, Mercury functions more on its own, exercising curiosity and gathering information, speaking spontaneously, imagining what “might be” rather than “what was/is.” The Sun’s purpose and direction does not influence strongly what Mercury does and the manner in which it functions. This Mercury at its most imaginative and perceptive functioning.

My personal thoughts, and these are not substantiated by research – just intuition and fragmentary experience – is that Mercury at/near the 10-to-11 degree position ahead or behind the Sun’s central position seems to suggest a life-focus on expressing the meanings of these “before” and “after” phases. Using Oprah Winfrey as an example, (she has Mercury in this 10-to-11 degrees “ahead” phase) she expresses her life as a continuous process of discovery and free-exploration, letting her work and career develop itself in innovative ways. On the other hand, people such as Katheryn Hepburn and Michael Jackson (we should also check John Wayne and Clark Gable) seem to express themselves in (being in the 10-to-11 degrees “behind” phase) in every role they are in by using their basic personal character and not a “role” character. Their character doesn’t seem to change or adapt to each situation – there is a type of rigidity there. They just “play” themselves in each role even though the movie-story requires them to be in the proper role.

POINT THREE: Personal sensitivity points where Mercury might function more visibly need to be explored individually. This is something that most astrologers and most astrology reading won’t cover due to the time involved. But we may find that pre-natal positions where Mercury changed directions or made station (turning from one direction to another) are important. Also, the distance points from the Sun (without use of the Signs) for Sun-to-Mercury separation might also prove – for some – to be sensitive points.

POINT FOUR: Outward symbols of Mercury need to be kept in mind when interpreting a chart. Each symbol operates at different levels in each chart, and symbols tend to express themselves in every way possible. Relative to the Sun, we can develop several general expressions:
** Mercury is behind the Sun in its zodiac position.
**** Speaking directly and plainly, a sense of self-honesty is heard.
**** Ability to assimilate one’s experiences and draw upon them.
**** Travels to/thru known areas and regions, follows well traveled paths.
**** Does well “representing” others as a spokesperson, writer, secondary leader.

** Mercury is ahead of the Sun in its zodiac position.
**** Asks lots of questions, speaks without thought at times. Can be sly in how one gathers information that one wants.
**** Looks for new experiences and opportunities, has great curiosity at times.
**** Explores new thing and regions on a whim.
**** Will talk for “effect” – just to see what an idea or a statement does relative to others.

** Mercury retrograde and within 10 to 11 degrees of the Sun.
**** Seeks to teach and share knowledge.
**** Helps to provide a basis of knowledge or a resource for others to use.
**** Points the way for others to explore, shows how to communicate effectively.

So, having said all of this, we each need to take this in, compare it to our own experience, and to comment on it if you wish. And, again, remember that all of this is relating to the Sun and Mercury and how Mercury helps the Sun to express itself. This is not Mercury alone that we have been talking about. Dave.