Intensive Deck Study (IDS) Support Lounge ~ Part IV

teomat said:

Makes it very hard to stay committed to your fluffy bunny IDS deck when everyone else is making out with their Holy Guardian Angels...

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Hey, the RWS (no matter which version) is not a fluffy bunny deck!

teomat said:

But I have to admit also that even though I feel a bit left out when it comes to discussions about these hugely popular decks, a small rebellious side of me feels content that I'm NOT part of the crowd. I hope this doesn't sound too nasty but my eyes glaze over whenever I see one of these huge gushing threads. I'm always drawn to the little ones, slipping away down the forum table talking about a deck that's not very popular or unmentioned (e.g the Fergus Hall or some obscure Lo Scarabeo deck etc).

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I know what you mean. While I have a few decks that have been the subject of a gushing thread, I hardly ever look at these threads. Gushing on its own just isn't very interesting to me. Sure, tell me what you like about a deck, but definitely also tell me what you don't like, what you had a hard time understanding, what made you think, etc.

I might have bought a deck or three because someone else (usually people I believe to be more than "just gushers") said great things about them, but the first deck I really started to work with was the Manara. I believe it's been so easy for me to experiment with it precisely because hardly anyone had ever said anything about it. I had no standard to live up to besides my own. (Mind you, I never studied that deck, just did lots of readings with it.)

Like you, I'm often drawn to decks that don't get mass praise. I like odd, weird, unusual, quirky decks. This summer, for example, I had fun with my Phantasmagoric Theater (but rarely ever posted anything about it). I only two of other AT people who actually use(d) and like that deck: thorhammer and KarlThomas.

teomat said:

This is also how I feel about my IDS deck. It's not as popular as the standard RWS or the new Commemmorative PCS one, and although it's not considered a 'proper' or clean reproduction of the RWS by purists, it's the one that I'm most drawn too.

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That's just geeks to you. You don't have to participate in their tarot geek talk, much of which is just opinions (if educated ones) anyway. If your deck does for you what you want it to do, it's the right one. If those geeky threads make you feel inadequate, don't go there.

teomat said:

Admittedly, using a deck that's not very popular can make things a bit lonely when you want to talk about it, but at the same time it can make the deck seem more personal to you. And when doing an IDS, I think that's a major plus.

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I completely agree! (I hugely enjoy talking the Greenwood with the very few others who also use it right now, but there's a reason why I don't post in the Greenwood gush threads...)

thorhammer said:

Get used to it. There's a lot more of it coming . . . I read them years ago and loved them, but wouldn't go back to them in a hurry.

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*sigh* Oh well... Maybe I'll get used to it?

Wendywu said:

That's exactly why I preferred the first one - I enjoyed the descriptions of how to make stuff and just how to survive. I really, really didn't appreciate the increasing sexual emphasis in the books. I feel that as a people their emphasis would have been more on survival than sex in those days. I felt quite often as if it was intrusive and the story didn't flow simply because there was too much gratutitous sex.

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Exactly. The second book is also such a surprise after the first one had so little sex altogether (and certainly not described in as much detail).

(It's almost funny that I of all people would be complaining about too much sex in a book - but then again, that just emphasizes it's not the sex per se that bothers me but the way it doesn't fit the story/setting very well.)

Oh well. Maybe I'll and convince myself the sex is there so I don't feel alienated from the RED exchanges I keep running during this IDS...

I feel like I've neglected the beloved Empress this week. With the holidays and such I had less time than usual. I do have a better understanding of the Boho-Goth Empress though, she is an interesting character. I can't wait to have time to do some practice readings

Wendywu said:

I love the look of that AGM TdM - does it have an actual name? I don't know quite what to look up

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In the AGM catalog ints just called Tarot de Marseille AGM.
ISBN # 3-905021-28-5 (German)
ISBN# 3-0905021-29-3 (French)

Hope that helps.

If you are looking to buy, I know someplace that has a few.
Not open posting it. On the fence about a back up.

I'll see if I can see it on Amazon UK first - shipping charges!! If I fail, I'll come and bang on your door

Still here, but I realise I haven't posted since before xmas as to what I'm up to. I've continued with both my Thoth and TdM. My focus has been mostly on the Thoth right now and I've been using it for daily draws. As always happnes I get rather annoyed with the Thoth now and then as things about it really frustrate me. I haven't had as much time available as I'd like to try and work through my 'issues'. I feel myself wanting to retreat to the TdM instead I am loving the benefits I'm getting from working with both these decks simultaneously though.

After reading your post Zan, a few pages back, I feel a little bit like I'm playing outside the rules though. I'm pretty committed to working with these two decks exclusively at the moment (despite me desire to join Rodney in the Mythic study group ). Seriously though, is it appropriate to be here working with two decks? Am I better off in the PDR thread I wonder? I'm currently working out my goals for 2010 and looking at where I want to focus my energies and so it might be that the PDR is a better place for me to be.

I really admire those of you who are so committed to your one deck. I did that myself with the Alchemical for about six months and gained so much from it. It really was life-changing when I look back at it.

ETA...I just went and had a look at the PDR thread and I'm not sure it's what I'm really wanting to do either. Maybe I might just have to go it alone

sapienza, I just wanted to say my own piece about your dilemma. I am not exactly proselytising, but I am unashamedly taking sides here. This is my own opinion, drawn from my own experience, so please take from it what you will.

I worked with the Thoth mostly exclusively for a long time a while back. I kept hitting blocks with it - like it didn't want me, like it was consciously stopping me from seeing around it to the truth or from making progress. Each time this happened, I got more and more frustrated, but each time it did suddenly break down and I got another layer of understanding.

Then, one day, I hit a big one. I had a tantrum and ran to our mate Scion for help. I don't think that I have the PM any more, sadly, but what he said to me basically boiled down to the Thoth being a jealous lover, who rewards fidelity and inflicts frustration as payback for straying. As we all know, I can't begin to approximate Scion's prose and I won't try - but suffice to say that he described the magic of the deck in such a way as to bolster my strength and I continued . . . less than a week later I did one of the most amazing readings I've ever done with that deck. She really does reward your efforts, she challenges you and if you prove yourself worthy, the leaps you make are great.

Lay aside your TdM It will be there later. For now, though, what you describe with the Thoth is hauntingly similar to my own frustrations with it, and I thought perhaps you might want to hear of my own triumph, small though it was.

\m/ Kat

Sapienza-- I do agree with Kat that focusing on the Thoth seems like the best choice, since it seems to be your focus anyway (which makes me think it holds a stronger interest for you than TdM does right now). I think that getting frustrated and hating your deck sometimes is all part of the fun of IDS! As much as I love Hermann, i most definitely have my moments of seeing someone else talking about, say, the Bohemian Gothic, and I pull it out and look it over and think to myself, "Ugh damnit Hermann why can't you be this beautiful and fun and easy to read??"

But then I remember that "fun" is actually no fun, and neither is "easy to read". And I find myself, though still frustrated, enjoying the memory of why I fell for Hermann in the first place.

So I think that frustration and the occasional deck hate is all part of the IDS experience, even a positive part at times.

I would, however, add that "one deck only" isn't necessarily what I meant by exclusivity. Though I do think that a one-deck contract, so to speak, is preferable, if two decks is working out for you, and you're good with sticking to that, then that is being exclusive. My point really was just not making commitments that you have either no plan or (based on your own sense of yourself) no ability to stick to.

I think that this love of strictness and rule-following I seem to be exhibiting comes from teaching in a university. I spend my whole life watching my lazy, drunken students who don't do their homework and come to class 45 minutes late break every rule I can possibly set, so when I join a rule-based group for fun as a way of communicating with adults, I just hope that if we're making commitments, we should be able to stick to them.

The point was, Sapienza, that I do think one deck is preferable, but as long as you're happy sticking to your two deck pledge, then that seems totally fine since you're working exclusively with those two and not breaking your rules.

It really is hard to quit being a teacher outside the office haha. Hope I'm not making anyone too crazy with all of this. I just really like rules.

Thanks Kat and Zan for your thoughts on my little 'situation' I understand where you are coming from Zan and it's been a good opportunity for me to really look at how committed I am to this IDS.

I'm still quite unsure what to do. I DO feel really committed to these two decks. I know myself well enough to know that if I want to do this longer term then limiting myself to one is likely to lead to failure. The reason that I'm working with both the Thoth and TdM is that the historical roots of tarot are very important to my 'tarot world view', if that makes sense. I find that if I don't refer back to the history then I don't find I'm left with any meaning.

I've actually got myself a copy of the Hadar TdM on the way (I think). What I'm going to do is focus soley on the Thoth until the Hadar arrives and then make a decision after that. Even when I'm working with both decks it is true that I'm focusing on the Thoth, but without the TdM I'm less inclined to spend time with the Thoth. I'm not sure this is making any sense and I think I'm rambling now I have effectively IDS'ed with the Thoth in the past and gained a lot from it, but this time I'm taking it on on my own terms!

What has happend for me in the past six months is that I'll focus intently on a huge range historical decks and then swing wildly amongst a whole range of modern decks without really achieving anything much with any of them. Since I've basically committed to just the TdM and Thoth I've remained pretty focused and have found it much easier to just leave my other decks alone. It has been working really well for me.

The ONLY exception to all this is my Mythic. I've used this deck now for almost 12 years. I effectively IDS'ed with it for 5 years when I first started with tarot. Rodney is IDSing with it and is posting in the study group. I simply can't pass up the opportunity to join him. I'm not however actually working with the deck. I just know it so well that it's a great opportunity for me to post there and reflect how far I've come in my tarot journey as well as revisiting the Myths.

So.....to clarify.....

I will continue the IDS with the Thoth until my Hadar arrives (possibly another few weeks). I will continue to do daily draws with the Thoth.

When my Hadar arrives I will make a decision about whether to IDS with one or both decks.

My ONLY exception to my IDS will be to post in the Mythic study group. I will not be working with the deck other than that.

I would like to participate in Reading Exchange in IDS.

I would use my Indian Tarot Deck. Also i would regularly practice with my deck.