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Sabian Symbols: Correspondences: Decanates and Tarot

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one thing I would like to point out


is that since the sabian symbols travel around the decantes,,
that they can be applied to any ordinary golden dawn system of tarot including the waite and the thoth minor pips.
That would be from 2 to 10 in each suit making 36.

one you know which one sabian symbol belongs where the two of wands decantes for example is ,, you can colour meanings of the tarot further.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HOLMES
is that since the sabian symbols travel around the decantes,,
that they can be applied to any ordinary golden dawn system of tarot including the waite and the thoth minor pips.
That would be from 2 to 10 in each suit making 36.

one you know which one sabian symbol belongs where the two of wands decantes for example is ,, you can colour meanings of the tarot further.
HOLMES - I sound like an ignoramus, but I'm sorry, I dont understand what you mean. I dont understand astrology. How do the correspondents work again with the Tarot? Could you give me some examples please. I'm very interested!

Blessings
Elven x
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http://www.astrology-books.com/store...eanalysis.html

this links many books based on sabian and decantes.


http://www.supertarot.co.uk/ootk/ootk4.htm
decanatges and how the minor arcana is split up into the 36 decanates into 360 degrees of iwsodm.

http://www.taroscopes.com/products/t...-series.html#4
"from the link
In his fourth book in the Taroscopes series, Michael Tsarion reveals the fascinating lost connections between the Tarot’s Minor Arcana, and the Egyptian Zodiac of thirty-six signs. These signs, known as Decanates or Decans, have been habitually ignored by modern exoteric astrologers and Tarot practitioners. However, the Tarot cannot be mastered or utilized correctly without its connection to the zodiac being fully explored and understood. This invaluable book, should not be passed up by those who wish to come into a deeper, personal connection with the Tarot and Zodiac. It will prove to be a revelation and treasured reference for the true Mystery School adepts."

the book qabalistic tarot which was recently reprinted helps one to understand the decanates in the minor arcana as well.

while i can't find any direct link,, nor read any books on sabian symbols.
if the symbols of the sabian symbols are assisgned to the 360 degrees of wisdom in the decantes (which they are)
and the minor arcana of the 2 to 10 of each minor arcana
(and court cards as well in their own way)
are broken astrology wise into the decanates..
(granted it is on the golden dawn system, yet it also forms the basis for the waite and the thoth system of decanates and astrology in the minors as well )

so by looking at the two sources, one will realize that the sabian symbol in one decanate can be assigned to the tarot card assigned to that decanate as well.

know that this is a new system relatively when it comes to the sabian symbols as they were all channelled by a a person who can see symbols and had clairovance sight.
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Hi All,

Hi Holmes,
Thankyou Holmes for the sites which describe the Tarot associations and Decanates. I'm still not sure if I have these right but does this sound like it:
Aries Degree 1-10 = 2 Wands
Aries Degree 11-20 = 3 Wands
Aries Degree 21-30 = 4 Wands
Taurus Degree 1-10 = 5 Disks
Taurus Degree 11-20 = 6 Disks
Taurus Degree 21-30 = 7 Disks
or does it start at Aries 0 degrees? (0-9 degrees)

The Sabian Symbols start at 1 degree.
Does the Tarot card cover the span of the 10 degrees of the Symbol?

Or am I just completely out here!
Im confused?!!!

Your help would be appreciated again!!

Blessings
Elven x
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...talking about decanates!



A simple, I hope, introduction to the decanates and matching Sabian symbols and Tarot cards.

Each sign of the zodiac has 30 degrees.
A Sabian symbol has been given to each degree so there are 30 symbols to each zodiac sign.

There are three signs for each element....fire,earth,water,air.

Let's look at fire.......Aries, Leo, Sagittarius.

Three signs....total 90 degrees......90 Sabian Symbols.

Wands are the suit of fire. Excluding the Ace we have 9 cards...2 - 10.
That is three cards for each fire sign.

Dividing the 30 degrees of one sign by 3 we end up with 3 groups of 10 degrees.
Each group of 10 is called a decanate.

10 Sabian Symbols share 1 tarot card.

Aries 1 - 10 degrees..........2 wands ( Mars in Aries)
Aries 11 - 20 degrees........3 Wands ( Sun in Aries)
Aries 21 - 30 degrees........4 Wands ( Venus in Aries)

Leo 1 - 10 degrees............5 Wands ( Saturn in Leo)
Leo 11 - 20 degrees...........6 Wands (Jupiter in Leo )
Leo 21 - 30 degrees...........7 Wands ( Mars in Leo)

Sagittarius 1-10 degrees .....8 Wands ( Mercury in Sagittarius)
Sagittarius 11-20 degrees....9 Wands ( Moon in Sagittarius)
Sagittarius 21-30 degrees....10 Wands ( Saturn in Sagittarius)

Although this is interesting I find it limiting and Elvens weekly card is a good example. Like Sunflwer I immediately thought of the 10 Wands.

Which means that Elven's card would be one from 21 - 30 degrees Sagittarius.
Its not.......it's Taurus13 which corresponds to 5 Pentacles.

I like the idea of making the connections myself first.......the porter will always now be the 10 Wands although the 5 pentacles no doubt has more to add.

Hope this helps some......Elven, I can if you like open another thread and list all the correspondences.

I have a suggestion! Coming to the thread today after no time for the last three days there was much to read ......all of it interesting and covering different topics. This thread is very soon going to become very long and unwieldy and a great deal of wonderful information is going to be buried. I think we need to start opening more threads......from weekly draws inviting input to reading questions, birth charts ( love those, and each planet could have its own thread) and so on.

The more threads we open the more visible we become.....hopefully attracting more interested participants.

Just a thought.......and your magnificent effort listing all the symbols is recognised...a labour of love indeed! Great effort .
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Mooncat - that's only valid if you assign astrological signs to every card; even then there are several schools and correspondences. Which one are you using?

To me it seems limiting always to assign a Zodiac correspondence to Tarot - especially to the minors. Tarot is Tarot and astrology is astrology - and only very occasionally do I feel the need to link the two, where some kind of clarification is needed. So with the Sabian Symbols - Tarot card match, I prefer my method of random choosing! Seems to work But I can see some people might prefer a more systematic and less random approach.

I do like the idea of looking at the Sabian Symbols for the week, as Sabian Symbols, unlike Tarot, is based on the Zodiac.
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Quote:
Mooncat - that's only valid if you assign astrological signs to every card; even then there are several schools and correspondences. Which one are you using?
I realise that......I was simply trying to show those with no astrological knowledge what the decanates were .
I love to use both astrology and numerology with tarot but although my original idea was to use the symbols in a similar way I've changed my mind.

I don't have the time to post a daily draw so am also settling for a longer period......a wise decision I think as this weeks card is Libra9 again from last week. Obviously more reflection on that one required.
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Hi Mooncat2
Thankyou so much for taking the time to reply to my post - this makes a little more sense to me. I think the one HOLMES was talking about matches the planets and the Tarot cards. I copied a chart from the website and will post it after this post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooncat2

A simple, I hope, introduction to the decanates and matching Sabian symbols and Tarot cards.

Each sign of the zodiac has 30 degrees.
A Sabian symbol has been given to each degree so there are 30 symbols to each zodiac sign.

There are three signs for each element....fire,earth,water,air.

Let's look at fire.......Aries, Leo, Sagittarius.

Three signs....total 90 degrees......90 Sabian Symbols.

Wands are the suit of fire. Excluding the Ace we have 9 cards...2 - 10.
That is three cards for each fire sign.

Dividing the 30 degrees of one sign by 3 we end up with 3 groups of 10 degrees.
Each group of 10 is called a decanate.

10 Sabian Symbols share 1 tarot card.

Aries 1 - 10 degrees..........2 wands ( Mars in Aries)
Aries 11 - 20 degrees........3 Wands ( Sun in Aries)
Aries 21 - 30 degrees........4 Wands ( Venus in Aries)

Leo 1 - 10 degrees............5 Wands ( Saturn in Leo)
Leo 11 - 20 degrees...........6 Wands (Jupiter in Leo )
Leo 21 - 30 degrees...........7 Wands ( Mars in Leo)

Sagittarius 1-10 degrees .....8 Wands ( Mercury in Sagittarius)
Sagittarius 11-20 degrees....9 Wands ( Moon in Sagittarius)
Sagittarius 21-30 degrees....10 Wands ( Saturn in Sagittarius)
Ah ha! That makes a little more sense to me. I thought I was on the right track, but the list I had from the website coresponded with Planets. (shown on next post).

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooncat2
Although this is interesting I find it limiting and Elvens weekly card is a good example. Like Sunflwer I immediately thought of the 10 Wands.
I agree with this as well. I think it can limit an interpretation, especially when drawing a Tarot card and then a Sabian Symbol (at random) work beautifully together. They rarely corespond in the way they would if they were teamed up with Astrology from a chart.

Though I feel there is a relative corespondence still. A form and an order for the Symbols and the Tarot and the Astrology to meet and talk to each other. I suppose it would depend on what type of reading was being done and what kind of spread was being used.

As an Oracle reading, I prefer to not to look at the Tarot card which 'matches' the Symbol, but to draw them independently and see them intergrate with each other. It would be when the assigned Tarot and the Symbol turned up together 'independently', I would take a very close look, perhaps.

Its nice though to have the information for the comparison. Something more can come from this I am sure of it. Maybe the way the Tarot has been asigned traditionally to the Symbols needs a bit of 'tweeking' or revision, something. I wrack my brains as something keeps telling me there is more to it than meets the eye, but at the moment I cant see it. The more I think on it, the more confused I become!


Quote:
Originally Posted by mooncat2
I like the idea of making the connections myself first.......the porter will always now be the 10 Wands although the 5 pentacles no doubt has more to add.
I agree with this as well! When one Tarot card talks to a Symbol (and visa versa), I like to keep a note of the association and the question it was about. Seriously, you could corespond an entire Tarot deck to Aries 1, then two, then 3, etc and still be able to find relevance in each pairing, depending on the question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooncat2
Hope this helps some......Elven, I can if you like open another thread and list all the correspondences.
I think this is a great idea, if you have the time! . Just to have the information on the board is great. There have been a few suggestions of and different pairings for the Tarot the Symbols and the Astrology association. If theres a thread, and other methods come up, they can be added to it as well!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooncat2
I have a suggestion! Coming to the thread today after no time for the last three days there was much to read ......all of it interesting and covering different topics. This thread is very soon going to become very long and unwieldy and a great deal of wonderful information is going to be buried. I think we need to start opening more threads......from weekly draws inviting input to reading questions, birth charts ( love those, and each planet could have its own thread) and so on.
Yep, Ive noticed this too. Its looking like a bad hair day! . I have not been able to get back to the thread for a couple of days and have found that there is so much to get through, and so many things I want to comment on, that I will be here for hours. (Not that I mind )

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooncat2
The more threads we open the more visible we become.....hopefully attracting more interested participants.
Yep, Im sure that would work. I'll pm zorya and see what can be done and what would be the best way to approach it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mooncat2
Just a thought.......and your magnificent effort listing all the symbols is recognised...a labour of love indeed! Great effort .
Bless you and thankyou. The next list will be Alphabetical - maybe in the next couple of weeks, I have a bit to do.

Because of my lack of knowledge with Astrology, I am hoping that a course will come up soon which will help be be able to understand things a little better. For now though, I am still happily using them as an oracle with Tarot - the way I find best.

Many Blessings
Elven x
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This is a chart from the website
http://www.tarotscopes.com/products/...s-series.html#4

Opening The Key Spread: 36 Decanates
Fourth Operation:
The Further Development of the Question
The 36 decanates of ten degrees each correspond to the pip cards of the Minor Arcana, excluding the Aces.

The instructions in the Golden Dawn manual require that the cards are shuffled and placed on the table without cutting. The diviner turns the pack face up and searches through the cards until the Significator is found. At this point the Significator and the cards beneath it are placed on top of the remainder. The Significator is placed upon the table, the Deck is turned over and the following 36 cards are dealt out in the order of the picture below.

inserted by Elven: There is a 'circle of 36 cards' in this place which didnt come out in the copy.

Card counting commences from position 1, or Ascendant, in the direction of the cards laid out, which means that there is no potential change of direction when a court card is hit. The general rules of noting the majority or lack of a suit, and whether 3 or 4 cards of a sort are present. Once the counting has been completed, the cards are paired together, starting at 1st and 36th, 2nd and 25th, and so on.

The actual interpretation of the 36 positions is left unclear in the text. There are the traditional images of the Decanates derived from Egyptian sources, but these rarely have any use.

There are several candidates:

Decanate card interpretations
Goetic Spirits
Enochian Great Cross in the Watchtowers
Another problem is exactly what the first position represents! We might think this position is 0° Aries (2 Wands), but the Golden Dawn fixed the start of the Zodiac at 0° Leo, which would be 5 Wands. If we considered the House system, then positions 1-3 would be the first house, 4-6 the second house, and so on. It actually does not matter which zodiac is used elementally, since the first three positions would be fire, the next three earth, then air and finally water, repeating the sequence.

2 Wands - Mars: Innovation, passion, fearless
3 Wands - Sun: Ego, pride
4 Wands - Venus: Love, beauty, artistic ability
5 Disks - Mercury: Conscious awareness of surroundings, mental
6 Disks - Moon: Emotional and feeling orientated, domestic
7 Disks - Saturn: Serious, disciplined, dutiful
8 Swords - Jupiter: Optimistic, understanding, eager
9 Swords - Mars: Scattered energy
10 Swords - Sun: Individual, hedonistic
2 Cups - Venus: Love, collecting objects
3 Cups - Mercury: Brothers, sisters, sensitive to the environment
4 Cups - Moon: Feelings, home, sensitivity, changeable
5 Wands - Saturn: Disciplined, dutiful to lovers
6 Wands - Jupiter: Gambler, religious, exaggerates
7 Wands - Mars: Passionate, adventurous
8 Disks - Sun: Analytical or critical ego
9 Disks - Venus: Perfection in love or beauty
10 Disks - Mercury: Literary, conscious, meticulous mind
2 Swords - Moon: Feelings for the partner, sensitivity to art
3 Swords - Saturn: Duty to partner, disciplined in artistic expression
4 Swords - Jupiter: Expansive and generous to partner
5 Cups - Mars: Energy, passion, sexual pride, destructive energies
6 Cups - Sun: Ego domination, glory seeking
7 Cups - Venus: Possessive in love, secretive liaisons
8 Wands - Mercury: Conscious awareness, communicative
9 Wands - Moon: Feeling lucky, or detached from the environment
10 Wands - Saturn: Disciplined, scientific, religious
2 Disks - Jupiter: Ambition with integrity, big ideas
3 Disks - Mars: Ambitious, me first
4 Disks - Sun: Glory and status
5 Swords - Venus: Congenial friendships, beauty
6 Swords - Mercury: Creative mind, independence, nerves
7 Swords - Moon: Erratic emotions, feelings for friends
8 Cups - Saturn: Depressive, sacrifice for duty
9 Cups - Jupiter: Spiritual, intellectually sensitive
10 Cups - Mars: Secret actions or aggression, sensitive, passionate

The Chaldean system of ruling planets is ancient, and follows the traditional order of the days of the week. Note that many of the descriptions are close to the usual Tarot card interpretations, such as the 8 Cups.


Blessings
Elven x
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