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Stage 4 Reading for Kalliope (Part 1)


For this reading I'm going to concentrate on relationships.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalliope
Here is some general info though:
marriage date: 10 Dec 2009
started dating husband: 2003
first significant relationship year: 1995
drama: 1997-1998, also 1999
semi-drama: 2012
Profections

Looking at profections for your wedding date, the Ascendant did not prove particularly useful. 2009 is a twelfth place year, and whilst that for you is a Venus year (and Venus rules your seventh house of Taurus) in this case the featured sign is Libra. However, as Valens says we should use Venus for relationships, I then profected from Venus.

This gives a Scorpio year and Scorpio is your first house, so relationships are going to be of particular importance to you. Venus was transiting Scorpio at the start of the year, so it is angular and had just completed the transit of natal Mars and natal Mercury. Mars of course is your Ascendant Ruler and Mercury rules your Lot of Fortune

At the start of the year, Transiting Mars, the Lord of the year was exactly conjunct your astronomical MC, itself being in the middle of your tenth whole sign house. So action in relation to Relationships is signalled and relationships are going to be fundamentally crucial to your expression of 'you' this year but also are going to affect you public persona.

Your wedding day was an Aquarius day, Aquarius being your fourth whole sign house and signifying family. Jupiter, ruler of your fifth House of Romance was transiting Aquarius and so brings family and romance issues together. Venus had completed its Return just a couple of days earlier so Jupiter is also the ruler of Transiting Venus.

More interesting though is that Mars has moved to being exactly conjunct your Lot of Eros on that day.

There seem to be clear signification that this is an important month in an important year for relationships and that your Wedding Day is marked as particularly special because of the conjunction by transit of Ascendant Ruler and Lot of Eros

In Part 2 I'll look at Zodiacal Releasing in terms of the Lot(s) of Eros and Marriage
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia View Post
Thank you, Minderwiz. I see there is another Loose of Bond towards the middle of April but that's too early to change anything as the whole story will keep developing for many more months to come. Which planets should I consider in relation to courts, legal stuff, etc? What should I look for (except from mercury as a ruler of the 5th)?
Um... I kind of reached my own conclusion and while it has nothing to do with Hellenistic Astrology, it still puts Saturn as Lord of the Ascendant in the spotlight. I realized (again!) that he is literal when he is transiting my chart and transiting the 9th house (Placidus) which is related to law and such stuff, turning retro he actually pushed me to reconsider all my legal documents and agreements and the outcome is not clear yet but it's a travel back in time and re-reading every single word, etc. I know in Hellenistic he is supposed to be transiting the 11th but in this case it seems the 9th is more relevant. Or I don't see the 11th as a player here.
Top   #192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minderwiz View Post
For:

Ana's Song,
Kalliope
Spiraling

I've now reached Stage 4, so I'd like an area of life (which may or may not be the one you chose for Stage 3) to have a look at what has happened in the past and what should happen in the near future.

Can you follow Ronia's example and perhaps give me a connected event(s) in the past in order to calibrate for having a stab at the future.

For Jessyboo92 I'm at Stage 3 so an area of life you want me to look at would be the next step.

I can see other methods that I'm coming across which might be useful for everybody, so the end of Stage 4 is not necessarily the end of the thread.
Hi Minderwiz

Apologies for being AWOL for so long - I will be re-reading all you have posted for me and providing feedback in short order.

With regards to Stage 4, let's keep it in tune with my Stage 3 which is romance. I'll also PM you the details
Top   #193
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Ronia 

Minderwiz, did the ancient astrologers consider eclipses important? I'm entering an eclipse roller coaster which seems quite significant as it happens in 4th house where I've had big problems lately (family) and wondered if that was important in Hellenistic astrology?

I got a bit confused which rulers to consider in terms of the eclipse though. The eclipse will happen in my 11th, conjunct my natal Sun, trine my natal Mars. I thought this would activate natal Mars, right? Transiting Mars is conjunct the Sun opposite the Moon, is this significant since the transiting Moon itself is conjunct the natal Sun? Should I consider the 5th house or the 4th? Transiting Venus is two degrees from the IC but this is Placidus and I'm confused. I tried profections and while it's still a Cancer month, it will be a Sagittarius day. Transiting Mercury will conjunct natal Jupiter and transiting Jupiter will still be in trine to natal Mercury (applying for a square with natal Venus), so there is a double whammy. Should I take into account the profected day as well and it's ruler Jupiter?

If I profect from the Sun (or the MC), it's a Taurus month and Venus is again activated as a ruler and by transiting Jupiter while transiting Venus is close to the IC which she rules. It will be a Scorpio day thus activating natal Mars (aspected by the eclipse) while transiting Mars is opposite the eclipsed Moon.

I get the feeling the major players will be natal Sun, Mars, Venus and possibly Jupiter. Am I on the right track? I'm looking for the best time to try and reach a resoluiton with my ex, a beneficial one, of course.

The 9th of May eclipse will trine my Ascendant and natal Venus, in the 4th, while transiting Mars will conjunct the IC. It will be a profected Leo month from the Asc, Virgo day (activating natal Venus again? or Mercury?) and a profected Cancer month from the Sun and MC, Leo day (activating natal Sun probably and/or Saturn?).

What do you think, could I use any of these to schedule negotiations with my ex? Our issues are around my trip with my son back to Canada and my custody rights.

I also checked the release but first I tried from Aries, Lot of Spirit, as in this case I'm trying to change the circumstances using my own will and effort. I'm in a Gemini L1 (active Mercury), Pisces L2 (active Jupiter) - both planets will be aspecting each other via transit towards the Lunar eclipse on April 25th. On the 28th of April there will be a Loose of Bond as L3 will switch from Gemini to Cancer and L4 - from Capricorn to Cancer. I thought this may be a good time for relations with others but it may activate enemies, how do I know which of these is more probable?

If I release from Fortune there is nothing significant, it's a Scorpio L4. Should I consider other points or planets to release from?
Top   #194
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Minderwiz 
Stage 4 Reading for Kalliope - Part 2


I've decided to keep to the Lot of Eros here and perhaps look at the Lots of Marriage in a subsequent post, just to keep it in nice bite sized chunks.



There are two key Lots here, Eros (relationships) and Marriage. The problem that we've touched on before is that there are a variety of ways of defining these two lots, which varied over time and between interpretations of the meaning of 'relationship' and 'marriage'

Lot of Eros

The Paulus Lot is AC + Spirit - Venus {Night Birth) and lies at 28, 31 Aquarius

More common appears to be

AC + Spirit - Fortune , or AC + Fortune - Spirit (with some argument about whether they are reversed at night)

The two possibilities are 19, 18 Leo and 27, 26 Capricorn - I will deal with the Leo Lot, which seems to have been the most used.

Looking at the Paulus Lot first. From the end of March 1992 you entered a Leo L1/L2 period. The Leo L1 lasted till The Summer Solstice of 2004, so the L1 period covered all your relationships up to but not including your marriage (though it did include the beginning of your relationship with your husband). It also did not include your last 'semi-drama'. Leo is your MC, so these relationships are either entered into through a 'careeer'/professional environment or are a means of you publically expressing yourself. Obviously not the only or even main means of doing that but they are still a social statement.

Mid 1995 saw the onset of a Libra L2 period and again we have the recurrence of this sign in connection with your relationships. At the onset of the period Venus was transiting your seventh house and Saturn (Exalted in Libra) was transiting your fifth house and transited your Lot of Spirit during this L2 period.

From April 1997 to April 1998 you were in a Sagittarius L2 period and during that period Jupiter, ruler of Sagittarius was firstly transiting your fourth house where it turned retrograde went back over your IC and then turned Direct, retracing it's transit of your IC. The change to Retrogade motion occured in June 1997, turning Direct again in October and then moving across your IC and later into your fifth House of Pisces in January 1998 It's possible these changes in phase had some significance for the timings of your relationship.

The start of your relationship with your husband was during Pisces L2 which lasted through all of 2003 (all but the last week) and began with Jupiter conjunct your MC - again 'action' and 'social standing' are stressed along with with Romance.

Your wedding occured during a Pisces L1, Cancer L2, Aquarius L3, Scorpio L4 period. Stressing Romance, 'Trave;l', Relationships (Aquarius is the sign of the Paulus Lot) and Self (Scorpio is your Ascendanat. The positions of the planets have been covered in the previous post.

The 2012 'drama' also occured during the L1 Pisces period but had a Leo L2 up to August and then a Virgo L2. My guess is that the drama was before mid August.

The Leo Lot, which appears to be the one Valens used is conjunct your MC (well 3 degrees off the Astronomical MC) and again links relationships of all kinds with your 'public persona' The entire period under consideration, apart from 2012 comes under a Level 1 Virgo period and is therefore characterised by relationships as being good for your spirit/soul. It started in August 1993, so if your first relationship began before then it was during a very brief L1/L2 Aquarius period which began with a Loosing of the Bond and interrupted a sequence which continued with the L1/L2 Virgo period. Again at the outset of this period Mercury was conjunct your MC, so this does seem to emphasise the role of the MC in your relationships, either by transit or by the presence of the most popular Lot of Eros.

There was a L2 Sagittarius period which lasted from Feb 1997 to Feb 1998 so your 1997/98 probably drama began during this period and may have ended during it. Jupiter is again the key planet during this year and was transiting your fourth house at the time (and was also important in the early part of 1993 during the Aquarius period as your fourth is in Aquarius. The change to Retrograde and then Direct motion has already been mentioned.

Up to 25 October, 2003 was a Pisces L2 period so Romance is again stressed.

Your wedding occurred in a Leo L2 period (this Lot is in Leo) A Capricorn L3 Period and a Pisces L4 Day. As we have seen Venus, ruler of your seventh, was transiting Capricorn during this month and on the day, the Sun (ruler of the Lot was in Sagittarius Trine to Jupiter its sign ruler and ruler of the fifth (and of the Wedding Day).

2012 was an Aries L2 year, Mars is ruler of your Ascendant, and at the time was transiting your eleventh house, and thus opposing your fifth of Romance. The opposition gives some hint of trouble and I suppose drama. Mars turned retrograde in late January, opposed Venus in Late February (Venus ruling your seventh and transiting your fifth) and Mars then squared the transiting Sun (ruler of the Lot of Eros in early June. Mars finally left your eleventh and ceased its opposition. From September onwards Mars was in Scorpio, opposing your seventh House of Marriage, transited it's own natal position and natal Mercury before going on to transit your natal Sun and Venus'

The regular occurrence of Venus and Jupiter here is quite interesting, as is the transit of your MC or IC by a significant planet at during one of the periods you've raised. I was going to say that it seems to make little difference which Lot we use, but as the two lie in opposite signs, it's not surprising that the same planets are triggered, if not quite in the same way. Remember though that for these transits by Jupiter and Venus to be significant, they must be activated, either because the sign they are in is activated by the Time Lord period or one of their signs is itself activated.
Top   #195
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Minderwiz 

Ana,

Thanks for the info - that's fine and I'll go ahead with it.
Top   #196
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Ronia,

I'll have a think about the issue you raised and get back to you, when I get my brain in gear LOL
Top   #197
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia View Post
Minderwiz, did the ancient astrologers consider eclipses important? I'm entering an eclipse roller coaster which seems quite significant as it happens in 4th house where I've had big problems lately (family) and wondered if that was important in Hellenistic astrology?
Well they certainly paid a great deal of attention to the pre-natal lunation (either New Moon or Full Moon), so I would assume that lunations during life must have some importance, depending on the placement. Your pre-natal lunation was a Full Moon in Aries (28 degrees) so Mars rules that lunation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia
I got a bit confused which rulers to consider in terms of the eclipse though. The eclipse will happen in my 11th, conjunct my natal Sun, trine my natal Mars. I thought this would activate natal Mars, right? Transiting Mars is conjunct the Sun opposite the Moon, is this significant since the transiting Moon itself is conjunct the natal Sun? Should I consider the 5th house or the 4th? Transiting Venus is two degrees from the IC but this is Placidus and I'm confused. I tried profections and while it's still a Cancer month, it will be a Sagittarius day. Transiting Mercury will conjunct natal Jupiter and transiting Jupiter will still be in trine to natal Mercury (applying for a square with natal Venus), so there is a double whammy. Should I take into account the profected day as well and it's ruler Jupiter?
I must admit I got a bit confused over this paragraph but I assume you are talking about the forthcoming Full Moon in Scorpio on 25th April (19:57 UT), as that seems to fit your description.

Now you can profect from any planet or point, you like - As long as you have a good reason for doing so and it fits the Astrological model. As your concerned about your family and home here then I think it would be better to profect from either the Subterranean Pivot that is the fourth Whole Sign House; or to profect from the IC, which probably would have more meaning for Modern Astrologers.

Profecting from the Subterranean Pivot, makes this year (starting on your last birthday) a Taurus year and thus Taurus takes on the role as your fourth house. Clearly this Full Moon is in Taurus, so if it has significance the significance would relate to your home life and family. Venus is Lord of the year (so at least that's not too ominous) and the month of the lunation is a Libra month (Venus again) and the day of the lunation appears to be a Pisces day.

On the day Venus is exactly conjunct your IC in Taurus and thus in the Moon opposes it by sign. So we have Taurus as an active sign during the year. We have Venus, it's ruler active but also Sun and Mars which are transiting Taurus at the time of the eclipse and Saturn and the Moon which oppose Taurus by sign and more to the point the Moon is 2 degrees off the opposition with Mars, and (of course) exactly opposite the Sun. Moreover the Moon and Saturn are in a mutually applying aspect and have less than three degrees separation (and of course Saturn is your Ascendant Ruler). The remaining two traditional planets, Mercury and Jupiter are inconjunct the lunation (Mercury in Aries and Jupiter in Gemini) though interestingly Mercury is applying to the degree of the previous New Moon (the start of the cycle) by conjunction and is just over two degrees from it (quite what the significance of that is I'm not sure LOL).

If you profected from the IC, this would be a Gemini year. This month would be a Scorpio Month (emphasising both Mars and the lunation) and the day would be an Aries day again bringing Mars to the fore. As Lord of the month (and day) Mars' transit of Taurus would activate those other planets transiting the sign, plus the two in opposition to it. Although not playing a major role Jupiter would be active because it's transiting Gemini (the sign of the year) and Mercury would be active as Lord of the year (but also not directly involved in the lunation).

If I profect from the Sun (or the MC), it's a Taurus month and Venus is again activated as a ruler and by transiting Jupiter while transiting Venus is close to the IC which she rules. It will be a Scorpio day thus activating natal Mars (aspected by the eclipse) while transiting Mars is opposite the eclipsed Moon.

Both profections seem to show this lunation as having some importance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia
....... I'm looking for the best time to try and reach a resoluiton with my ex, a beneficial one, of course.
Well you could try profections from the Lot of Fortune (or indeed releasing from the Lot of Fortune)

That would yield a Scorpio year and a Aries month which again brings focus onto this lunation, which involves both rulers of transiting Sun and Moon, one of which is ruler of the Lot. I think this comes down to how you see Mars - friend or foe?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia

The 9th of May eclipse will trine my Ascendant and natal Venus, in the 4th, while transiting Mars will conjunct the IC. It will be a profected Leo month from the Asc, Virgo day (activating natal Venus again? or Mercury?) and a profected Cancer month from the Sun and MC, Leo day (activating natal Sun probably and/or Saturn?).

What do you think, could I use any of these to schedule negotiations with my ex? Our issues are around my trip with my son back to Canada and my custody rights.
Profecting from the Subterranean Point or the IC moves the month on one sign, so it's now a Scorpio or a Sagittarius month respectively. Saturn is still retrograde in Scorpio, opposing the lunation but now only by sign, not by degree. Using the IC, Jupiter is involved but it's your twelfth house so it's a month for enemies (and in a real sense your ex is an 'enemy' here as he stands to gain from any loss on your part.

The New Moon occurs at 01:28 BST on the 10th May (according to my Moon phase app) and Delphic Oracle gives the time as 00:28 UT. So whilst it's a Sagittarius Month it's a Capricorn day (so at least your Ascendant is involved).

From Fortune it's a Taurus month but a Gemini day (and natally Gemini is your sixth).

However far more important than the Astrology is getting your case sorted before you enter negotiations. Once your confident that your case is a strong as it can be, then is the time to pick the best day Astrologically.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia
I also checked the release but first I tried from Aries, Lot of Spirit, as in this case I'm trying to change the circumstances using my own will and effort. I'm in a Gemini L1 (active Mercury), Pisces L2 (active Jupiter) - both planets will be aspecting each other via transit towards the Lunar eclipse on April 25th. On the 28th of April there will be a Loose of Bond as L3 will switch from Gemini to Cancer and L4 - from Capricorn to Cancer. I thought this may be a good time for relations with others but it may activate enemies, how do I know which of these is more probable?

If I release from Fortune there is nothing significant, it's a Scorpio L4. Should I consider other points or planets to release from?
Provisionally I'd say that the switch from Gemini to Cancer is a positive shift (sixth to seventh house) but if you're involved in legal issues by then, the switch is to your opponent (your ex), this would be stressed by the shift from Capricorn (Ascendant and you) to Cancer (the Descendant and someone else). \

I'll do some further chase-up on that transfer but as Dave often says, context is everything. If you're proposing negotiations at that point then things switch to your opponent. Something pretty nasty needs to be going on in Cancer at that time for you to feel confident.
Top   #198
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Minderwiz, I'm trying to prevent court proceedings. If we can negotiate successfully, the court case will be avoided. That's why I was looking for a good day to try again. It looks to me the Mercury/Jupiter transit should be significant (because Jupiter won't be there for many years to come) too and I tried to pinpoint a day around this transit using profections/release. The problem I have is Venus is a Sun ruler for my ex and I'm not sure entering Taurus and being strong she would be benefcial for me... On the other hand, I can't wait for her to be out of the sign.

As about the release switch to Cancer, that's what I wondered - how do I know if it will be good for me or not? If we can't predict or at least guess with astrology, what's the point of trying all these technics?

P.S. I thought Mars (or any other planet) would be defined by astrological methods as a friend or foe, how would I know if he's the former or the latter? If it's up to me to decide, that's not very good. LOL I wrote here that till now I can't really find a reason to believe Mars is a very strong player in my chart but I may be wrong or missing something.
Top   #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia View Post
Minderwiz, I'm trying to prevent court proceedings. If we can negotiate successfully, the court case will be avoided. That's why I was looking for a good day to try again. It looks to me the Mercury/Jupiter transit should be significant (because Jupiter won't be there for many years to come) too and I tried to pinpoint a day around this transit using profections/release. The problem I have is Venus is a Sun ruler for my ex and I'm not sure entering Taurus and being strong she would be benefcial for me... On the other hand, I can't wait for her to be out of the sign.
Hellenistic Astrologers placed seem to place more emphasis on planetary phases when assessing their potential for 'good' or 'bad' in given circumstances. Thus, using Venus as an example, it is currently 'set' and it will not have a helical rising till late May, so it's not really a time to depend on Venus for good fortune (but as you think Venus is more likely to favour him, then now might be the time to act when Venus is in a weak state for him). Jupiter will have a helical setting couple of days later, so you would lose a favourable Jupiter at the same time he acquires a rising Venus. Jupiter's helical rising will be 10 July.

So what time period have you got as your limits for action?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia
As about the release switch to Cancer, that's what I wondered - how do I know if it will be good for me or not? If we can't predict or at least guess with astrology, what's the point of trying all these technics?
Mars is your out of sect malefic - so generally you should be careful of it and treat it as a potential threat - it likes natally in Cancer, so and activation of Cancer will activate it. Furthermore as Cancer is your seventh, it is the house of 'open enemies'

Whilst generally a switch from Saturn to the Moon would be considered good, in your case, Saturn is your Ascendant ruler and the Moon rules your seventh. You have generally found Saturn supportive, so I would not see a Capricorn to Cancer switch as being favourable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ronia
P.S. I thought Mars (or any other planet) would be defined by astrological methods as a friend or foe, how would I know if he's the former or the latter? If it's up to me to decide, that's not very good. LOL I wrote here that till now I can't really find a reason to believe Mars is a very strong player in my chart but I may be wrong or missing something.
Well you could make the decision based on your experience to date. Saturn, generally speaking is malefic, yet your (and my) experience shows that he can be a constructive help in certain charts. Mars is your Sun ruler but is the out of sect malefic - his effect is likely to be variable and not always supportive by any means - so given your feelings on Mars (which I was aware of) you should be circumspect about any strong involvement - it could go either way but should not be relied on to be favourable, especially if he aspects the Ascendant at the time when you begin to act.

I've found some relevant material for Dorotheus, which might be useful and I'll post that as the next post.
Top   #200




 


 


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