le pendu
Hi Everyone,
I'm new here, but have been researching a lot of the posts and really enjoy reading your thoughts on Tarot history. I have couple of ideas I would like some feedback on.
Last year I came across Giotto's Virtues and Vices, and feel convinced (as Decker is mentioned to be in the Encylopedia of Tarot) that they (or something based on them) played a major part in the development of the tarot.
I wonder if most of the cards in the our current deck can be attributed to 3 origins?
1. Giottos Virtues and Vices
2. Petrarch's Triumps
3. Imperatori
If there were an original 14 card deck, I'd suggest a deck made of just the virtues and vices. With the vice of Foolishness being the first trump taken by it's virtue Prudence; Inconstancy (wheel) the third trump taken by Fortitude... etc. This would be an extremely easy system to understand/remember with a built-in hierarchy.
I'm particularly interested in the Vices. Just looking at the iconography, I can't help but notice the similarities to many of the Major Arcana. In fact, if indeed some of our cards come from here, it would explain WHY some of the more "mysterious" cards are included.
So here's my suggestion for a combination created from the Virtues/Vices/Triumphs:
Virtues
--------
Prudence - Missing
Fortitude
Temperance
Justice
Faith - Missing except for Cary-Yale (or Pope???)
Charity - Missing except for Cary-Yale
Hope - Missing except for Cary-Yale
Vices
--------
Foolishness - Fool
Inconstancy - Wheel of Fortune
Ira - Missing
Injustice - Tower
Infidelity - Missing (or Popess???)
Envy - Devil
Desperation - Hanged man
Triumphs
------------
Love - Lovers
Chastity - Triumphal Chariot
Death - Death
Fame - World
Time - Hermit
Eternity - Angel
or our contemporary sequence:
Fool - Vice of Foolishness
Bagatto
Popess - Vice of Infidelity
Empress
Emperor
Pope - Virtue of Faith
Lovers - Triumph of Love
Chariot - Triumph of Chastity
Justice - Virtue of Justice
Hermit - Triumph of Time
Wheel of Fortune - Vice of Inconstancy
Strength - Virtue of Fortitude
Hanged Man - Vice of Desperation
Death - Triumph of Death
Temperance - Virtue of Temperance
Devil - Vice of Envy
Tower - Vice of Injustice
Star
Moon
Sun
Angel - Triumph of Eternity
World - Triumph of Fame
This scenerio would explain most of the cards. Perhaps the Star, Moon and Sun cards were added as a set at a later point.
That would leave The Bagatto, Popess, Pope, Emperor and Empress unaccounted for. I'm not sure my suggested Faith/Infidelity - Pope/Popess relationship is accurate, but it would create an explanation for how the Popess got into the deck, so let's leave it for now.
Assume the Emperor and Empress are leftovers from an Imperatori deck, then we have only the Bagatto to account for; which I would place with the Triumphs, representing "man" who is triumphed by Love. I can't think of any other reason for his presence in the deck.
Now consider the Cary-Yale deck. If it had 16 trumps they might be the virtues, triumphs, and Imperatori, (there are no vice cards present):
Prudence
Fortitude
Temperance
Justice
Faith
Charity
Hope
(Bagatto)
Love
Chastity (Chariot)
Death
Fame (World)
Time (Hermit)
Eternity (Angel)
Emperor
Empress
I'm really curious to get some of your views on these suggestions. I've been racking my brain on it for months, hoping to present it in a more concise, authenticated form.. but it is only my conjectures at this point.
best,
robert
I'm new here, but have been researching a lot of the posts and really enjoy reading your thoughts on Tarot history. I have couple of ideas I would like some feedback on.
Last year I came across Giotto's Virtues and Vices, and feel convinced (as Decker is mentioned to be in the Encylopedia of Tarot) that they (or something based on them) played a major part in the development of the tarot.
I wonder if most of the cards in the our current deck can be attributed to 3 origins?
1. Giottos Virtues and Vices
2. Petrarch's Triumps
3. Imperatori
If there were an original 14 card deck, I'd suggest a deck made of just the virtues and vices. With the vice of Foolishness being the first trump taken by it's virtue Prudence; Inconstancy (wheel) the third trump taken by Fortitude... etc. This would be an extremely easy system to understand/remember with a built-in hierarchy.
I'm particularly interested in the Vices. Just looking at the iconography, I can't help but notice the similarities to many of the Major Arcana. In fact, if indeed some of our cards come from here, it would explain WHY some of the more "mysterious" cards are included.
So here's my suggestion for a combination created from the Virtues/Vices/Triumphs:
Virtues
--------
Prudence - Missing
Fortitude
Temperance
Justice
Faith - Missing except for Cary-Yale (or Pope???)
Charity - Missing except for Cary-Yale
Hope - Missing except for Cary-Yale
Vices
--------
Foolishness - Fool
Inconstancy - Wheel of Fortune
Ira - Missing
Injustice - Tower
Infidelity - Missing (or Popess???)
Envy - Devil
Desperation - Hanged man
Triumphs
------------
Love - Lovers
Chastity - Triumphal Chariot
Death - Death
Fame - World
Time - Hermit
Eternity - Angel
or our contemporary sequence:
Fool - Vice of Foolishness
Bagatto
Popess - Vice of Infidelity
Empress
Emperor
Pope - Virtue of Faith
Lovers - Triumph of Love
Chariot - Triumph of Chastity
Justice - Virtue of Justice
Hermit - Triumph of Time
Wheel of Fortune - Vice of Inconstancy
Strength - Virtue of Fortitude
Hanged Man - Vice of Desperation
Death - Triumph of Death
Temperance - Virtue of Temperance
Devil - Vice of Envy
Tower - Vice of Injustice
Star
Moon
Sun
Angel - Triumph of Eternity
World - Triumph of Fame
This scenerio would explain most of the cards. Perhaps the Star, Moon and Sun cards were added as a set at a later point.
That would leave The Bagatto, Popess, Pope, Emperor and Empress unaccounted for. I'm not sure my suggested Faith/Infidelity - Pope/Popess relationship is accurate, but it would create an explanation for how the Popess got into the deck, so let's leave it for now.
Assume the Emperor and Empress are leftovers from an Imperatori deck, then we have only the Bagatto to account for; which I would place with the Triumphs, representing "man" who is triumphed by Love. I can't think of any other reason for his presence in the deck.
Now consider the Cary-Yale deck. If it had 16 trumps they might be the virtues, triumphs, and Imperatori, (there are no vice cards present):
Prudence
Fortitude
Temperance
Justice
Faith
Charity
Hope
(Bagatto)
Love
Chastity (Chariot)
Death
Fame (World)
Time (Hermit)
Eternity (Angel)
Emperor
Empress
I'm really curious to get some of your views on these suggestions. I've been racking my brain on it for months, hoping to present it in a more concise, authenticated form.. but it is only my conjectures at this point.
best,
robert