How is 10 Swords different from death?

Ive only ever used rider Waite based decks, and I've never understood why there are two cards that vividly show an ending. You know, I'm just gonna throw four of swords in there as well because that's a coffin. So why are there three cards that have to do with death and what exactly are the differences among them?

If I had to take a guess, and I'm only guessing here, Death is about total destruction. 10 of swords has a chance of continuing, but a lot of things must change, and four of swords is reprieve.

For example, if someone asked you about their relationship, and you only pulled one card, how would your answer differ from each card? (Or you could put in any area- career, family, what have you. Whatever gives you a better way to explain the differences)

In my own interpretation, Death usually indicates a major transition. The end of something but also the beginning of something new. Again, this is a major transition, not being moved from the 10-6 shift to the 11-7 shift.

The 4 of swords, depending on how it is dignified, I read as either a period of calm after something difficult or the period of calm before facing a known difficulty.

The 10 of swords is almost universally bad. I know it can be positively dignified but I personally have yet to see it.

Please note, I learn to read on a Thoth deck, and I do not use reversals.

Namaste.

Eric.

SweetSiren said:

Ive only ever used rider Waite based decks, and I've never understood why there are two cards that vividly show an ending. You know, I'm just gonna throw four of swords in there as well because that's a coffin. So why are there three cards that have to do with death and what exactly are the differences among them?

If I had to take a guess, and I'm only guessing here, Death is about total destruction. 10 of swords has a chance of continuing, but a lot of things must change, and four of swords is reprieve.

For example, if someone asked you about their relationship, and you only pulled one card, how would your answer differ from each card? (Or you could put in any area- career, family, what have you. Whatever gives you a better way to explain the differences)

Click to expand...

Well one is a major arcana. The death card is pretty intense but death in the picture is a skeleton being represented as death. The 10 of swords is an actual dead person which death has already come for.

If I were to see these cards in a relationship the10 of swords might tell me that there is a lot of back stabbing in this relationship. One is carrying a burden from the other and they are suffering in the relationship. This also might tell me there is abuse happening as well and they aren't doing anything about it..

Death in a relationship could indicate the ending of the relationship and a dead end so to say. It could also tell me that there will or might be a very big dramatic change in the relationship that could change the course of their lives e.g. near death experience which might leave the other handicapped for example.

Swords also represent the mind remember so perhaps the relationship is losing the connection between lovers of the mind. The physicality of the lovers may be hotter than ever but mind wise they know it just won't work out.

Both are an ending somehow I guess and it's a good question because I actually thought this a while back until I just went with my gut.. I'd be interested to know what others think too.

SweetSiren said:

Ive only ever used rider Waite based decks, and I've never understood why there are two cards that vividly show an ending. You know, I'm just gonna throw four of swords in there as well because that's a coffin. So why are there three cards that have to do with death and what exactly are the differences among them?

If I had to take a guess, and I'm only guessing here, Death is about total destruction. 10 of swords has a chance of continuing, but a lot of things must change, and four of swords is reprieve.

For example, if someone asked you about their relationship, and you only pulled one card, how would your answer differ from each card? (Or you could put in any area- career, family, what have you)

Click to expand...

Hi SweetSiren,

Very interesting and fair question. I think you're here only thinking of the Death card and the 10 of Swords card in their mutual interpretations of endings and pain. But what sets Death and the 10 of Swords apart is that they independently mean much more: Death, as I have always known it, is primarily, generally about transformation and change, usually difficult to go through, but there is always a light at the end of Death's tunnel; The 10 of Swords is about an ending yes, but personally I see it as more of a beating down (the dude is dead on the ground with Swords in his back), the proverbial "mob" coming for you, as tradition would have it. And the 10 of Swords, because it is of the Minor Arcana, which deals with everyday events over which we have more control than that of the Major Arcana, means that the events of that card might have been preventable or controllable to some extent. The Death card, because it is a Major Arcanum, is a card of "major" energy and events in our lives that we oftentimes just have to ride through to survive. I hope that my explanation helps you to understand how these two cards are different.

Death highlights a transitional experience without the treachery, betrayal or near breakdown mental state of the 10S. The situation behind the 10S is always very difficult whereas there is no situation specifically tagged to death so it could apply to anything, a longed for retirement from a fulfilling job for example. Many cards overlap slightly but they're worlds apart.

For me, the Death card is a more natural ending. Something has reached the end of its life, and is now over. There may be grief and sadness, but it is expected and in the natural order of things. More organic, in some sense.

The 10 of Swords is more like an abrupt ending to a mental or Machiavellian process. It may be betrayal; it may simply be the final sword in a painful process. Or it is death-by-a-thousand-cuts: no big finale, but the painful realization that clinging is doing more damage than ending the process. Often the 10 of Swords is about mental misery and the behavior of other humans.

The Four of Swords is the pausing of hostilities. It's not the end, just a truce while everyone tends to their wounds (often mental). But the knight will rise and rejoin the battle once s/he is refreshed enough to do so.

I think Crystalseas nailed it.

Death really is all about something's time being "up," as Crystalseas said, and an important part of the card is that there will be grief and sadness. A concert ends, a story ends, a store closes its doors, etc. Things end. And the card says that you will feel sad about this and need to grieve. It says that with this gone there will be an empty spot. And it promises that something new will move into that spot. It won't be the same as that which ended, but it will fill the void.

10/Swords: In agreement with Crystalseas, this is something that has been "murdered." And you have to keep in mind "Swords" refers to the intellect and communication. So, this may not be a literal killing (like someone killed your goldfish). Rather, it's more in line with someone cutting off all communication, or killing an idea, or twitter attacks that force someone into silence. And yes, there is the element of the unexpected, and of betrayal. The RWS image, in fact, refers to Solomon's architect who, refusing to reveal secrets to a pair of ruffians, was murdered.

Which puts an interesting spin on the story as it means our dead man wasn't just murdered, he was martyred.

4/Swords isn't about death, but rest and healing, especially mental healing. The RWS image of a man lying on his coffin is from a crusader practice. During the crusades, knights would have a sepulcher made in case they died in battle. Their body would be sent back home and have a resting place. If they lived, then when they returned home they'd spend a night in the church, lying in or atop that sepulcher in prayer. They would meditate on the fact that they could have died, but didn't, thank god for that, and promise god that they'd make good use of that life. So, that is why it *looks* like the man has died in that image. But he hasn't. He's avoided death, and has taken this time off from war to meditate, in peace, on life and living.

Eric in NJ said:

The 10 of swords is almost universally bad. I know it can be positively dignified but I personally have yet to see it.

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I can't speak for the Thoth deck, but RWS features the story of Solomon's architect, Hiram, who, as I mentioned in my post above, refused to tell his deepest secrets (passwords and such) to some ruffians and was murdered by them.

What this means is that while the card isn't so happy, it does have an interesting spin. Masonicly speaking, Hiram is a martyr, and is kind of the St. Peter of Masons, the guy you meet on entering heaven if you've been a good Mason. The idea is that it is better to take secrets to the grave (and be admitted to a higher spiritual plane), then divulge them to those who are unworthy and live disgraced and with no hope of achieving that higher spiritual position after you die.

So, while you're right that the card doesn't usually have a good result, it might, spiritually and intellectually speaking, be a better, necessary and even desired result compared to an alternative where the "murder" is avoided. I know it's small comfort, but the RWS image shows the victim of murder, and that's better than being a murderer. Likewise, our victim was betrayed, but this is better than being the one who betrays. Thus, if we view the card according to that story, then we have a card about integrity, fidelity, etc.

10 of swords is worries so bad, they pin you to the ground. Death is major change in some way. Death can be positive, 10 of swords is positive only in the sense that nothing worse can happen, the worse has ALREADY happened.

I see the minor acana as progressing through the suit. Ace as beginnings and 10 as endings. So Ace of swords--new direction, 9 of swords--is waking in the night so stressed you can't sleep. The Background is absolutely black. With 10, it is so bad, you are paralyzed, totally stuck. But in the RWS card, in the background the dawn is breaking and a new day (and a new chance to fix things) appears. As they say, it is always darkest before the dawn.

barb

SweetSiren said:

Ive only ever used rider Waite based decks, and I've never understood why there are two cards that vividly show an ending. You know, I'm just gonna throw four of swords in there as well because that's a coffin. So why are there three cards that have to do with death and what exactly are the differences among them?

If I had to take a guess, and I'm only guessing here, Death is about total destruction. 10 of swords has a chance of continuing, but a lot of things must change, and four of swords is reprieve.

For example, if someone asked you about their relationship, and you only pulled one card, how would your answer differ from each card? (Or you could put in any area- career, family, what have you. Whatever gives you a better way to explain the differences)

Click to expand...

Ten of Swords is a new beginning. Death is a transformation..a complete change.