Proximity of Sun/Merc/Venus

Ophiel

One issue I never quite resolved when I studied astrology 'a few years back' (wishful thinking) was the natal 'closenessl of these three 'planets', Sun, Mercury, and Venus. That keeps the flavors of them all in the same corner. I don't have in front of me the max distance that these three can be apart, but it is something like a few signs, right? This negates the possibility of say a Sun in Libra, with Mercury in Aries and Venus in Capricorn. Yes, house placement is a way around this problem (possibly only I see it as a problem. LOL.) And the aspects between the 'planets' will obviously color the expression of everything in the chart. But this keeps the quality of these three 'planets' in the same basic quadrant, no?

I've never read any books on the personal planets, and perhaps this 'problem' is addressed in such a book?
 

Minderwiz

That's correct Mac,

From an Earth perspective Mercury never strays more than 28 degrees from the Sun in either direction - when it reaches its greatest Eastern elongation it appears to stop and then move backwards - i.e. it turns Retrograde. It carries on Retrograde till it reaches its greatest Western elongation and then stops it then begins to move direct again and towards the Sun.

The same holds with Venus although the elongation is around 48 degrees. This means that if Mercury is not in the same sign as the Sun it must be in one of the two adjacent signs. Venus can just about be two signs further from the Sun but is more likely only one.
 

Ophiel

Minderwiz wrote: The same holds with Venus although the elongation is around 48 degrees. This means that if Mercury is not in the same sign as the Sun it must be in one of the two adjacent signs. Venus can just about be two signs further from the Sun but is more likely only one.

And...do you think this is a bit confining, addressing my real question here...that these three are always that close? Are the differences determinded more by house placement, rulerships, that sort of thing? I recall from years ago that one gets more 'information' about a planet by looking what the ruler of that house the planet appears in is doing in the chart. Or is it the aspects? Say Venus is in opposition to Neptune, thus giving the Venutian energy in the chart a much different 'flavor' than if it was unaspected by Neptune and Venus being with a sign or two of the Sun placement?

I get stuck on these 'issues' and it sure holds me back. It did a few years ago and I never resolved this one.
 

Minderwiz

Hi Ophiel,

I don't really think it is that confining. OK Mercury and Venus have a limited range of aspects to the Sun but they can take on a full range of aspects to any other planet or points. Also there are 15 possible combinations of Mercury and Venus for any Sun Sign - with 12 possible Sun signs that gives a range of 180 possible personality types based on these three planets alone in any one year of births, and this ignores totally the Ascendant and Moon placements which are vital elements of the Psychology of the personality.

Mercury and Venus pass through all the signs in just under a year which is faster than any other planet except for the Moon (which passes through them all in a lunar month). Giving a very wide range of possible aspects for people born in any one year - or indeed month.

Whilst the planets from Mars to Pluto can have a full range of aspects to the Sun it will take Jupiter just under six years to complete all possible aspects (on its 'outward' journey and the same again for the 'inward journey) by the time you reach Neptune and Pluto you may well not get all the aspects to the Sun in a lifetime. For Natal purposes the sign placements of Uranus, Neptune and Pluto are virtually irrelevant as are the mutual aspects between these signs - a Neptune/Pluto sextile will be shared by everyone born in a twelve month period. Indeed the relative positions of the three outer planets changes so slowly that compared to them Sun Mercury and Venus seem to give a far more vibrant range of possibilities. Yes Sun, Moon and Mercury may be ‘confined’ to one quarter of the chart but the outer planets are even more confining, for example everyone born between mid December 1988 and Early November 1995 had Pluto in Scorpio and Uranus and Neptune in Capricorn – wherever they fell in House terms they occupied a range of just three signs and the only possible major aspects were a Uranus/Neptune conjunction or Sextiles between Pluto and either or both of the other two.

I think the point is more that if we take the five personal planets plus the Ascendant we get an extremely large number of possible personality traits - Add in the influence of Jupiter and Saturn and the possibilites are almost endless - and there's still that generational affect of the outer planets to take in.
 

Ophiel

I see. As a Sag, I didn't like seeing limitations on the possibilities and when the Sun can never be that far from Mercury or Venus, well, it just seemed unfair! LOL. With my Anthroposophical background, I tend to see the Sun and the Ego, Mercury as the Thinking process, Venus as the Feeling Process. Perhaps Mars is the Will. The big three, Thinking Feeling, Willing, with the Sun acting as the center, the spiritual Ego.

I will work my way past the limitations in my thinking here. There is so much more in astrology to focus on than one quirky thing that I don't understand.