Copyright on tarot images - for an e-book

Sandalwood

Hi,

I have written an E-book on writing with the tarot cards. It's finished, edited and basically ready to go see the world.
However, I wonder about the images of tarot cards. Can I use them? (especially the RWS). I have altered them, since I made pictures of them myself and I think when doing that I am allowed to show them, but I'm not 100% sure. Or should I just start e-mailing US Games and asking them about it and ask for permission? Better safe than sorry

Does anyone know anything about this.

Love to hear. Thank you!

gregory

You can easily use black and white RWS. I would be VERY CAREFUL INDEED with coloured. When you say made pictures yourself - unless you own a Pam A, B C or D and scanned that - the copyright is - according to USG - with them. And they DO go after people.

Don't bother asking USG unless you are very very rich. Their fees are terrifying.

Here's a recent thread with links. Take it seriously....:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=225457

Sandalwood

gregory said:
You can easily use black and white RWS. I would be VERY CAREFUL INDEED with coloured. When you say made pictures yourself - unless you own a Pam A, B C or D and scanned that - the copyright is - according to USG - with them. And they DO go after people.

Don't bother asking USG unless you are very very rich. Their fees are terrifying.

Here's a recent thread with links. Take it seriously....:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=225457

Thank you Gregory!
Okay, I think I will just opt for the black & white ones then.
I don't know if it's a Pam A, B, C or D. I purchased it in the 90's.
I'm not sure on the rules on art works when you alter a shot and make it your own (I think that normally frees some of the copyrights, like in a collage etc.). But I'm just not sure and it's normally quite complicated.

Thank you for this valuable information!

gregory

Sandalwood said:
Thank you Gregory!
Okay, I think I will just opt for the black & white ones then.
I don't know if it's a Pam A, B, C or D. I purchased it in the 90's.
I'm not sure on the rules on art works when you alter a shot and make it your own (I think that normally frees some of the copyrights, like in a collage etc.). But I'm just not sure and it's normally quite complicated.

Thank you for this valuable information!

Oh it won't be a Pam - unless you paid $$$$$$ for it - they are the ones from when it was first issued - 1910 and thereabouts.

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=226269

I was sort of kidding, though you would be OK if you really had such a thing !

Believe me, I am SURE that photographs of a US games deck will NOT get you off their hooks. Good luck with the book.

Sulis

I think if you've altered the artwork and not just used the images on the cards you're OK.. Carol Herzer has got away with it for her Illuminated Tarot because she's coloured the images herself so they are now her artwork and Seven Stars has used original artwork but slightly altered too so if you've re-drawn the images yourself I think you'll be OK.

gregory

But if they are scans or photos... even altered, I'd worry, myself.

Sulis

So how does Seven Stars get away with making her decks? They are just aged but the same images are used and to my eyes are hardly altered at all apart from some age spots and a different title or font.

And Carol Herzer uses the Pixie Smiths exact images but colours them in so that they look like her original artwork but the lines are the same as in the originals and I presume she started off with a photo or a scan.

gregory

Sulis said:
So how does Seven Stars get away with making her decks? They are just aged but the same images are used and to my eyes are hardly altered at all apart from some age spots and a different title or font.

And Carol Herzer uses the Pixie Smiths exact images but colours them in so that they look like her original artwork but the lines are the same as in the originals and I presume she started off with a photo or a scan.

I don't know - in the case of Carol I have often wondered. But have a word with tarotbear. USG is not a company I would want to mess with !

tarotbear

Sandalwood said:
Hi,

I have written an E-book on writing with the tarot cards. It's finished, edited and basically ready to go see the world. However, I wonder about the images of tarot cards. Can I use them? (especially the RWS). I have altered them, since I made pictures of them myself and I think when doing that I am allowed to show them, but I'm not 100% sure.

I am not the expert here - I just dealt with USGS a lot in the past.

If you are using artwork that you yourself did not draw - you need to get permission from someone - whether it's a paper book, ebook, printed on lettuce leaves, etc. 'Altered' can mean anything from you added an extra feather on a hat to the Charioteer is now driving a Ferrari. What you need to look into - since you are not in the USA - is what in international copyright laws the definitions for 'derivative artwork' says. However - if you play with ANY deck images currently under USGS copyrighting - you will run afoul of USGS.

From your first post it sounds as though you are using images from several decks - do you have permission to do that from every deck's copyright owner? Even my derivative RWS 'Everyman Tarot' images are completely copyrighted - you cannot use them without my express permission.

The 'catch' here is that you will be selling the book and money will exchange hands - you will be making a profit using artwork that belongs to someone else...yes - that someone else will want their 'due'.

tarotbear

You may want to look at this 'Image Reproduction & Usage' link from USGS:

http://www.usgamesinc.com/pages.php?pageid=13