#2; Miss Piggy's ASCENDANT sign

dadsnook2000

Our second step, which will surprise some, is to speculate on what Miss Piggy's Ascendant sign is. There is a reason for this, which will become clear later.
Miss Piggy, as an icon, is very much "all personality from nose to tail." We know that she was very changeable (Gemini, maybe), dramatic (Pisces, perhaps), overbearing (Leo), very pushy (Aries). What would you say is her primary personality characteristic?

Once you decide tentatively on an Ascendant, you have also decided upon a house for her Moon. How does that house position fit the Moon sign you have chosen?

YOUR TASK at this step is to 1) choose an Ascendant sign, and 2) explain how the Moon (you chose the sign, remember) fit into its house position. I should point out that when we use the equal house system, it is possible for the Moon in its sign to be in the prior house as well as the sequential house. For example, if you picked a Leo Moon and a Pisces Ascendant, the Moon would be in the 6th house. But, if the Ascendant was 15 Pisces and the Moon was at 2 Leo, the Moon could be in the 5th house. So, you have some flexibility with this. Dave
 

Minderwiz

I think for the houses it's best to keep to either;

Equal houses (as described by Dave above)

or;

Whole sign houses - i.e. if you pick a Leo ascendant (for example) the whole of Virgo is the second, the whole of Leo is the third.....the whole of Cancer is the twelfth. This system is not only the oldest house system, it is in many ways the easiest to use in this exercise.

Dave rightly points out that you can have more flexibility with the former system because you can push Sun or Moon one house either way, by assuming early or later degrees The drawback is that if you push the Sun or Moon to the end of a house (i.e. in a different sign than the cusp) you weaken it somewhat, especially if it's an angular house. A first house Virgo Moon, with a Leo Ascendant is weaker than a first house Leo Moon with a Leo Ascendant (and it's stronger if it is close to that Ascendant (or other cusp).

Ignore the other house systems, they won't add anything to this exercise.
 

MCsea

yipppee will think about this today..
first up I think Taurus (luxury) but we will see how I feel at the end of the day... (I seem to be projecting my chart onto poor ol Miss Piggy!)

MARINA
 

ANA

Dave and Minderwiz

where sould i go and read about how chosing the ascendant goes with the house and how it needs to fit with the moon and the house the moon would be in

this - how the houses fit in - is a part that kinda intimidates me i never realy understood it

i am tempted to go the inverse way chose a house for the moon that best fits the one i chose and how it manifests itself in her instinctual reaction and then see what sign it gives me for the ascendant but here is were i need some reading.........

the ascendat is in first house right?
so lets say i decide that the moon i choose mostly manifests in house 9 , that means house 9 has aries as a sign and then i go forward from aries next sign is in house 10 and so forth untill i get to the first house that will have a certain sign on it and then that is the ascendant?

this going backwards from the moon and its house seems more logical to me but i dont know if it makes any sense from a proper way of building a chart

or not i kinda got confused by miderwiz post

i get a feel i am getting this wrong here, is it that the signs go backwards and the houses go forward? i mean full sign houses so from the example: leo ascendant, then if leo is in 1 then virgo is in 2 but then how is leo in 3?

could you please provide some guidance, as in please help!...;-))

thank you both
ana
 

dadsnook2000

Houses and signs

There is no way to "build a chart" in that normally charts are themselves and reflect a situation at a given time and place. Build a chart is contrary to all astrological practice but it does free our minds from fixed routines and bad habits.

If you want an Aries Moon in the 9th house, the 10th house would have Taurus, the 11th house Gemini, the 12th house Cancer, the 1st house Leo. Leo would be your choice of the Ascendant.

If you chose Pisces as the Ascendant, working the other way, an Aries Moon would be in the 2nd house. Does this help? Dave
 

Minderwiz

Ana

As Dave says, this is in many ways an unrealistic exercise. Real charts have a number of features that show contradictions, oddities and (from our point of view) inconsistencies) - a bit like real people if you think about it!! Trying to reverse engineer one can at best only identify a few features and can never identify the 'odd' features.

However there are some 'rules' that we can't avoid. The zodiac signs have an order that can't be broken, from Arie to Pisces, so if we have an ascendant in Aries and a Moon in Leo, the Moon cannot be in, say the eighth house, using a whole sign approach (or any other house system unless we are very near the poles).

In this case we suggest either equal houses or whole sign houses, so it means that you could do either one of two things. So you have a choice of two ways of going about it:

Firstly you could take the approach that Dave is going through. Fix the Moon's sign and then fix the Ascendant. In that case you have to accept the house that results. For example if you decided on a Leo Ascendant and a Cancer Moon, then the Moon is going to be in either the twelfth or eleventh houses.

The second approach is the one you touched on in your earlier post. You could fix the Moon's house position first. If you also set the Moon's sign then you will fix the sign of the Ascendant, by counting on as Dave outlined above. Alternatively you could se the Moon's house and the Ascendant sign - in which case the Moon sign is determined automatically (whether you like it or not). For example if you want a Leo Ascendant and Moon in the ninth, then (going by whole signs) the Moon would be in Aries.
 

Minderwiz

Well no one's posted for a day, so I'll throw in something contoversial, and see if it stimulates any response (if only from Dave LOL)

I said in the 'personality' thread that I thought she had some Phlegm in her temperament, firstly because of her body shape (well rounded and plump in the right places) and also some willingness to change strategies and turn on the charm when she can't get what she wants by frontal assault.

As the body and health is a first house issue, I'm going for a Water sign ascendant. Now, like the Moon, the Ascendant contributes 40% in Dorian Greenbaum's system. half of that (20%) is the Sign, 10% the Ascendant ruler and 10% the Ascendant almuten (planet with most essential dignity at the Ascendant degree). Now I don't want too much phlegm, which means I will discard Cancer, (ruled by the Moon, which is also phlegmatic).

That leaves Scorpio and Pisces. Scorpio is ruled by Mars and Mars is also the almuten - so that would add 20% Phlegm and 20% Choler (Mars is of course a firey planet).

Pisces is ruled by Jupiter which is a sanguine (airy) planet - I do need some sanguinity, so that's not too bad. The almuten varies both by degree of the sign and whether it's a day or night birth. Venus, Jupiter and Mars have almuten status depending on which degree I chose. BUT if I go for Pisces, then, given my choice of Moon in a fire sign, I'm faced with putting the Moon in the second house (Aries), sixth house (Leo) or tenth (Sagittarius). Of those the tenth is best but Sagittarius is my third choice for Moon sign.

If I put the Ascendant in Scorpio, I have a choice of the same houses but this time the Moon is in either, the second (Sagittarius), sixth (Aries) or tenth (Leo). I quite fancy a tenth House Moon, with the Sun as the tenth ruler.

So I'm going for a Scorpio ascendant - note I've not paid any attention to modern views of Scorpio (and there are pro Scorpio arguments on a modern basis) but have kept to my original temperament assessment.

I now have a Scorpio Ascendant, ruled by Mars (so Mars' condition will be important); a Leo tenth house Moon (so again the Sun's condition will be important). To meet my overall temperament assessment I need the contribution of the Sun to temperament to be Sanguine.
 

franniee

I would have to go for Taurus or Leo

I know they are both different but she is fiery and loves to be held on a pedestal - leo but her love of the material - living in the moment - being corporeal.... Taurus....
 

Minderwiz

One of the drawbacks of doing things one at a time is that we don't easily see possible relationships. I agree with frannie that Taurus is in there somewhere - but for me, that will come later.

So a good choice frannie.
 

ANA

so i decided to first fix the house for the moon, i am staying with my choice of an Aries moon
then i went to look at some key words for the houses, knowing how self absorbed and selfish she is and how proeminent her moon is and that it is the infant moon of the zodiac - me myself and I, i decided that the moon should not be in any of the "we" houses where the soul has grown and is learning how to share, so i eliminated houses 7-12
then i looked at where is her moon the most proeminent - and to me it seemd like the second house is the best fit the house of "I have", she "has"' kermit she "has" her mirror she is actualy all about i want to have and i want it NOW

so counting the signs and the houses that gives me Pisces as the ascendant which i like because of the very sociable nature, fond of entertaining, love of the good life, vivacious at parties, talks too much and enjoys performing in front of a group

so moon in aries in the second house, pisces ascendant
ana