thedelakore
Im confused. Both of these cards are associated with victory, but who actually won if one card represents a person?
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The Chariot or 6 of Wands for victory
lantana
I'd say Six of Wands. It represents the immediate aftermath: the feeling of triumph, the celebration of your success, and others recognizing your efforts.
The Chariot has all the trappings for success, but that doesn't mean you'll win. Just that you're capable and the odds are good in your favor.
The Chariot has all the trappings for success, but that doesn't mean you'll win. Just that you're capable and the odds are good in your favor.
Barleywine
Waite gives the idea that the Charioteer is more of a spear-carrying warrior than the acknowledged champion we see in the 6 of Wands. He also uses the words "succor" and "providence," implying good comrades and good luck on the way to victory. It suggests the Chariot is still "in transit" toward triumph and mastery, while the 6 of Wands seems to have "arrived." In addition, the 6 of Wands is more a card of "day-to-day" matters while the Chariot is part of a much broader and deeper archetypal tapestry. This could even be seen as an "apples-and-oranges" comparison. I would stick with the 6 of Wands for "victory" with a small "v."
Thirteen
"Win-Win" vs. "Keep it together and keep moving!"
Compare this for a moment with the 9/Wands where the person is determined to hold his ground even though there is no one there to see him or cheer him...in that card, he has no one feeding him energy, no expectations that anyone will give him a parade if he does succeed. He's limping along on fumes.
Chariot, in RWS at least, the Chariot's position is post parade (or maybe pre-parade? or pre-battle?). Either way, this card is an instruction manual: how do you achieve victory? And you see it there in the card: Chariot, Charioteer, two "opposing" steeds all facing the same direction. A chariot, in other words, is put together for the sole purpose of racing in and out of battle. So the motto for this card is: "Keep it together and keep moving!" Once it's accomplished its mission, the horses go back to the stable, the charioteer back to whatever he usually does, and the chariot gets put away till the next time they're needed. Putting it another way, this is your stealth bomber, your secret weapon. It has a particular purpose, and it does that very well and very quickly, achieving victory. It's all about unifying and focusing to accomplish something.
In agreement with Latana, the 6/Wands is a fait accompli. Whatever the man on the horse has done, he's been so successful that he gets laurels and cheers and, essentially, a parade. In fact, this card is as much about the energy of victory as it is about victory. Where do we get that "winner" energy? In the 6/Wands, from wanting to make our family proud or to gain fame, glory and accolades. And wanting to win for others, gives those others energy. They support us and cheer us on ("Go on, son! We know you can do it!"). The motto for this card: "Win-Win" as it's a win for the victor, and for his team/supporters/fans. You know in his speech he's going to say, "I couldn't have done it without all of you cheering me on!"Im confused. Both of these cards are associated with victory, but who actually won if one card represents a person?
Compare this for a moment with the 9/Wands where the person is determined to hold his ground even though there is no one there to see him or cheer him...in that card, he has no one feeding him energy, no expectations that anyone will give him a parade if he does succeed. He's limping along on fumes.
Chariot, in RWS at least, the Chariot's position is post parade (or maybe pre-parade? or pre-battle?). Either way, this card is an instruction manual: how do you achieve victory? And you see it there in the card: Chariot, Charioteer, two "opposing" steeds all facing the same direction. A chariot, in other words, is put together for the sole purpose of racing in and out of battle. So the motto for this card is: "Keep it together and keep moving!" Once it's accomplished its mission, the horses go back to the stable, the charioteer back to whatever he usually does, and the chariot gets put away till the next time they're needed. Putting it another way, this is your stealth bomber, your secret weapon. It has a particular purpose, and it does that very well and very quickly, achieving victory. It's all about unifying and focusing to accomplish something.
JoyousGirl
If there's any relevance, maybe the one who sees or addresses both sides - and/or meets in the middle? The chariot having one black and one white sphinx.
Thirteen
The One in Control
But the Chariot is really having none of the black and white sphinx arguing or wanting see both sides of their argument. He has a vision for exactly what they need to do to succeed. And that's what he's going to make both of them do. The charioteer, after all, isn't between the sphinxes to see both sides or mediate. He's in the middle to pull those reins, to harness the power of both black and white sphinx and direct them to where he believes they ought to go in order to achieve that victory.
That's more like the 2/Swords. Or the High Priestess (seated between black/white pillars) Or Justice for that matter.If there's any relevance, maybe the one who sees or addresses both sides - and/or meets in the middle? The chariot having one black and one white sphinx.
But the Chariot is really having none of the black and white sphinx arguing or wanting see both sides of their argument. He has a vision for exactly what they need to do to succeed. And that's what he's going to make both of them do. The charioteer, after all, isn't between the sphinxes to see both sides or mediate. He's in the middle to pull those reins, to harness the power of both black and white sphinx and direct them to where he believes they ought to go in order to achieve that victory.
