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Pageofswords, this is for you....anyone else's input would be appreciated too.

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RohanMenon  RohanMenon is offline
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It is a Morinian thing


I read through Morin's Book 21 sometime before, and this stuck with me. Lilly and co don't use this idea afaik.

Frankly, I think all of us have different modes of processing a chart. I wouldn't worry about it. In any case I'm probably wrong, since I'm just a beginner.

What matters is accuracy of prediction. Time will prove one or both of us right, or wrong, and then we can use that feedback to refine technique.

I didn't pick up the 'other woman' in the chart at all, probably because I didn't look for it, or even consider it and tried to stick to the very basics ( which is all I know) . I don't have much faith in my abilities as an horary astrologer, just thought I'd give it a shot is all.

I hope it works out well for Page of Swords, but this chart isn't very encouraging. Still there is a mutual reception by face, and also a collection of light, so it just might work out.
Top   #21
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Sharla  Sharla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RohanMenon View Post
I spent about 5 minutes on the chart. and the web diagram isn't of a very good quality and my eyesight is not what it used to be in my youth lol.

If both are cadent, then in my reading that worsens the chances of a positive outcome.
Its ok lol.....just wasn't sure if you'd changed the house system to your liking....which could then have changed the houses the planets were in.....but i only use regiomontanus for horary.

Having both in cadent id see this as them both not making any move towards each other (just yet)....he could be the one who could change his mind and instigate action first, as he's in a cadent sign also, and she is in fixed.

Also both in fire signs so there seems to be some anger still between each other.
Top   #22
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Sharla  Sharla is offline
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Im not even seeing this mutual reception by face....saturn is in moons detriment and moon is peregrine.

Moon can't be receiving saturn by face, as saturn is already at 16 degrees....face only goes up to 10 degrees. Which is why i said saturn was detriment in regards to the moon.

The moon is 8 degrees so is not in any of saturn's dignities....making her peregrine.

Do you see what im seeing now ?
Top   #23
RohanMenon  RohanMenon is offline
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See this table of the Ptolemian dignities


http://www.skyscript.co.uk/essential_dignities.html

Moon at 8 Leo is in Saturn's face, and Saturn at 16 Sagittarius is in the Moon's face.

note: these are ***Ptolemian*** dignities, though afaik the faces/decans work even when you use Chaldean decans.

I'm trying to use those to learn horary (since those are what Lilly uses). In my normal practice I use Egyptian terms and also a sidereal zodiac and Placidus houses, which would give a completely different chart.

In any case

Leo has the first face/decan 0 to 10 degrees, ruled by Saturn. So the Moon's ( 8 degrees Leo) face ruler is Saturn.

and Sagittarius has the second decan 10-20 degrees ruled by the Moon. So Saturn (at 16 Sagittarius) has the Moon as face/decan ruler.

So there is a mutual reception by face/decan. That said decan/face is the weakest possible mutual reception. So there's that. But this is enough for the Moon and Saturn to have a shred of essential dignity and so are not peregrine.
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Sharla  Sharla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RohanMenon View Post

I didn't pick up the 'other woman' in the chart at all, probably because I didn't look for it, or even consider it and tried to stick to the very basics ( which is all I know) . I don't have much faith in my abilities as an horary astrologer, just thought I'd give it a shot is all.
The reason why i picked up someone else....is saturn is ruled by jupiter and jupiter is in the 5th house ruled by mercury yes, but mercury is also in the 6th house as saturn ( so he's not alone)....but jupiter is in the sign of libra, ruler being venus in the 7th house.

Also yes libra is intercepted here just like gemini.....so looks like the 7th and 12th houses are linked here because of this. So if i go by your theory, then venus and mercury are the rulers of both 12th and 5th houses......with mercury being with saturn and venus being placed in the 7th.....looks to me like a hidden "other woman" this guy has around him.

Infact gemini and libra being double signs and also sagittarius....then there could be more than one.
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Sharla  Sharla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RohanMenon View Post
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/essential_dignities.html

Moon at 8 Leo is in Saturn's face, and Saturn at 16 Sagittarius is in the Moon's face.

note: these are ***Ptolemian*** dignities, though afaik the faces/decans work even when you use Chaldean decans.

I'm trying to use those to learn horary (since those are what Lilly uses). In my normal practice I use Egyptian terms and also a sidereal zodiac and Placidus houses, which would give a completely different chart.

In any case

Leo has the first face/decan 0 to 10 degrees, ruled by Saturn. So the Moon's ( 8 degrees Leo) face ruler is Saturn.

and Sagittarius has the second decan 10-20 degrees ruled by the Moon. So Saturn (at 16 Sagittarius) has the Moon as face/decan ruler.

So there is a mutual reception by face/decan. That said decan/face is the weakest possible mutual reception. So there's that. But this is enough for the Moon and Saturn to have a shred of essential dignity and so are not peregrine.
I think i might get what your doing now....and this is the exact same chart i work from, so were on the same page this way.

So as saturn is 16 degrees sagittarius do i then look for what term saturn would be in at 16 degrees Leo .....as ive been changing the degree to the other significator i.e in this instance it would make saturn 8 degrees......making me see him as being in moons detriment.

Do you understand what i mean ?
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RohanMenon  RohanMenon is offline
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I don't think faces are calculated that way


The decan lord of a planet is determined by looking at what sign and degree the planet *actually occupies* in the chart, and no manipulation is necessary.

e.g in this chart. The Moon is in 8 degrees Leo. This means it is in the first (of three) decan of Leo. The lord of this decan/face (the first decan/face of Leo) is always Saturn.

Likewise Saturn, in this chart, is physically located at 16 Sagittarius. If you look at the sky at this point in time, that is where he'll be. Since each decan/face is 10 degrees, Saturn is in the second decan of Sagittarius (10 to 20 Sag). The decan lord of the second decan of Sagittarius is always the Moon, no matter where the Moon is in the chart.

The decans are 10 degree divisions of *signs*, and their lords are fixed. any planet in any given decan always has the same lord. One doesn't change the degrees of the planet first, at least for dignity calculations.

I am not sure if you are doing some advanced astrological technique, in which case I have to plead ignorance.
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Sharla  Sharla is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RohanMenon View Post
The decan lord of a planet is determined by looking at what sign and degree the planet *actually occupies* in the chart, and no manipulation is necessary.

e.g in this chart. The Moon is in 8 degrees Leo. This means it is in the first (of three) decan of Leo. The lord of this decan/face (the first decan/face of Leo) is always Saturn.

Likewise Saturn, in this chart, is physically located at 16 Sagittarius. If you look at the sky at this point in time, that is where he'll be. Since each decan/face is 10 degrees, Saturn is in the second decan of Sagittarius (10 to 20 Sag). The decan lord of the second decan of Sagittarius is always the Moon, no matter where the Moon is in the chart.

The decans are 10 degree divisions of *signs*, and their lords are fixed. any planet in any given decan always has the same lord. One doesn't change the degrees of the planet first, at least for dignity calculations.

I am not sure if you are doing some advanced astrological technique, in which case I have to plead ignorance.
I understand you now....thanks.

Your correct moon is in saturn's face and so is saturn in moons face, so yes there is mutual reception here by face.

Ive been using the significators own degree......so as the moon is 8 degrees, then looking at dignities ive been looking at moon in sagittarius at 8 degrees, which then makes the moon have no dignity here which is why i said she was peregrine. When i should have been looking at the moon in sagittarius at 16 degrees.

Totally understand where ive been going wrong with this now....thanks for explaining to me.
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RohanMenon  RohanMenon is offline
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No worries Sharla


You caught two errors of mine (with respect to the houses) so we both gained from this exercise. Thank *you*.
Top   #29
pageofswords9110  pageofswords9110 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RohanMenon View Post
Page of Swords get the 1st House, Her love interest gets the 7th
The 1st is ruled by the Moon, the Seventh by Saturn

Looking at dignities, neither planet has high dignity, but there is a mutual reception by (Ptolemaic) decan. I'd interpret this as an interest in and awareness of each other, but a weak one. The Moon is in a succedent house, and Saturn s cadent, so I'd imagine the person of interest is somehow hidden/not very visible or accessible, to PageOfSwords, who has some power in how the situation develops.

There is no aspect between the significators.
There is no translation of light.

However both significators do aspect Mercury, thus forming a "Collection of Light" scenario. Mercury rules the third {EDIT: no the 5th) and 12th houses, so there is probably a young person (a sibling?) or a child, an artist or someone like that who helps bring both parties closer together.

Looking at the aspects formed by the Moon, the aspect just before the chart was cast is an opposition to Mars, so I'd think there was some kind of minor conflict or break, and the aspect to be perfected immediately after the chart was cast is to Mercury, which would seem to (again) indicate a young person who is a 'go between' or binding them together.

So to conclude, I'd say yes there is the *possibility* of a romance blossoming, but it is quite embryonic (reinforced by the early degree rising), and very fragile, and a person with the characteristics of Mercury, known to both people, will help bring the matter to fruition (subject to the 'too early' and mercurial-back-and-forth nature).

So to answer the question yes PoS's lover has some feelings for her, but this is very weak, not necessarily romantic, and if it becomes stronger, will do so after much to and fro ing..

and that is my analysis. As I mentioned earlier, I am very much a newbie and have just barely started learning horary, So take all this with mountains of salt.
Thank you for your input. So at this point in time he is hidden as I've blocked him after him distancing himself. I'm tired of the back and forth nature of things and it's become stressful. This young person that's a go between maybe my friend as she insists on working things out between us. I'm not sure if she is in contact with him though.

I asked his feelings because he recently told me he was in love with me and thought of me often. But then like you said there was a minor conflict as he thought I was sending mixed signAls so the communication stopped. I could see a romance blossoming also but like you said ALOT of to and fro and I'm not sure it's completely worth it.

In sharlas reading she said she sees another woman do you see one also ?
Top   #30




 


 


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