is this an intercepted house?

I just received a couple of wonderful books by Stephen Arroyo "Chart Interpretation Handbook" and "Astrology, Karma, and Transformation" - I am looking over my chart and descriptions of aspects this morning. I notice, for example, I have Venus conjunt Saturn in Taurus, however Venus is in 9th house and Saturn in 8th ...how would I interpret that? does that mean there would be a blending of the two houses, like an open door between them because of the relationship of the planets. Gemini rules the 9th house and Taurus rules the 8th house, but due to the degrees Venus falls in to the 9th house. This isn't the only aspect like this for me, also happens with Mars in Sag conj Neptune in Scorpio, with Neptune in the 3rd house and Mars in the 4th. This makes for some interesting, complicated interpretation I would love to be able to be more skilled at interpreting charts for others, but I am starting with my own, to learn from, the same way that I have approached learning the Tarot.

btw, I have Sun in Cancer 0º, Moon in Virgo conjuct ascendant, Virgo rising. In fact, my first house is quite busy place, I have a stellum of planets there

thanks in advance for your input!

Hi and welcome to the Astrology forum. The books that you have are very good and well worth the read - I use both of them regularly.

It took me a couple of goes but I take it from your Mars/Neptune example that Venus is in Gemini and Saturn in Taurus. If this is the case then you have an out of sign aspect. Traditional Astrologers would simply have ignored this aspect - aspects had to be true to sign - so to be conjunct both planets would have to be in the same sign.

Modern Astrologers do allow out of sign Aspects but you should realise that you are in many ways dealing with a different animal - Arroyo himself recognised this in one of his lectures. A conjunction should be a blending of two planets in the same element - clearly you have a conjunction of Air and Earth (and Fire and Water).

Much will depend on how close to Gemini Saturn is and how close to Scorpio Mars is, if they are very close - a matter of last degree then you might treat them as being in the next sign - but this is forcing things a little - though there are Astrologers who would do it.

Again if, using the Venus example, Saturn is very near the ninth cusp (within 3 - 5 degrees) many traditional Astrologers would treat it as being in the ninth.

This is one of those cases where there is no easy answer - you need to ask yourself which of the various interpretations fits best - as its your chart, which do you think best describes you in these areas of your life?

Treat the sign issue as being more important than the House issue - If you had used a different House system you may well have found both Mars and Venus changing Houses as a result (or Saturn and Neptune for that matter).

By the way - this is not an intercepted sign.

An intercepted sign is when a sign fits completely into a house with the two cusps being in the adjacent signs - such as eight cusp being in late Taurus and ninth cusp being in early Cancer, with Gemini completely in the ninth.

This will only happens if you are not using the equal house system and of course, it does not happen every time - but it the chances do increase the further North (Northern Hemisphere) or South (Southern Hemisphere) you live.

thanks for your response, Minderwiz! I apologize if my post lacked sufficient clarity. Sometimes I type too fast for my own good!

In my chart I have Venus in Taurus 14º31' in the 9th house forming a loose conjunction Saturn in Taurus 5º58' in the 8th house. ....due to the degree dividing the cusps of the houses, Venus in Taurus falls into the 9th house which is ruled by Gemini. In the same way, Neptune in Scorpio 26º29' R falls into the 3rd house as well as Mars in Sag 3º33' R (even though Sag rules 4th house).

I am trying to figure out how you interpret those planetary aspects. Does having both Mars in Sag and Neptune in Scorpio give greater significance to 3rd house activity (communication). In your post you indicate the sign that the planet is in is more important than the house that it falls in. So I would first interpret the planets and their aspects, first, before I would look at the influence of what house the planet inhabits. Am I understanding this correctly?

Well I'm even more confused now LOL

If both Venus AND Saturn are in Taurus then EITHER Venus is in the eighth House OR the ninth is not ruled by Gemini, because the ninth cusp MUST be in Taurus from your information. For Gemini to rule the ninth the cusp MUST be in Gemini.

Strictly speaking signs don't rule - planets do. So if the ninth cusp were in Gemini then Mercury would rule the ninth, if the cusp was in Taurus then Venus rules the ninth.

The conjunction is wide and needs to be treated with some care - there will be some effect but it is likely to be relatively weak.

If you can supply your natal details - time place day/month/year I can give you a more positive result.

I was born on June 21, 1969 in Las Vegas NV at 11.17 am DST.

Thanks Oceanpoetry

I've done a quick chart and you do have Venus in the ninth and Saturn in the eigth and they are loosely conjunct but the ninth cusp is in Taurus - at 7 degrees 45 mins (using Placidus Houses).

As Saturn is less than 2 degrees from the ninth cusp I'd tend to see its influence in both Houses - the conjunction orb is a little wide but I do think its worth trying to see if you can see any influence from it - if not don't count it.

The Neptune Mars is out of sign but close enough to count as a conjunction - remember that the elements are different - water and fire respectively so it will not work in the same way as a normal conjunction - you might find that it involves a certain amount of steam!!!!!

thanks Minderwiz!

I really appreciate you looking at that for me. Sorry for the confusion! That helps me! I usually have read Saturn in Taurus in 8th House in my chart, but since there is a loose conjunction with Venus in Taurus, I will look for influence in the 9th house as well.

As for the Neptune/Mars thing going on, I don't know about that one! I read Neptune in Scorpio as intuitive ability and interest in the occult, with its aspect to Mars in Sag, which represents strong philosophical convictions and ideals. I care deeply about what is going on in the world and believe it is important to stand up for my ideals and live according to my values. I see us all connected to the larger whole. Mars opposition to Mercury is something for me to watch out for. I hope the trait of speaking out too quickly has become tempered by wisdom and experience.

I have had Jupiter transiting 12th house, which I believe has sparked this renewed interest in Astrology and Tarot in particular and metaphysics in general. love those Jupiter transits! *lol*

Thanks again, Minderwiz, for giving me some ideas about how to read these aspects! I will look at those again, I can already tell looking at the Saturn influence in the 9th house is going to give me some new insights!

Glad to have been of help.

Please don't hestiate to post any queries you have as you work through your chart - or indeed any general queries and we will do our best to answer them