What empress and five of swords have in common?

Butterfly1

If I bind/clarify cards I always bind it to what the person is actually feeling or going through.

The empress is telling her she needs to indulge in herself and get some kind of confidence back, I sense she is not entirely "herself" which is causing her to have somewhat an "entitled" phase e.g. i want him back, will we be together etc.. I personally would tell her not at the current moment. However you mentioned the sun as an outcome for her, she needs to be aware that clarity and happiness is around the corner for her if she focuses on herself.

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This was exactly what I was thinking.. That the empress is more of 'putting youself back together' rather than 'getting back together with him'. Even though she is seeing someone she is completely broken.

But at the same time, empress should be one of the good cards to get in a relationship reading, when things are going in a good direction, taking next step in a relationship, loving each other, taking care of each other, possibly indicating a marriage, getting pregnant and so on. But how that can be imidiate future for two people that haven't spoken to each other in 6 months?!?
 

Butterfly1

Well, this was a yes/no question right? Are they going to get back together again. And as you know, the tarot rarely answers yes/no questions (and why do a whole spread if it was a yes/no question? Why not one card: yes or no?). But really, that wasn't what you or she wanted to know. The REAL question, and the one I think your cards are answering is "HOW can she get them back together again?" Because that is what she wants. And that is what the cards would pick up on.

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No, it was not yes/no question it was CC relationship spread for two of them. Given that they haven't spoken in 6 months I was bit suprised to see so many positive cards (flowing so well with each other) and I started wondering whether that could indicate that pretty soon, out of the blue, things will fall in to place for them? Or the cards are completely excluding him (as he is practicly not part of her life anymore and see a nice future for her? But why the cards would exclude him? If there was nothing between them any more shouldn't then be weird and unrelated? Or cards that are not flowing in any meanigful way. Or if it over for good, shouldn't they be clearly depressing (maybe getting 10s or death or something else)?

I am now really curious how this will play out. I will make sure to put an update on what has happened in few months time :)
 

feminine_mystique

This was exactly what I was thinking.. That the empress is more of 'putting youself back together' rather than 'getting back together with him'. Even though she is seeing someone she is completely broken.

But at the same time, empress should be one of the good cards to get in a relationship reading, when things are going in a good direction, taking next step in a relationship, loving each other, taking care of each other, possibly indicating a marriage, getting pregnant and so on. But how that can be imidiate future for two people that haven't spoken to each other in 6 months?!?

The empress rememebr is a nurturing card as well. If she wants him she has to tend to her relationship and work on it. It is the "growth" card which could indicate a lot of things however I find this is her personal growth. She needs to learn a lesson from this.. is she still with a partner whilst still wanting her ex. If she is then she is afraid of being alone, this is her confrontation that she needs to address.

If she keeps going like this (be with one guy but thinking of another) she will be alone, which is what she is afraid of. Have you tuned into his energy and whether he feels the same way?
 

Butterfly1

Or, if you like, until BOTH sides become the Empress. Meaning willing to nurture what they love about each other and help that to mature. This goes right along with the 5/Swords. 5/Swords is "loss" but also learning how to deal with loss. Meaning realizing that you weren't ready to fight. You weren't ready to lose either. You learn humility. Again, both parties have to learn that the old relationship needs more "practice." You can't succeed at it if you rush in (like that one swordsman again the larger one), all unprepared because you think it's going to be oh-so-easy to restore it.

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I think this could be spot on!! I cannot believe that I never thought of that! You do have an unbelievable mind :)

They were together for about a year and she never wanted to get attached to him because of his history (he is the worst kind of womanizer – his history with women is beyond shocking) but she fell deeply in love with him. It also appeared that(fot the first time in his life) he was truly in love with her, but with those kind of people you never know.. Anyway, he broke up with her because she wasn’t ready to commit to him. She was initially happy that she was finally ‘forced’ to end it, but six months later, she is still waking up every morning thinking about him.

And that is exactly it! She was not ready to fight, she was not ready to lose either. Maybe she will soon understand that everything is for the best and she is anyway not ready to go into such battle, be hurt, loose it and instead, put herself back together and eventually move on into happier times!



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I think the cards are saying, in answer to that question, that in the near future she will be alone, but will also have learned to be patient, nurturing and giving...unlike she is in the present where she is demanding and impatient ;)

This is what you friend will learn and be in the near future. Not so impatient. No so desperate to have what she wants now, now, NOW! ...."

She is more broken than now, now, now and me, me, me type of girl.. When i said that she is kind of an empress type herself that included from unusually good looks to one of the purest hearts i have even seen and very givining rather than taking (an unusual combo). Also she is at a crossroad as the new guy (although they know each other for many years, just new in relationship) is moving to a new country (because of work) and wants to take her with him, marry her and so on. And she would do it without any thinking if she has never met the previous one. She even got 2 of wands in the present situation :) Spot on!
 

Butterfly1

Thirteen response is probably spot on. :)

But I would like to suggest a possible variety. Please take it with a grain of salt though as I'm less experienced.

Clarifiers in my readings show a different perspective or a combining influence.
But I do see common ground between those cards.

A traditional meaning of the empress is the holy nurturing, caring mother archetype. There is more to her though, like the fancy lady in a flowing robe on opulent cushions or nature. This the demanding and domineering side of this card.
The 5 of swords can be about dominance and winning over.

Whatever there might be out for the querent will be perfectly satisfying. Maybe a relationship where she can have her ways and possibly make the rules. Does not change your interpretation but reinforces it.

Hi :)

that is an interesting take. Do you really see the empress as demanding and domineering - shouldn't she be the complete opposite? I never though of her that way... (but I am also not a pro :))
 

Butterfly1

The only tiny bit of correlation I can see is an astrological one. The Empress corresponds to the planet Venus in the form of compassion, and the 5 of Swords corresponds to Venus in Aquarius, but if there is any compassion there, it's buried in the abstract humanitarian zeal of the social reformer. If anything, the 5 of Swords is likely to cut social benefits, not increase them - or maybe "right-size" them is a nice, non-confrontational Venusian term.

That possibly sounds as a very interesting idea but I am not sure that i fully understand (I am not a native english speaker and I possibly need an easier explanation - ''the abstract humanitarian zeal of the social reformer'' - i have no idea what that means :(). But I am very interested to understand the astrological connection and would therefore, very much appreciate if you could explain it further.

Thank you! :)
 

Barleywine

That possibly sounds as a very interesting idea but I am not sure that i fully understand (I am not a native english speaker and I possibly need an easier explanation - ''the abstract humanitarian zeal of the social reformer'' - i have no idea what that means :(). But I am very interested to understand the astrological connection and would therefore, very much appreciate if you could explain it further.

Thank you! :)

Sure! Aquarius is considered a humanitarian, socially-oriented sign that is one if the three "scientific" signs, along with Scorpio and Virgo. It produces a lot of social scientists and reformers, but it is abstract and any compassion it holds is more the "clinical" type. It's not a very warm place for Venus; its association with the Star card isn't unwarranted. So the 5 of Swords being connected to Venus in Aquarius is a bit sterile, quite opposite from the fertility of the Empress. Since the number 5 has a Mars association, the 5 of Swords reminds me of the unconvincing argument "This is for your own good" as it inflicts "necessary" pain.
 

Butterfly1

Sure! Aquarius is considered a humanitarian, socially-oriented sign that is one if the three "scientific" signs, along with Scorpio and Virgo. It produces a lot of social scientists and reformers, but it is abstract and any compassion it holds is more the "clinical" type. It's not a very warm place for Venus; its association with the Star card isn't unwarranted. So the 5 of Swords being connected to Venus in Aquarius is a bit sterile, quite opposite from the fertility of the Empress. Since the number 5 has a Mars association, the 5 of Swords reminds me of the unconvincing argument "This is for your own good" as it inflicts "necessary" pain.

I think i understand it now, and I was right - it is indeed a very interesting view and i am happy that you came back and explained it :)
Thank you :)
 

Butterfly1

The empress rememebr is a nurturing card as well. If she wants him she has to tend to her relationship and work on it. It is the "growth" card which could indicate a lot of things however I find this is her personal growth. She needs to learn a lesson from this.. is she still with a partner whilst still wanting her ex. If she is then she is afraid of being alone, this is her confrontation that she needs to address.

If she keeps going like this (be with one guy but thinking of another) she will be alone, which is what she is afraid of. Have you tuned into his energy and whether he feels the same way?

No, I haven't tried to see how he feels even though that was exactly what I was supposed to do! And thinking about it now, I should have also tried to see what cards are saying about how she really feels about him (is it really kind of love that she don't think will experience again or just wanting something that she can't have? Or something else..). Maybe she will indeed soon realize that he was just a crazy obsession and happily move on with her life (which i think would be possibly better for her assuming that he was not once in a life time kind of love that she will never feel again).

Thank you very much for your thoughts and pointers!

But it was still an interesting discussion to try to find a common ground for the two cards :)
 

Thirteen

She is more broken than now, now, now and me, me, me type of girl.. When i said that she is kind of an empress type herself that included from unusually good looks to one of the purest hearts i have even seen and very givining rather than taking (an unusual combo).
I don't doubt your word on this, but when you tell us a story about a sitter who refuses to accept what a reading tells her three times in a row...that does give us the impression of "I want what I want now, now, now."

Why do you think this usually very understanding person made you do the reading over and over again, fighting against that Empress card? Especially when that card essentially is telling her, only and simply, that she will be restored to her *true* self (or the participants in the relationship will become their best selves) in the near future? She sounds, from your description as someone who would accept that as a positive step, and not demand more. The near future card is not, after all, the outcome. It's just what's going to be tomorrow, or next week. The future that leads to the outcome.