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Chart Reading: Step #4, Martha Stewart -- ASC & MC, Sun & Moon

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Leo Ascendant - Traditional View


Having tried a modern reading of Martha’s MC, I’ll have a go at a classical one and see what that comes up with. I’ve based this on the 9th Century Arab Astrologer Abu Ali Al-Khayyat.

Firstly we look at the lord of the tenth (the Sun in Martha’s case) and the lord of the Ascendant (Mars) and see if there is any relationship between them. In this case both are in their own signs and are connected by a trine – the conclusion is that Martha will have a kingdom and great power (for kingdom read business empire). As the Sun (lord of the tenth) is applying to Mars (lord of the Ascendant) – kings and princes (presidents and senators) will summon her unasked (ask for her advice) she will certainly move in high circles being prosperous and powerful.

Al-Khayyat says that the profession is shown by the planet oriental (east) from the Sun and occidental (West) of the Moon and in either the Ascendant or MC. In Martha’s case this is Venus in Virgo in the tenth. In the book I’ve got Al-Khayyat inconveniently says there are professions associated with Venus but neglects to say what they are (he assumes I already know). According to Al-Biruni, another Arab Astrologer, Venus professions involve Works of beauty and magnificence, fond of bazaars, commerce, measuring by weight, length and bulk; dealing in pictures and colours, goldsmiths work, tailoring, manufacturing perfumes, dealing in pearls, gold and silver ornaments, musk, white and green clothes, maker of crowns and diadems, accompanying singing, composing songs, playing the lute, feasts, games and gaming.

Lilly saw Venus professions as:

'Musitions, Gamesters, Silk-men, Mercers, Linnen-Drapers, Painters, Jewellers, Players, Lapidaries, Embroiderers, Women-tailors, Commodities which adorn Women either, in Body (as Cloaths) or in Face, (as complexion-waters.)'

This seems quite a variety of things, so I’d be interested to know how far the US members see these as fitting Martha.

Venus is also exactly in opposition to her Part of Divorce – is this an indicator that divorce will result, most likely through work consuming her time?

I’ve already commented on her Part of Fortune in the fifth House. Her Part of Vocation and Status is in the second – seemingly linked to possessions and money – which suggests she is likely to be seen as a trader or a moneymaker. It’s ruled by Saturn from the Seventh. Saturn is in it’s own decanate so it has some dignity but it still suggests that there may be some hard work in achieving the promised success – things might not come as easy as the other indicators seem to show.
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Venus


Venus also brings qualities of balance, harmony, and is associated with adornments and appearance. Martha's line of products are color coordinated -- towels match hand cloths and bath rugs, pillow covers match sheets and bedroom curtains, plates and napkins are coordinated, etc. Her food preparation TV shows offer coordinated food courses, all carefully planned for ease-of-preparation and attractiveness. Every aspect of her commercial offerings is in harmony and supports all other parts of her product lines. Dave.
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Thanks Dave,

Strangely, Stephanie Jane Clement simply kept to the Midheaven by sign and didn't consider any planets within the tenth. Rather as some Astrologers just consider the sign of the Ascendant and only go on to modify things when looking at the first house.

As Venus was coming up in the Traditional view, I left it to them to comment.

As you say, the products are clearly Venusian in nature and do follow the harmony/beauty/balance principle. What you describe is an excellent twentieth century application. I think both modern and traditional Astrology would take up Venus in the tenth.

A problem using a traditional approach is the clear culture and economic differences between the ninth and twentieth centuries. I doubt the average ninth century homemaker went in for easy to prepare meals and colour co-ordinated linens. But the rich merchants and nobles would have gone in for well designed and colour co-ordinated fabrics. She may have changed the clientele and the product base a little but the traditional Astrologers did come up with some products which seem to be reasonable hits.

They came up with colours (colour co-ordinated) linen and a Mercer is a dealer in textiles and fabrics , they suggested 'feasts' and that does seem to fit the TV shows theme, and the came up with drapery.

Has she tried out any perfumes, or cosmetics?
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Reply to Minderwiz, Sun in 9th, Moon in 2nd, and a challenge.


REPLY TO MINDERWIZ
I'm not knowledgable about perfumes and toiletries, etc., offered by Martha Stewart. However, the old classical interpretations do have a drama inherent in them that is some times lacking in more modern comments. Of course, life was harsher then, shorter, and more likely to have external-unforeseen events thrust upon one's person. Today we live in a more predictable, ordered, longer life experience that has more variation possible -- the interpretations have to either be broader or be related to a dialog between the astrologer and client in order to be specific.

SUN IN THE 9th, MOON IN THE 2nd.
A friend and mentor, Robert Pellitier (Planets in Houses, Para Research, 1978) wrote an extensive book which is probably the most under-appreciated reference text of all time. The book examines derivitive houses and provides comments on all of the planets plus Sun-Moon combinations by house and derived house. I'd like to extract a few of his comments for us to consider.

"You will always be able to distinguish yourself as long as you can prove that your accomplishments are valuable. You tend to overextend yourself . . . There is a constant struggle between your desire to assert yourself, confident that success will naturally follow, and your apprehensions about personal or material security. In time, circumstances offer a reasonaably high probability of success."

Now, since we have entertained the idea that the Sun is angular and has a 10h house influence, lets look at SUN IN THE 10th, MOON IN THE 2nd as a comparison.

"Your ambition is stimulated when you realize that there are many available opportunities through which you can exploit your creative potentials and gain a position with greater social status. You know that this will require a lot of hard work, but you willingly accept this, determined to gain the greatest yield from your efforts, for you have decided there is no other way to achieve the material security you want. . . . You believe you can offer the world something of value. . . . Your early conditioning was important in your rise to prominence because your parents, especially your father, served as a catalyst to seek the best use of your potentials. . . . management is best suited to your temperment . . . "

If one were to take these words, written 25 years ago, as a good interpetation of Sun in the 9th and Sun in the 10th relative to the Moon in the 2nd, then it offers something important for us to consider.

Consider this: The sign on the cusp of an angle, ASC or MC, will bring all of the planets in that sign into that angular house. This statement can be valid if you compare the 9th and 10th house Sun interpretations given. For Martha, the 10th house SUN fits better with her reported life facts than does the 9th house SUN. Now, we have to examine our own charts and other's charts to see if it is valid to move a cadent house planet "forward" when the sign reaches into the angular house. Comments? Dave.
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Dave,

Thanks for those interesting extracts - really food for thought.

Working backward

'The sign on the cusp of an angle brings planets in that sign into that angular house.' - This seems close to the very old whole sign house method (though that was Ascendant based) - For Martha with a Scorpio Ascendant her tenth on whole signs is Leo, so all Leo planets would be considered as 10th House on this old method and that fits with the view you describe.

On whole sign houses, the tenth and the second are trined - so we would expect planets in the second to work easily with planets in the tenth - we could therefore treat the Sun as being Trine the Moon - indeed before the advent of more accurate measurements that relationship between Sun in Leo and Moon in Sagittarius would have been the perceived aspect. If the Moon is the relationship to the public then here we have a desire for a career that brings public recognition. The Sun is the father figure - but the mother provides the framework (the tenth is the house of the mother) in which rearing takes place. Fire signs here provide the drive and adapatbility to succeeed.

From our considerations up to now, I think your view of the tenth / second Sun and Moon is a good one.
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Dave

This thread seems to have settled into a discussion between the two of us, and while there may be some more interesting things to say, it might also be worth launching the next thread.

We could either go planet by planet - Mercury through to Pluto or we could 'bunch' them a little - either in pairs or take the remaining personals - Mercury, Venus and Mars, to gether and then either Jupiter and Saturn as a pair followed by the outer planets or take the non-personals as a bunch.

I don't mind how we sequence them - but as we work our way through we will probably find less and less new things to say - because each planet has aspect or other links which we will be talking about as we go.
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Yes


Yes, its time to move on. I'll start the next thread. I believe that the dialog between us in the latter stages of each thread is helpful to the many viewers-but-non-participants as the comments by all of the participants are in the earlier stages of each thread.

I like to challenge my way of thinking and the approach that others take as a means of getting a more playful approach into the use of astrology. I believe your "grouping" suggestion would be most appropriate, so I'll launch the next step in a few hours.

Meanwhile, this thread can still be posted to even after we start the next thread. Dave.
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Re: Yes


Quote:
Originally posted by dadsnook2000

I like to challenge my way of thinking and the approach that others take as a means of getting a more playful approach into the use of astrology.

I think that is a very good approach - one of the problems as we get into Astrology is that we tend to fall into routines and switch off to possible new (or old) techniques which might help. Challenging assumptions and methods makes us question our methods and procedures. We learn more, even if we come to the conclusion that we were on the right lines to begin with
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quick notes:

- Martha's progressed sun would have been in 10th roughly since she was 8 yrs old after which it will have been in 10th for a significant amount of time, during which it would have conj her natal Venus.

- Minderwiz, the products Martha creates are for homemakers, and in America, this is largely a female demographic (VEnus). She also has a show which involves cooking and throwing parties, and home decor.
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