Which Way is Upright?

In the end, the decision as to whether a given pip card is upright or reversed must be up to the card-reader themselves. One can't say to oneself that a card is upright a certain way just because others think so, if one feels otherwise. One can't force one's own feelings on this. This is especially the case for quasi-symmetrical pips.

Yeah as long as one decides before a given spread I think...but then some ppl don't even use that guideline!

The makers of Motherpeace and similar round decks went to a fair amount of bother to create cards that would be somewhat ambiguous and admit degrees of uncertainty as to whether they were "upright" or "reversed." The Marseille and other traditional decks have had that all along.

I tend to see the Marseille and similar sorts of minors as admitting degrees of reversibility as well. If it isn't visually obvious as to which way the cards are pointing then that card should be only weakly reversible or not reversible at all. So most of the Clubs, the even Swords, and the even Coins are not strongly reversible. This of course varies from deck to deck as well.

FWIW, I read the swords as upright when the handle's down and it's pointing up. Conver Marseille has a clue, on the 3 of swords the branches and leaves look more natural when the point is up than when down; the cut parts are at the bottom and the leaves grow up that way.

Thank you for the wonderful link Rusty.
I just spend an enjoyable hour going through my Jane Lyle Conver (I think that's what it is ?)
And figuring out which way was up.
When I came to the 3 of Swords my gut instinct was that the sword pointing down was wrong.
So I looked at my Fourniers deck and the upright position for the 3 of Swords is with the blade pointing up in that deck.
So I think I will go with my intuition and my Frouniers on that one instead of the site.

Otherwise it was very easy to match up the little flaws in the printing on the cards with the site pictures and distinguish upright from reverse.

I put a little red dot at the top of the card.
So I don't get them mixed up again.

ihcoyc said:

If it isn't visually obvious as to which way the cards are pointing then that card should be only weakly reversible or not reversible at all. So most of the Clubs, the even Swords, and the even Coins are not strongly reversible.

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In fact, certain French-language TdM tarot authors (e.g., Corinne Morel) who otherwise give upright and reversed meanings for the pip cards don't do so in the case of weakly-reversible cards, giving only upright meanings.

Shalott said:

Hadar: blue is at the top and right hand side, red at the bottom and left had side, except swords, see what jmd said to me about this:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?s=&threadid=29296

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I beg to differ here Shalott. When I got my Hadar, I went through the whole deck documenting each card and IMO the batons have blue on the left and at the bottom! Even numbered swords also have blue on the left. The odd numbers have upward pointing swords. In some of the coins, the predominant blue is at the top. I am sure that the deck was all up the right way when I got it so feel confident about this. Never mind though, each to his own

~

A number of earlier discussions on the uprightness of cards in the Marseille have taken place - but perhaps a thread which also more specifically looks at this is How to tell the uprightness of Marseille pips.

Personally, I would not place too much emphasis on either the copyright imprint or the BN imprint on the cards. As an example, I have various editions of the Grimaud Marseille - and there differences as to which side the copyright falls with certain cards. In any case, it reflects the views, at most, of the printer.

One of the most important indications is that given by ihcoyc: have a look at the floral imagery within the card. Often (but not always), it is specific enough to give a clear indication as to which is upright. For example (and only as an example), the uprightness of the Ace of Swords cannot be mistaken on two counts - the crown... but also, importantly, the branches.

For myself, and irrespective as to what some authors may say, what is important is that the image begins to speak. In a reading, it is not so much the assumed uprightness which is important, but how the imagery in the context as presented begins to 'speak'. And that can be done only by beginning to narrate!