Star

WhiteWizzard

In PKT Waite's interpretation for the Star is very much at odds with the generally accepted modern day interpretation. His meaning ( loss theft privation abandonment) does not gel with the design by P. Smith. As I am just a novice at the Tarot, am keen to know more about this. Also 6 of Cups-- Waite's largely negative meaning for this too, seems to have been dropped in modern interpretations. Certainly this pointing to lack of consoltation between those having input to the decks creation.
 

Fulgour

The PKT by A.E.Waite is a collection of ramblings unworthy
of the Tarot created by Pamela Colman Smith, and he copies
almost all of his material verbatim (plagiarism) from others.
Here is a side-by-side comparison of three sets of meanings.

It's very revealing to note that Waite miscopied importance
as impotence... in a way a very delightful Freudian slip. :laugh:


XVII THE STAR
from Villa Revak:

WAITE: Loss, theft, privation, abandonment; another reading says
—hope and bright prospects.
Reversed: Arrogance, haughtiness, impotence.

MATHERS: Hope, Expectation, Bright promises.
Reversed: Hopes not fulfilled, Expectations disappointed
or fulfilled in a minor degree.

ETTEILLA: DESOLATION (4)—Privation, Destitution, Abandonment.
Reversed: Arrogance, Haughtiness, Importance.
 

WhiteWizzard

Thanks Fulgour, excellent

So far I have dicovered an inspiring reference source in www.learntarot.com/s4.htm overall I feel this to be the most comprehensive and balanced in my experience to date. The way it's set out making it easy to absorb the imformation. I have it all printed out in clear plastic sleeves.
 

Fulgour

"The Tarot" by S. L. MacGregor Mathers (1888)

click on link for e-book:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/tarot/mathers/index.htm

Sam Mathers was a pretender, but he had a good wife.
His little book is an embarrassment to the Golden Dawn
sycophants~ it's folksy and direct, no muddy kabbalah,
but soon after publishing it, Sam put on his Thoth face
and dutifully wrote eighty tons of absolute balderdash.

You can usually find a nice copy, illustrated with a TdM,
for a reasonable price~but seller's do hawk it as vintage.

I see where Mondazzi has it new on Amazon for cheap:
http://www.fetchbook.info/compare.do?search=0877287546
ISBN: 0877287546

*

If you want a book that is unlike anything
out there now, I heartily recommend:

"Fortune Telling: A Guide to Foreseeing the Future"
by Basil Ivan Rakoczi
http://www.fetchbook.info/compare.do?search=0356034658
ISBN 0356034658

also known as "Forseeing The Future"
http://www.fetchbook.info/compare.do?search=0608703974
ISBN 0608703974

I was introduced to Rackoczi by Alfred Douglas,
who recommended "The Painted Caravan" ~but
that one is hard to find and can be expensive...

*

And this just came to me... WhiteWizzard, are you
familiar with the Tarot of Marseilles? I think that it
would be very exciting for you if you got this deck.

If there aren't any around where you are~ we can
put our heads together and try to find one for you.
 

tink27

Fulgour said:
The PKT by A.E.Waite is a collection of ramblings unworthy
of the Tarot created by Pamela Colman Smith, and he copies
almost all of his material verbatim (plagiarism) from others.
Here is a side-by-side comparison of three sets of meanings.

It's very revealing to note that Waite miscopied importance
as impotence... in a way a very delightful Freudian slip. :laugh:


XVII THE STAR
from Villa Revak:

WAITE: Loss, theft, privation, abandonment; another reading says
—hope and bright prospects.
Reversed: Arrogance, haughtiness, impotence.

MATHERS: Hope, Expectation, Bright promises.
Reversed: Hopes not fulfilled, Expectations disappointed
or fulfilled in a minor degree.

ETTEILLA: DESOLATION (4)—Privation, Destitution, Abandonment.
Reversed: Arrogance, Haughtiness, Importance.

I have a question regarding The Star. I see this woman as someone who has just gone through a traumatic experience (The Tower) has been shed of her possessions and what she thought was her identity. It's as if she is questioning who am I, where am I going?

There are many aspects to any card. Could one be that after the storm, this woman, naked and vulnerable is seeking and opening to her own truth? That for the moment she may feel inadequate because the life she was living was not her own? Could The Star (stars) reprsent the universe, its many mysteries and the seekers potentialities for the Self which is meant to give and flow back to others?

tink
 

Fulgour

Hi :) tink! Your thoughts and insights are splendid, and the poetry
of your words is gentle and soothing, with many strong potentials.

I think if viewed as linear the 22 Majors can tell a story that way,
moving in a straight line and following a step by step progression.

But I see the Majors as circular, having no exact beginning or end,
where the beginning only signals the presence of the whole series.

In a circular model XVII The Star would share a complementary
harmonic with V The Hierophant ~ as if revealing the unbound
manifestattion of the meaning of life, the renewal of the soul.

I think deep down, no matter linear or circular, we see this card
in much the same way, and your words have been enlightening.


Best Wishes!
~Fulgour
 

Crowqueen

Fulgour said:
In a circular model XVII The Star would share a complementary
harmonic with V The Hierophant ~ as if revealing the unbound
manifestattion of the meaning of life, the renewal of the soul.

In the Avalon tarot the Star is shown as night sky with children looking up at it in expectation of promises to come. I did a sort of intuitive reading of the cards' imagery - very non-standard - and seemed to come up with the right ideas vis-a-vis traditional RW meanings.

This gels with the idea of renewal after the storm, picking up the pieces, so to speak, but also the next generation waiting to take their places in the firmament. I have yet to get the Star in anything much more than a literal representation of a real world object (my sister's duvet, which has embroidered stars on it - her keys are supposed to be somewhere underneath it!!!) but I did read a spread with a reversal in it which suggested frustrated dreams and hope for a relationship, so that might give some more hints.
 

tink27

Fulgour said:
Hi tink:)
In a circular model XVII The Star would share a complementary
harmonic with V The Hierophant ~ as if revealing the unbound
manifestattion of the meaning of life, the renewal of the soul.

I think deep down, no matter linear or circular, we see this card
in much the same way, and your words have been enlightening.
~Fulgour

Thank you for this Fulgour! (giggle) I was definitely staying between the lines.

tink
 

tink27

Crowqueen said:
In the Avalon tarot the Star is shown as night sky with children looking up at it in expectation of promises to come. I did a sort of intuitive reading of the cards' imagery - very non-standard - and seemed to come up with the right ideas vis-a-vis traditional RW meanings.

This gels with the idea of renewal after the storm, picking up the pieces, so to speak, but also the next generation waiting to take their places in the firmament. I have yet to get the Star in anything much more than a literal representation of a real world object (my sister's duvet, which has embroidered stars on it - her keys are supposed to be somewhere underneath it!!!) but I did read a spread with a reversal in it which suggested frustrated dreams and hope for a relationship, so that might give some more hints.

Thank you Crowqueen, the Avalon tarot sounds and looks very interesting.

tink
 

job

*we are all stardust dontchaknow! :)

Good evening

Red shift: When you look up into the night sky, you might note that a star that once glistened blue is now red. This means that the star is getting further away (red shift).
It also means that the universe is still expanding.

Blue shift: When you look up into the night sky you might note that a star that once appeared red is now blue. This is the 'blue shift'. Meaning that the star is getting closer and the universe is no longer expanding.

Here's an interesting theory concerning the blue shift... it means that the universe is collapsing in on itself and there will come a time when the natural laws of physics will no longer apply and things get a bit chaotic before it all just stops.

Knowing that the universe is still expanding (red shift) is very useful because it tells us that there was a 'beginning' a source.

Put the red shift as a positive emotion (knowledge/understanding) and the Blue as a negative (withdrawal/wasted energy)... it all depends on how you received the previous card.

ok, ok, I'll shut up now!

g'night!:)