Help with research? Origins of esoteric Tarot thought..

andy h

(orig posted in tarot meanings section, but told that this thread was more suited here :))

I was wondering if anyone can help me with some research i'm doing on the tarot, i do read the cards myself, but am trying to research the origins and inevitable questions
this throws up. I am aware that the answers to these questions may lie in exisitng threads, but do not have time to read through all of them .If this is the case , please link me to relevant thread!

1.) Would i be correct in assuming that 70% of western esoteric tradition is in agreement with the overall meanings of the cards?

How and why do the meanings deviate?

Poor research?(focus on getting paycheck for book incompetence, egotism(i have ascribed this cards 'real' meaning that no one has hitherto got before!), Or something else?

An example:

two of pentacles usually means 'change' , in one deck i own the book and author say it relates 'to monetary matters'?!!
obviously 'change' could represent financial matters, but obviously not exclusively. Whats the earliest text ascribing meaning to the minor arcana whose imagery does not speak as clearly as the major arcana?(is there a specific text that was the catalyst for the western tarot tradition, and what was the earliest text that ascribed the meanings to the minor arcana or were the images originally prevalent in the cards originally clear enough to invoke archetypal themes?.Obviously, when linked to sephiroth in the qabbalah, a cohesive pattern emerges, but this was a much later development in tarot thought)



As well as some info, can people name me the most ridiculous differences they have found in meanings ascribed to major and minor arcana cards?

p.s - i'm aware of the changes crowley made to the tarot , thoth being my tarot of choice

2.) I'm currently looking into the game of triumph,the tarots supposed original purpose..i've heard the tarot cards orig had 56 cards , but expanded, how, when and why did this happen and how does this affect the validity of tarot?(especially with regards to divination)



Ay info or help on the above

many thanks

Andy
 

Bernice

Hello andy h,

Welcome to the History forum(s) :).

I think your questions might better be answered via the Marseille and Early Decks Forum Table of Contents;

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=31857

There are several sections with relevant threads for you to browse.
Regarding the card 'meanings', there were none that can be historically confirmed. The esoteric meanings are very recent (past two centuries or so). Scroll down to the section called, "Reading with a Marseilles deck" for discusions on how to read with the original early tarot decks.


Or, in the "Table of Contents in Historical Research"

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=8356



Another thread you might want to post to for general enquiries re. early card decks is, "General Infomation: History decks";

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=129930&page=1&pp=10

........

If you prefer to research the (esoteric) Thoth Tarot, you'll find more help in the Thoth Tarot forum;

http://www.tarotforum.net/forumdisplay.php?f=57


Bee :)
 

DoctorArcanus

andy h said:
Whats the earliest text ascribing meaning to the minor arcana whose imagery does not speak as clearly as the major arcana?

Hello Andy,
this page provides some relevant information:
http://www.tarotpedia.com/wiki/Bolognese_Tarot_Divination
I think that divination based on the Tarocchino of Bologna is the earliest form for which some documentation is available.


Of course, another interesting document is the work by De Gebelin and the Comte de Mellet.
http://www.donaldtyson.com/gebelin.html
This source is much more known, and the Tarot esoteric tradition heavily depends on it (while the Bolognese tradition has been forgotten for centuries and was only recently rediscovered by historians).