Page of Swords as someone's feelings

tarot_quest

Well, feelings are constantly developing and evolving. I just know Knight of Swords is definitely not a card I'd want to see when asking about someone's feelings. That might even feel more like a regression than a progression.

Just to clarify, I am not saying that having a ''page of swords'' type of feeling will turn into a ''knight of swords'' type of feelings. You mentioned yourself the knight and it could be one possibility among many. I agree that a knight of swords in the position of feeling is far from being the number 1 card for romance ;)

My point was that feelings might surely evolve into something else than a page of swords state IF something develops (like Ace of cups, or any card that you judge relevant in your readings....)
 

Marsy

Well, there was one other thread I found (here: http://tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=150990) but it's quite old and not very informative. :(

Well, feelings are constantly developing and evolving. I just know Knight of Swords is definitely not a card I'd want to see when asking about someone's feelings. That might even feel more like a regression than a progression.

I felt a defensive vibe he doesn't seem to be as inquisitive or curious as the other pages. He's the only one not looking directly at the object in his hand. In some illustrations, he looks downright fearful of what he might encounter.

This is a wonderful example of a real-life application of this card! The page here was still in the sizing up phase, not ready to welcome this person into their Circle of Trust just yet, although not completely against the idea.

Hmm...now that's interesting. I actually get a lot wands cards (6 and courts) when someone's been doing some social media stalking, but I can see how the Page of Swords would mean gathering intel.

Well, I think every situation is different and, of course, a lot depends on the context. It might not necessarily b<script id="gpt-impl-0.8676073450449564" src="http://partner.googleadservices.com/gpt/pubads_impl_85.js"></script>e a matter of mistrust but rather someone's reluctance to do so for whatever reason.

But why would you want to start a relationship with someone who is reluctant about you? Whatever that reluctance is probably won't go away and would only get worse which is why I said it sets the tone for a toxic relationship. The person is unsure about you and you're going to spend all your energy trying to convince this person you can be trusted when the more you try to convince them, the more suspicious they become. It's not a good place for someone to be in trying to gain the approval and affection from another person only puts you at a disadvantage in the relationship.

In regards to the reading I did about the girlfriend and mom, I advised her not to try to win over his mother or gain her approval because it would only work against her. Be nice and cordial but don't go out of your way to try to convince her to accept you because more than likely she's never going to be 100% fund of you and there won't be anything you can do to change that so trying would be fruitless.

With a page of swords you are going up against a sword in which you are already in a loosing situation because you can't compete with that deadly weapon. The best thing you can do is to try to lower his defenses but you also have to always be aware that at anytime he can raise his sword again to keep you at a distance. Not an ideal way to start a relationship.
 

Thirteen

How dangerous the weapon is depends on who is holding it

With a page of swords you are going up against a sword in which you are already in a loosing situation because you can't compete with that deadly weapon.
I would agree if this was a Knight, Queen or King. But a page? I mean, yes, a little kid waving around a kitchen knife is dangerous and you should be careful. But we're not talking someone who is an expert in knife fighting.

A Page is a Page is a Page. He isn't that good. If he was he'd be a Knight/Queen/King. Now, again, granted, if *you* are some other type of person, say, a Knight/Cups, then you probably should avoid the kid with the knife. Even if he's not so good at using it. But what if you're a Queen/Wands? Ha! That kid doesn't stand a chance. The Queen will do a little baton twirl of her wand, knock him on the head and that will be the end of the confrontation.

What I'm saying is, I think this judgement on the inability of the person to compete depends on whether THEY are holding any sort of weapon. Your advice to the girl dealing with her boyfriend's mom was probably wise, because the boyfriend's opinion mattered, too. It wasn't just "this woman doesn't like me." But that's not the case here. It's altogether possible that Person "B" has an equally strong weapon in hand, and, if more mature, then person B can outmaneuver this kid.

So. Before we pass judgement on whether Person B should confront, or even has a chance against this "deadly weapon"—we should know who person B is and if they have anything in hand. Remember, you don't bring a knife to a gunfight. What if Person B is armed with a gun...and is a sharpshooter to boot?
 

Marsy

I would agree if this was a Knight, Queen or King. But a page? I mean, yes, a little kid waving around a kitchen knife is dangerous and you should be careful. But we're not talking someone who is an expert in knife fighting.

A Page is a Page is a Page. He isn't that good. If he was he'd be a Knight/Queen/King. Now, again, granted, if *you* are some other type of person, say, a Knight/Cups, then you probably should avoid the kid with the knife. Even if he's not so good at using it. But what if you're a Queen/Wands? Ha! That kid doesn't stand a chance. The Queen will do a little baton twirl of her wand, knock him on the head and that will be the end of the confrontation.

What I'm saying is, I think this judgement on the inability of the person to compete depends on whether THEY are holding any sort of weapon. Your advice to the girl dealing with her boyfriend's mom was probably wise, because the boyfriend's opinion mattered, too. It wasn't just "this woman doesn't like me." But that's not the case here. It's altogether possible that Person "B" has an equally strong weapon in hand, and, if more mature, then person B can outmaneuver this kid.

So. Before we pass judgement on whether Person B should confront, or even has a chance against this "deadly weapon"—we should know who person B is and if they have anything in hand. Remember, you don't bring a knife to a gunfight. What if Person B is armed with a gun...and is a sharpshooter to boot?

Oh no I'm only talking in terms of feelings and not saying the Page can't be challenged or defeated. However speaking in terms of feelings I'm saying that in my opinion it's not an ideal way to start a relationship with someone because you're going in at a disadvantage regarding how they feel about you. There's already an uneven foundation being formed with one having to prove their trustworthiness to the other and it can turn into a very toxic situation depending on how bad said person wants the other person.

There are so many women that get in relationships where the guy wasn't sure about her in the beginning and she did everything she could to get him to like her when none of it ended up mattering in the end. That's what I'm talking about in terms of the Page of Swords, it can turn bad when you're desperate to get him to lower his guard and let you in. When you should be like oh okay you don't trust me and you're reluctant about having feelings for me, then I'll go find someone who is sure about the way he feels and I don't need to jump through hoops to make him feel safe.
 

Thirteen

The Page isn't likely to regard EVERYONE as a threat...

There are so many women that get in relationships where the guy wasn't sure about her in the beginning and she did everything she could to get him to like her when none of it ended up mattering in the end.
I get that. But sometimes what gets the guy to let down his guard and trust you isn't jumping through hoops or being non-confrontational. Sometimes you have to show gumption. That Queen/Wands who knocks the kid on the head, well, she might well have him in awe and admiring her for doing that. I mean, I agree, if she'd jumped through hoops, it wouldn't work. But you don' have to walk away or ignore this either. You can come at him, and show him all you are. Maybe that girl SHOULD have come back at the guy's mom. Maybe she would have gotten instant respect and admiration, and yes, trust.

But this all supposes that the person A IS feeling guarded. And I'm no so sure that's the case. It really, really REALLY depends on who person B is in his eyes. A Page of Swords is not going to feel guarded around a Knight/Queen/King of swords. He's going to be in awe. He's going to be eager to discuss sword fighting with them, hungry to learn all they know. So who is Person B? If Person B is a threat, then yes, the Page has that sword up and is guarded. But if Person B is admired, clever, sharp and talented in every way that our Page is not...then our Page is not guarded. Our page is eager and want to communicate.
 

IndigoWaves

You're right, Pique Dame, that people don't often post about this card as a "feeling". I think that's at least partly because they don't like the looks of it and would rather forget/ignore it, pretending that it didn't come up at all.

Anyway, I know that when I'm feeling like a Page of Swords/pull that card as my feelings, it's usually not a good mood. Try annoyed, irritable, stressed, leave me alone or I'll give you a reason to, etc... Sometimes I can stifle and successfully hide it (which maybe B's fella has been doing, too) but other times, I do snap and it's just not pretty. (My normally placid Pisces Sun gets blown away by natal chart Air, including Aqua Moon/Merc/Venus square a cantankerous, angular Scorp Uranus.)

I should probably mention that I don't use reversals and don't know if you do, but still... In RWS, at least, those Swords court faces really don't say, "Come hither, Dearie, let's have a chat.", Queen's extended hand aside... ;) Yes, I realize that they're often on about communication, but the nastier Swords people can so easily "communicate" via relentless, one-sided earfuls... And while verbal sparring can be fun or even an addictive turn-on for Airy/Swords (and Fiery/Wands) types, it's not often a Watery (or Earthy) person's Cup of tea.

I'm unaware of how Watery B's astrological chart is (or isn't) and how Airy A's is (or isn't), but a negative Swords/Airy type can prove incredibly, unforgettably hurtful to a highly sensitive soul, often without meaning to be... A mere Page could do it, in that case, as Thirteen described. Even if he's more of a 'positive'/upright Page of Swords -- curious about her and interested in further info/communication -- that particular brand of feeling might not be satisfying to her in the long run, and she could ache for a more Cupsy exchange.

If B is still interested in pursuing this/him (hopefully she'll be warned, heh!), it may be helpful if she reflects on her actions towards him... See if *anything* that she does or has done, consciously or unconsciously, may be leaning him into an unpleasant (but not necessarily evident) edginess. You could draw some cards on this, too... And note that if he's already under duress and/or not an easy-going person, overall, it might be something surprisingly minor -- like being loud or chatty when he needs some quiet, or being emotionally needy/trying too hard to get "close" when he wants to be alone, for example.

Take care. :)
 

Pique Dame

Sorry I've been so pokey with posting feedback. I'd start on replies then something would come up and I'd get distracted or lose everything. Ugh. Craziest. Week. Ever. Anyway, so to not tarnish my feedback karma...

Just to clarify, I am not saying that having a ''page of swords'' type of feeling will turn into a ''knight of swords'' type of feelings. You mentioned yourself the knight and it could be one possibility among many. I agree that a knight of swords in the position of feeling is far from being the number 1 card for romance ;)

My point was that feelings might surely evolve into something else than a page of swords state IF something develops (like Ace of cups, or any card that you judge relevant in your readings....)
Feelings are definitely never static. I realize that pulling a card for someone's feelings is often little more than a snapshot of that particular moment. Five minutes later, it could be something else entirely. A reading done after a heated argument with someone would likely yield a drastically different result than a reading done after some steamy make-up sex. :) I suppose going from Page of Swords to Page of Cups, as feelings, could be considered an evolution and not just a lateral move (depending which direction you want those feelings to go, of course).

But why would you want to start a relationship with someone who is reluctant about you? Whatever that reluctance is probably won't go away and would only get worse which is why I said it sets the tone for a toxic relationship. The person is unsure about you and you're going to spend all your energy trying to convince this person you can be trusted when the more you try to convince them, the more suspicious they become. It's not a good place for someone to be in trying to gain the approval and affection from another person only puts you at a disadvantage in the relationship.

In regards to the reading I did about the girlfriend and mom, I advised her not to try to win over his mother or gain her approval because it would only work against her. Be nice and cordial but don't go out of your way to try to convince her to accept you because more than likely she's never going to be 100% fund of you and there won't be anything you can do to change that so trying would be fruitless.

With a page of swords you are going up against a sword in which you are already in a loosing situation because you can't compete with that deadly weapon. The best thing you can do is to try to lower his defenses but you also have to always be aware that at anytime he can raise his sword again to keep you at a distance. Not an ideal way to start a relationship.
This seems like a highly specific and personal example so I don't think it can be applied universally. To my knowledge, there is nothing toxic going on in this situation, nor is anyone at a disadvantage. As far as your situation, I think trying to win over someone who doesn't care for you would be a bad move in general because it would be seen by the other person as disingenuous. Like cats always gravitating towards the one person who isn't trying to pet them, the best way to reverse this distrust is to not try to reverse it. But I digress.

I would agree if this was a Knight, Queen or King. But a page? I mean, yes, a little kid waving around a kitchen knife is dangerous and you should be careful. But we're not talking someone who is an expert in knife fighting.

A Page is a Page is a Page. He isn't that good. If he was he'd be a Knight/Queen/King. Now, again, granted, if *you* are some other type of person, say, a Knight/Cups, then you probably should avoid the kid with the knife. Even if he's not so good at using it. But what if you're a Queen/Wands? Ha! That kid doesn't stand a chance. The Queen will do a little baton twirl of her wand, knock him on the head and that will be the end of the confrontation.

What I'm saying is, I think this judgement on the inability of the person to compete depends on whether THEY are holding any sort of weapon. Your advice to the girl dealing with her boyfriend's mom was probably wise, because the boyfriend's opinion mattered, too. It wasn't just "this woman doesn't like me." But that's not the case here. It's altogether possible that Person "B" has an equally strong weapon in hand, and, if more mature, then person B can outmaneuver this kid.

So. Before we pass judgement on whether Person B should confront, or even has a chance against this "deadly weapon"—we should know who person B is and if they have anything in hand. Remember, you don't bring a knife to a gunfight. What if Person B is armed with a gun...and is a sharpshooter to boot?
This is a wonderful metaphor! I don't believe I pulled any significator cards here but that would've been interesting to see how person A sees person B in juxtaposition with their feelings.

You're right, Pique Dame, that people don't often post about this card as a "feeling". I think that's at least partly because they don't like the looks of it and would rather forget/ignore it, pretending that it didn't come up at all.

Anyway, I know that when I'm feeling like a Page of Swords/pull that card as my feelings, it's usually not a good mood. Try annoyed, irritable, stressed, leave me alone or I'll give you a reason to, etc... Sometimes I can stifle and successfully hide it (which maybe B's fella has been doing, too) but other times, I do snap and it's just not pretty. (My normally placid Pisces Sun gets blown away by natal chart Air, including Aqua Moon/Merc/Venus square a cantankerous, angular Scorp Uranus.)

I should probably mention that I don't use reversals and don't know if you do, but still... In RWS, at least, those Swords court faces really don't say, "Come hither, Dearie, let's have a chat.", Queen's extended hand aside... ;) Yes, I realize that they're often on about communication, but the nastier Swords people can so easily "communicate" via relentless, one-sided earfuls... And while verbal sparring can be fun or even an addictive turn-on for Airy/Swords (and Fiery/Wands) types, it's not often a Watery (or Earthy) person's Cup of tea.

I'm unaware of how Watery B's astrological chart is (or isn't) and how Airy A's is (or isn't), but a negative Swords/Airy type can prove incredibly, unforgettably hurtful to a highly sensitive soul, often without meaning to be... A mere Page could do it, in that case, as Thirteen described. Even if he's more of a 'positive'/upright Page of Swords -- curious about her and interested in further info/communication -- that particular brand of feeling might not be satisfying to her in the long run, and she could ache for a more Cupsy exchange.

If B is still interested in pursuing this/him (hopefully she'll be warned, heh!), it may be helpful if she reflects on her actions towards him... See if *anything* that she does or has done, consciously or unconsciously, may be leaning him into an unpleasant (but not necessarily evident) edginess. You could draw some cards on this, too... And note that if he's already under duress and/or not an easy-going person, overall, it might be something surprisingly minor -- like being loud or chatty when he needs some quiet, or being emotionally needy/trying too hard to get "close" when he wants to be alone, for example.
I can't say I've ever pulled Page of Swords for feelings before so I don't even know how I'd be feeling if I pulled it for myself. I do use reversals, so I would probably see a reversed Page of Swords as more negative here. Upright, he's leaning forward, reversed he's backing away. I'm a Pisces sun, too, with Aquarius rising so I come off very air-y to other people but deep down I'm all water. I once had a loud and chatty person pop up in a reading as the Knight of Swords, so that would be my go-to card to describe those traits, rather than our inquisitive little Page here. Upon further reflection, I feel like it's kind of the opposite: Person B may have been acting a bit cool or disengaged. Not on purpose but they maybe came off that way so Person A may have pulled back a little to analyze and assess the situation. Mayhaps?

Ravenous and intrusive curiosity, that touches on the 'innocent side' of actions like like spying, stalking, obsessive thoughts, voyeurism, etc...
Hmm...now this is interesting. I get the ravenous curiosity, not so sure about the intrusiveness, though. I'll hazard a guess that this Page's curiosity is more along the lines of a prospective employer doing a background check on a job candidate rather than stalking or being voyeuristic. Like Marsy mentioned before, vetting or gathering intel.

Again, thanks for all your help and feedback. Sorry I took so long to respond. (Please spare the rod, mods!) ;)
 

Empress26

I see the page of swords as someone who is eager and excited about the beginning of a new venture. They maybe cant get enough of expressing their feelings about the person in question to the people closest to them or are very excited to talk to the person in question. They maybe want to communicate with you quite frequently to get to know you a bit better. Pages are all about the beginning of something new, youth, or immaturity. Swords are about intellectual clarity. I would see this as more of an "I'm open to communication and am eager and excited to do it" rather than "I'm defensive about this person". I hope that helped!

Edit: I'm not sure if you meant this as a reversal question or what, but of course, the reversal would mean they are quite guarded, are not sure if they want to proceed or continue open communication, and are very cautious about the person in question.
 

IndigoWaves

Person B may have been acting a bit cool or disengaged. Not on purpose but they maybe came off that way so Person A may have pulled back a little to analyze and assess the situation. Mayhaps?
Yes, "pulling back"/wariness fits snugly with that Page. So, if he/"A" has been acting remote lately, and that followed on the heels of a moment when she/"B" remembers having been chilly towards him, then that could be it.

...But if there's no such memory to rely on, it would still be good for "B" to start noting "A"'s reactions to her more closely, and her words/actions preceding any moments when he seems to ice over or turn sour. Examine his face: this Page has readied his sword and is grimly considering his next move. At the very least, something is unsettling "A" regarding "B".

In general, Swords in the soggy realm of "Feelings" are out-of-sorts and not at their best. It works the other way around, too; a Page of Cups would be inefficiently foggy-headed and uncomfortable in the arid world of "Thoughts"... Sure, he's a good guy, but I wouldn't want him as my lawyer, know what I mean? ;)