Paper from Baghdad

Rosanne

Oh for a change of pace.........here in this forum.

A friend PM'd me asking for some information about cards.
I thought her inquiry constituted a genuine historical inquiry.
Someone had asked if the Visconti cards were made of fabric.

Well, in one sense they were......(I think?)

In ancient times writing was generally on bamboo or on pieces of silk, which were then called ji. But silk being expensive and bamboo heavy, these two materials were not convenient. Then Tsai Lun thought of using tree bark, hemp, rags, and fish nets. In 105 he made a report to the emperor on the process of paper making, and received high praise for his ability. From this time paper has been in use everywhere and is called the "paper of Marquis Tsai."
From the History of Paper in Encyclopedia
Then from the History of Baghdad I find this...
For a long time the Chinese closely guarded the secret of paper manufacture and tried to eliminate other Oriental centers of production to ensure a monopoly. However in 751 A.D. the T'ang army was defeated by the Ottoman Turks at a mighty battle at the Talas River. Some Chinese soldiers and paper makers were captured and brought to Samarkand. The Arabs learned the paper making from the Chinese prisoners and built the first paper industry in Baghdad in 793 A.D. They, too, kept it a secret, and Europeans did not learn how to make paper until several centuries later. The Egyptians learned the paper making from the Arabs during the early 10th century. Around 1100 A.D. paper arrived in Northern Africa and by 1150 A.D. it arrived to Spain as a result of the crusades and established the first paper industry in Europe.

Originally it was not called Paper (from Papyrus) it was called several names as 'originating from Baghdad'..words like Bagdicus'

Today we have derogatory connotations of the word 'bagga' which was the term for the bundles of rags carried by those Eastern merchants and rag and bone men.
A woman who is worthless is called in English a Baggage. The etymology is very direct.
I wonder if the word bagatelle (the Card 1) has the same connotations?
Kwaw has said he thinks that the term means a trifle, but I wonder if it has a lesser meaning as worthless man?
Right next to him is the Papesse who seems in Tarot terms to be Holy.
I wonder if she is the worthless partner to him in the sense of watered down milk (Pap)
=false belief? Worthless information? Cant? Heresy? Distorted Canon Law?
It is interesting that the West in early times, was derogatory about Eastern invention. It has lasted a long time.
but back to paper...
Pasteboard is layers of 'paper' glued together to form card.
So the Visconti is, in actual fact, fabric.
~Rosanne
 

Zephyros

Sometimes books were made of linen-paper, which was stronger and would last longer than normal wood pulp. Were they made of that?
 

Rosanne

Hi Closrapexa!
I cannot find any information about the constitution of the hand painted cards...
I have this idea that it was made from mulberry leaves?
Italy did have a linen industry.
~Rosanne
 

gregory

WELL - to inject further research - I got out my Berti/Gonard book on the Visconti cards and there it all seems fairly clear. As far as I know Berti has worked with the actual cards in their various museums and he says:
...every card in this pack is a real jewel, a unique work of art produced as the result of complex procedures. The picture was first drawn on thick card or a sheet of paper that was then glued onto other sheets. Then every figure was painted in tempera and some areas were covered with thin layers of gold leaf. Finally, the gold was engraved with a burin or impressed with special tools in order to create sophisticated designs.

No mention of fabric as such. Not that I am done researching. But there is nothing in Kaplan to support it, nor in Dummett's book about the deck. Though in the sense Rosanne gives, they kind of were. The original version I heard (I was the one who PMd Rosanne !) there was an actual layer of silk in there - which seems not to have been the case. And I thought silk was not strong enough to make paper on its own... but if it was used as a PART of the paper-making process, that could be where the idea came from.
 

Teheuti

I've seen the originals both in Italy and in the research room of the Pierpont Morgan, where I was able to examine them closely with a magnifying glass. They appear to be several layers of paper glued together so they are firm - a cross between cardboard and paper-mâché. The paint is applied in layers (as can be seen in the better reproductions). I'm not sure if the composition of the paper could be determined without destroying one of the cards. Osvaldo Menegazzi worked with a woman who was trying to recreate the cards using the original process - as closely as possible. The card he showed me seemed just like the originals - it was the result of things learned after many earlier attempts by this woman.

The Gutenberg Bibles were printed on hemp paper - at least according to the card labeling the one I saw in a museum.
 

Zephyros

Were the background patterns hand-painted? They look like cloth stuck on.
 

Rosanne

Lucky Mary- I would pay a kings ransom to see the Cards! Like thin Paper-mache'? I wonder if this is what all pasteboard looked like?
I think the background was gold foil that was hammered to make the pattern. Very intricate goldsmiths work. The Cremona studio would have had a specific goldsmith to do that part of the work.
~Rosanne
 

Teheuti

Were the background patterns hand-painted? They look like cloth stuck on.
Cards like the Visconti-Sforza were handpainted - in several layers. Gold-leaf (or silver leaf in the case of another deck) was applied last and the designs were pressed into the gold in the patterns shown (as described in an earlier post above). No cloth was used that I know of.
 

Teheuti

Like thin Paper-mache'? I wonder if this is what all pasteboard looked like?
The round decks from India are produced in a similar way, though they are generally thinner and harder (they feel more brittle) than the Visconti ones.