Astrology sources before 1000 AD & a good study plan for tarot?

Good day!

A little background is probably useful at this point. I had read a number of books on tarot and occult practices/theories. These were interesting and stimulating reads. However I was curious to see what was the source material that these theories & practices were based on. I could be cynical and say that it was a fevered imagination that developed many of these practices but in fairness I believe these authors should have the benefit of the doubt.

Beyond a few books from the 1800's I cannot seem to find many other that relate to tarot.

At the moment from what I have seen I agree with contemporary thought on the origin of tarot. That is to say it was a nobleman's card game that's symbols was originally quite obvious and a product of that society where from it was created - that later had esoteric meaning grafted on to suit the purpose of the decks patron.

I looked at the two other popular theories but on balance the Egyptian and Gypsy while superficially compelling just didn't seem as watertight (especially the Egyptian).

I would love there to be a robust fact based theory explaining a deep and rich past to occult/esoteric tarot beyond the 1400s but honestly I cannot see it at the moment and unless there is some new discoveries made that debunks popular contemporary thought I don't think there will be.

So at this stage I decided that switching to the astrological foundation of the tarot would be a good move to progress further. My hunch is that with a deeper understanding of classical astrology the tarot would have new meaning and present a richer meaning. So I switched to trying to get my hands on as many astrology books as possible Luckily there are many sources going all the way back to 1200AD. (I guess it is a universal preoccupation across the ages to be obsessed by horoscopes )

But much like the tarot research I am now hitting "the wall" I found one plagiarized Latin translation of a Arabic work from 900AD.)

Its been great so far and I have really enjoyed seeing how things have developed. But its like a drug - Once you see one strand you want to go back further and further. like an itch you cannot scratch. I am sure I am not alone is this particular peculiarity.

What I am trying to do is find facsimile copies of older works.

My theory is that unless there was a terrible calamity then these Arabic texts should still be existent somewhere. hopefully available on the net...

Kabalah/I Ching would be another avenue I think that would bring greater perspective, once the astrology angle is exhausted (that should take far longer than the tarot literature.)

If anyone could give me a few pointers/advice & tips I would be grateful.


My major hope is that somewhere there is an Arkkadian / Egyptian resource on astrology.

Sorry for the long post.

Joanne Conman might interest you (although an unfortunate name) e.g. ‘Origins of Astrology: The Egyptian Legacy’ , ‘It's About Time: Ancient Egyptian Cosmology’, ‘The Egyptian Origins of Planetary Hypsomata’.

A different camp ; Otto Neugebauer. – heaps of stuff.

A lot of stuff around ; I suppose you have already Googled ‘Origins of Astrology’ ? Follow the references and bibliography.

Sites like this; http://www.sacred-texts.com/ane/mba/mba19.htm

Thank you, very useful.

On further googlin' on archive I found a Akkadian astrology book (who would have thought & even better it has a translation sister volume. )

Will be interesting to see the cross over between the Greek. or if they were distinct systems.

At the moment I am reading Lilly's books on astrology. and will work back from there.

This is interesting (from the site I posted a link to above) :

“Our signs of the Zodiac are of Babylonian origin. They were passed on to the Greeks by the Phœnicians and Hittites. "There was a time", says Professor Sayce, "when the Hittites were profoundly affected by Babylonian civilization, religion, and art. . . ." They "carried the time-worn civilizations of Babylonia and Egypt to the furthest boundary of Egypt, and there handed them over to the West in the grey dawn of European history. . . . Greek traditions affirmed that the rulers of Mykenæ had come from Lydia, bringing with them the civilization and treasures of Asia Minor. The tradition has been confirmed by modern research. While certain elements belonging to the prehistoric culture of Greece, as revealed at Mykenæ and elsewhere, were derived from Egypt and Phoenicia, there are others which point to Asia Minor as their source. And the culture of Asia Minor was Hittite."

Mr. Robert Brown, jun., who has dealt as exhaustively with the astronomical problems of Babylonia as the available data permitted him, is of opinion that the leading stars of three constellations are referred to, viz.: (1) the central or zodiacal constellations, (2) the northern constellations, and (3) the southern constellations. We have thus a scheme of thirty-six constellations. The "twelve zodiacal stars were flanked on either side by twelve non-zodiacal stars". Mr. Brown quotes Diodorus, who gave a résumé of Babylonian astronomico-astrology, in this connection. He said that "the five planets were called 'Interpreters'; and in subjection to these were marshalled 'Thirty Stars', which were styled 'Divinities of the Council'. . . The chiefs of the Divinities are twelve in number, to each of whom they assign a month and one of the twelve signs of the Zodiac." Through these twelve signs sun, moon, and planets run their courses. "And with the zodiacal circle they mark out twenty-four stars, half of which they say are arranged in the north and half in the south." 1 Mr. Brown shows that the thirty stars referred to "constituted the original Euphratean Lunar Zodiac, the parent of the seven ancient lunar zodiacs which have come down to us, namely, the Persian, Sogdian, Khorasmian, Chinese, Indian, Arab, and Coptic schemes".

Here we have some interesting ideas. The influence of the Hittites and the idea of constellations, off the ecliptic, being part of the scheme. We can see where the concept of the 12 sign/constellation/ ‘segment’ (i.e. 30 degree areas of space along the ecliptic) system and the multiple 36 decan (relating to asterisms off or on the ecliptic – the more Egyptian style) systems blend.

Regardless of relatively recent research ( decans on the ecliptic, decans in a band below the ecliptic), the more recent research seems to accept that the decans were not necessarily in a band … that is longitude was significant but not their latitude.

My conjecture is; hence they could be on or off the ecliptic – their influence when off the ecliptic could be calculated, when considering ‘planetary’ (i.e. Sun and Moon as well) relationship by their position perpendicular to the ecliptic (i.e. if you drew a line from pole to pole through that asterism, or specific star in that asterism, then where that line crosses the ecliptic) that part or point of the ecliptic has the same influence as the asterism or star.

A system like this often uses the travels of the Moon through various regions and here there are two interesting links between Vedic astrology and the ancient western type. There are many debates about origins and influences. In many places in the sacred texts article referenced above there is a link to pre-Vedic sources and mention of the old Babylonian or Sumerian traditions but there is a source earlier than this in the pre-Vedic/Iranian cultures with the ‘Proto-Indo European’ (the PIE peoples). Due to this I find the quote from above very interesting; “1 Mr. Brown shows that the thirty stars referred to "constituted the original Euphratean Lunar Zodiac, the parent of the seven ancient lunar zodiacs which have come down to us, namely, the Persian, Sogdian, Khorasmian, Chinese, Indian, Arab, and Coptic schemes".

The Sogdian ( being a name from that area of dominance of the PIE people) lunar zodiac, looks interesting, but I have yet to look at that one yet.

Hello Dan,
astrology is a fascinating subject, but it has little or nothing to do with the moral allegory expressed in the tarot trumps. If you are interested in the meaning of the Tarot for a learned Italian of the Renaissance, you could have a looks at what Francesco Piscina wrote in 1565:
http://www.tarotpedia.com/wiki/Francesco_Piscina_Discorso_1565

As an example of early playing-cards based divination, please check Francesco Marcolini's “Giardino di Pensieri” (1550):
http://archive.org/details/gri_000033125008238095
Even if you can't read Italian, the book is so beautiful that it is worth browsing through.
See also:
http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/works-of-art/37.37.23
http://www.tarotpedia.com/wiki/Marcolini,_Francesco


I think the most important classical source about Astrology is Ptolemy's Tetrabiblos (A.D. 150 ca):
http://www.sacred-texts.com/astro/ptb/
When you are done with Lilly, you will have no difficulty reading Ptolemy.

You can find many ancient astrological sources on Sky Script:
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/texts.html
More interesting and ancient stuff here:
http://cura.free.fr/DIAL.html#MA

A wonderful modern work joining Tarot and Astrology is the Liber-T deck, published by Lo Scarabeo. You should also try to get a copy of Scion's guide to the Decans, an excellent companion to the study of the pips of Liber-T:
http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=85073

For the past few decades, Robert Hand at Project Hindsight has been leading the way in translating Hellenistic and Arabic astrology. Robert Zoller has also done a lot of translation and I believe he offers a beginner's course in medieval astrology. For the astrology that was being done at the same time and place as the birth of tarot (early 15th century Italy) Guido Bonatti is the one to read. Benjamin Dykes has published a translation.
www.projecthindsight.com
www.bendykes.com

Lazy Man Argument

"To describe the dancing movements of these gods, their juxtapositions and the back-circlings and advances of their circular courses on themselves; to tell which of the gods come into line with one another at their conjunctions and how many of them are in opposition, and in what order and at which times they pass in front of or behind one another, so that some are occluded from our view to reappear once again, thereby bringing terrors and portents of things to come to those who cannot reason – to tell all this without the use of visible models would be labor spent in vain." - http://www.iep.utm.edu/astr-hel/

De Sidere

Marsilio Ficino said:

"The abstractionist and the materialist thus mutually exasperating each other, and the scoffer expressing the worst of materialism, there arises a third party to occupy the middle ground between these two, the skeptic, namely. He finds both wrong by being in extremes. He labors to plant his feet, to be the beam of the balance."

Click to expand...

http://cura.free.fr/decem/10voss.html

I✡I
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-2l72bVZXidY/UXxUScy8xtI/AAAAAAAAAEE/vmg2lM-OHSs/s1600/Ripples.jpg

The astrological content of Tarot comes by way of visual cues to unlocking a certain puzzle made of puns, drawn from a "Pythagorean" play on numbers. But only for those who can read the omens.

Selah