Tarot books in French

ihcoyc

Speaking of French texts, I wonder if anyone here has read Jodorowsky's recent La voie du tarot http://makeashorterlink.com/?C34C23749
My faded French would never survive over 500 pp of text (I just do a bit of Rimbaud) and I'm sure an eventual English translation is unlikely, but I'm curious as to what the co-designer of the Camoin has to say.

I'm interested in knowing what others have thought of this. I realise that I had heard of Jodorowsky's name in other contexts --- he also writes comic books. I believe I may have seen one in translation in Heavy Metal. Is this any good? It sounds more meditative than instructive.

Right now the only French language Tarot book I own is Carole Sédillot's Ombres et Lumières du Tarot. It is nicely comprehensive and well organized, and I would recommend it. I've also read Tarot et Graal, which was the subject of some discussion here last year; wouldn't recommend it - not because it's bad per se, but because it assumes you have already internalized the symbol vocabulary of a system it does not explain from the ground up. I've also read Maxwell's The Tarot in English; it is informative, but I found it somewhat old fashioned, rather like reading Dion Fortune without her occasional flashes of common sense.

(Somewhere in the intervening decades, the myths have changed; the old theosophical language needs to be updated for us to be comfortable with it. We end up embarrased for Waite when he starts going on about a Great White Brotherhood, or Fortune when she starts talking about racial destinies; I start getting a little nervous when anyone starts going on about active "male" and passive "female" qualities.)

I suppose I could count Berbiguier du Terre-Neuve du Thym's Les Farfadets. . . . Of all the various writers in French who touch on Tarot subjects, he is the most consistently eloquent and entertaining.
 

fyreflye

I realise that I had heard of Jodorowsky's name in other contexts --- he also writes comic books.

Jodorowsky is also the auteur of the '60's cult movie classic Il Topo, the only context in which his name was familiar to me. I was quite surprised to find him involved in tarot design, not to mention the fact that he's authored dozens if not hundreds of comics. Surely someone who adds eyelashes to the eyes on The Devil's tummy can't be all bad ;)
 

Diana

Jodorowsky is a very well-known celebrity in France. Most people know him for his comic books which are true works of art. He has dabbled successively in many other ventures and always manages to bring some magic into the world that he touches.

His creativity and imagination are without bounds, and he is an intriguing and very interesting person.

Most certainly a kind of a genius and he is a very important figure in the French cultural scene. Everyone has heard of Jodorowsky and he has a lot more friends than he does enemies.
---------------------

As to his book, La Voie du Tarot. An Aeclectic friend sent it to me as a gift, for which I am very grateful, as I would not have bought it myself.

Every day, I pick it up... and struggle to get to the end of each page. I page through it, trying to find something of real interest. Something that will make my ears prick up and say "yes!!!".


Still looking. If I find something, I'll let you know. If I haven't fallen asleep by then.
 

fyreflye

BTW, the name of Jodorowsky's movie is "El" Topo, not "Il "Topo. I must have seen the dubbed Italian version;) It's actually available on VHS in the US and Canada http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067866/
 

ihcoyc

Diana said:
As to his book, La Voie du Tarot. An Aeclectic friend sent it to me as a gift, for which I am very grateful, as I would not have bought it myself.

Every day, I pick it up... and struggle to get to the end of each page. I page through it, trying to find something of real interest. Something that will make my ears prick up and say "yes!!!".


Still looking. If I find something, I'll let you know. If I haven't fallen asleep by then.
I gather it's excessively abstract and rather dull to read?
 

tmgrl2

Diana said:
Jodorowsky is a very well-known celebrity in France. Most people know him for his comic books which are true works of art. He has dabbled successively in many other ventures and always manages to bring some magic into the world that he touches.

His creativity and imagination are without bounds, and he is an intriguing and very interesting person.

Most certainly a kind of a genius and he is a very important figure in the French cultural scene. Everyone has heard of Jodorowsky and he has a lot more friends than he does enemies.
---------------------

As to his book, La Voie du Tarot. An Aeclectic friend sent it to me as a gift, for which I am very grateful, as I would not have bought it myself.

Every day, I pick it up... and struggle to get to the end of each page. I page through it, trying to find something of real interest. Something that will make my ears prick up and say "yes!!!".


Still looking. If I find something, I'll let you know. If I haven't fallen asleep by then.

LOL....Diana...nice disclaimer in the first part.

I have to admit I have translated pieces of Jodo's book just to post samples from the book, not to say I agree with the content.

I still find Klea's work among the best I have in French: Au Fil d'Arcane


I also have Sedillot's book and Claude Darche's Manuel Pratique du Tarot

Like Klea's the best of ones I have.

I recently acquired Kris Hadar's Mon Premier Livre de Tarot
but haven't had time to read beyond the first 35 pages. Hope to get there when I am not working.

When I was posting more, I would sometimes translate pieces on the same topic by several of the authors just to give our non-French speaking/reading members a "flavor." It takes time to do this properly,though, as Diana has said many times.

I felt I wanted to "own" these books so over time I could judge for myself as well.



terri
 

Rusty Neon

I enjoy the tarot books by Jodorowsky, Bocher [Volume 1, Cahiers du Tarot], Marteau, Sédillot, Kléa, and des Longchamps. Each of those authors adds an enlightening perspective on the Tarot de Marseille.

Frankly, I don't understand why Jodorowsky as a tarot author is being dissed in this current thread on account of his being successful in other endeavours besides tarot and the occult sciences (e.g., novellist and fiction author; film producer and scenarioist; conception of bandes dessinées).

biography and interview

As a side note, I'd like to point out that bandes dessinées are more highly regarded in the Francophone world as literature and art form than 'comic books' are in the English world. (Even if it were comic books, why would that be bad anyways?) Francophone university literature departments offer courses in the literature of bandes dessinées.

Is a tarot book better simply because it's penned by an otherwise unemployed/unemployable person rather than someone like Jodorowsky who has been successful in 'day jobs' and has, by his shere variety of experiences, been exposed to many different facets?

The renown of Jodorowsky in his day jobs, the publication of his tarot book by a major French-language publishing house, and the fact that his book on the subject matter of the tarot is excellent can't help but further the growth of the Tarot de Marseille on its home soil. It's unusual that a book that covers all 78 cards of the deck, like Jodo's, could get such wide circulation; oftentimes, it seems that only a populist book on the 22 cards can make the cut for a major French-language publisher. As Firemaiden noted on another thread, Jodo's posters for Jodo's tarot book were even displayed in Paris subways. How's that for exposure for the Tarot de Marseille? The exposure of the public to the Tarot de Marseille will further pave the way to make the TdM even more mainstream in France and to make it easier for other tarot authors (new or seasoned) to get their books (especially books on the 78 cards) into the stores.

Jodo's book is thoughtful and well-written. It's written in a down-to-earth style. He clearly loves the Tarot de Marseille and has been reading tarot cards and studying the tarot for decades. I also noted that his biography shows an occult-based novel to his credit. His love of tarot and his appreciation of its mysteries clearly shows in his book.
 

Diana

Rusty Neon said:
Frankly, I don't understand why Jodorowsky as a tarot author is being dissed in this current thread on account of his being successful in other endeavours besides tarot and the occult sciences (e.g., novellist and fiction author; film producer and scenarioist; conception of bandes dessinées).

????????????????????

:confused: :confused: :confused:

Oh my Rusty Neon. Either you did not read my post attentively, or else you are deliberately twisting my words, or else you decided on the manner you were going to to answer my post before even reading it.

I hesitated whether I would bother to respond to this twisting of my words, but decided to do so, in case people do not go back and read my post and see that you are completely off-base.

Nowhere, but nowhere, did I diss Jodorowsky on account of his being successful in other endeavours.

ON THE CONTRARY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I posted that so people would realise the admiration I have for this man. He has done a lot for Tarot. I have read many interviews with him when he speaks of the Tarot - even in our local paper - (yes, local paper - read by only a few thousand - and a most interesting interview it was). I would go to his seminars if only they were in Switzerland.

I just do not like his BOOK, the one we are discussing here, at all. I find it boring and uninspirational. I cannot make head or tail sometimes of his commentaries and there are many things I do not agree with at all. I sometimes see a lack of logic and his treatment of the minor Arcana doesn't always make sense. His boundless and magical imagination that he possesses, he has tried to transpose in some parts of his book (for instance, when he gets the Major Arcana to speak) but it is neither here nor there and I just don't get anything out of these ramblings.

It is my opinion and I am entitled to give it.

Other people may get inspired by it. I dunno. I'm not other people.

I wish him and his publishers all the success that they wish for.

Please don't twist my words to suit your opinion of me. Thank you.

(As to bandes dessinées ("comics"), yes indeed, they are an art-form and have NOTHING to do with Superman, etc. They are an integral part of French Literature with a capital L. It is perhaps difficult for an anglo-saxon to realise this.)

The Tarot of Marseilles itself is a bande dessinée, in a way.