Cookbook interpretations

Hi --

I'm really enjoying the correspondence course I'm taking (by Joanne Wickenburg). I just completed the third tape, completing the signs. I'm very happy because I was never able in the past to really get a grip on the signs, and now I feel I have a good foundation, at least, for learning them.

I have a question about cookbook interpretations of planets in signs. From my work in Tarot, my inclination is to combine the planet and sign concepts myself; the idea of looking up the combinations in a cookbook is not very appealing. The impression I generally get from what I've read is that this is actually preferable, that one learn to come up with interpretations oneself rather than relying on cookbooks. Although I can see the value in looking up a few combinations if one's mind goes blank, and just to see different ways the concepts can be combined.

But my question is, when different authors write cookbooks, are they simply putting together the concepts the same way anyone could, or is there material there which has become traditional but which contains more than just a sign+planet derivation which one could come up with on one's own? In other words, if I in general do without cookbook interpretations, will I be missing something important?

What got me to thinking about this is, I was reading Robert Wang's handbook to his Jungian Tarot, in which he derives meaning for his unillustrated pip cards by using planet-in-sign meanings, and for his meaning for the 8 of Disks, Mercury in Capricorn, he says it means something like plans which have something hidden in them, something perhaps sinister underneath the stated intentions. After I thought about it awhile, I sort of see where this might fit in with Mercury in Capricorn, but it certainly isn't anything I would come up with if I were combining the meanings of Mercury and Capricorn. This got me to wondering whether there are traditional planet-in-sign meanings which go beyond concepts-of-the-planet-plus-concepts-of-the-sign, in perhaps the same way that the meanings of the signs go beyond the concepts of the quality combined with the concepts of the element.

I hope I'm articulating this clearly... hopefully you all understand what I'm trying to say!

-- Lee

Lee, I was just about to PM you to find out how you like your course, and saw this thread! I'm delighted that you are enjoying the classes.

Astrological cookbooks work especially well for those who are becoming fluent in the language of symbols. Your extensive experience with tarot puts you far ahead of the game. If you understand the principles behind the planets, signs and houses (and eventually aspects), it will not be difficult to arrive at your own understandings of their combinations.

That said, some cookbooks are so good that "gourmet chefs" continue to use them as points of reference. I am thinking of Robert Hand's Planets in Transit and Sue Tompkins' Aspects in Astrology, but there are others and you will know them when you see them: A good astrological cookbook allows for individual differences and is written in a way that is deep and involving, with attention to subtlety and shades of meaning. In that sense, the astrological cookbook issue is analogous to your take on Wang's book on the Jungian Tarot.

I think that at all stages of learning, it is wise not to ignore the conventional wisdom collected in a cookbook, but neither should we be constrained by it. All cookbooks -- whether astrological, tarot-based, or kitchen-related -- serve as a basis for our own creative explorations, once we understand ingredients and the principles of combination.

Some favorite books

A cookbook can jump-start the interpretation process when you are stumped or blocked, and can "flesh out" a sketchy intuition. Here are some books having good cookbook components, and much more:

The Astrologer's Handbook by Frances Sakoian and Louis S. Acker
Chart Interpretation Handbook by Stephen Arroyo
Astrology: Understanding the Birth Chart by Kevin Burk
The Ultimate Astrologer by Nick Campion
Astrology for the Soul by Jan Spiller (this book is about the lunar nodes, but its descriptions of the signs are unexcelled IMO.)
The A-Z Horoscope Maker and Delineator by Llewellyn George (this book has been revised several times; its earliest editions were very doom-and-gloomy, but the latest revision has been brought up-to-date and is less negative. All editions are useful, however.)

Just fyi...

Lee, I'm still learning about the planet in sign by following the historical thread of people who mention 'decanates' and degrees of correspondence along the line of a calendar year.

One Italian cathedral (Sienna-Giotto) circa 1300s shows astrological influences, maybe even decanate understanding by way of how the sun strikes the cathedral glass windows of the astrological signs. One duchy, Ferarra, circa 1440s, shows astrological decanate understanding in its remaining palace murals. The commentary by someone writing about tarocchi and romantic poet MM Boiardo is there were humerous references to Egyptian mythology and his nephew or younger cousin's neoplatonic Pico di Mirandola treatises (oh what a great wonder is man---Mirandola escaped papal wrath by fleeing to France shortly after his treatises. Mirandola was supposedly welcomed in French courts, but I don't know where). It may be reaching, but Renaissance thinking may still be haunting some astrological modes...

Of course there's a 600 year gap in my knowledge about historical astrology and treatment of decanates, as I've only gone as far forward as trying to start checking in the Du Berry's hours--that would be French style art with delicate Italianate costumery or art in the 1500s...one thing that I have to keep in mind is the historical concepts of astrology, time, accuracy unfolded over such times. I believe the definition of hours was a Renaissance construct and I don't know when minutes was introduced into astrological timetables.

But here's my leap: in more modern early 1900 card deck/books, I see the influence in planet-in-sign style oracle decks. People can correct me for jumping too far forward in assumptions, sorry beforehand...

One tarot that touches on decanate astrology could be the Caligstro, out of Modiano, Trieste, Italy, also published by U.S. Games. The original one was circa 1910 or 1912. There's a definite playing card influence in the minors---which I'm not certain about in terms of authenticity, but are pretty in the French suited way.

An 'astrological tarot' or 48 card set that follows decanates that I've been looking up is the Georges Muchery, a French astrologer, whose deck and books are being reprinted under the direction of a daughter-in-law or relation by marriage--that was also circa early 1900s-1912.

I don't know if this helps at all, but it's one thread that I seem to be following...maybe a false clew of thread, but maybe helpful?

Mari H.

Thanks, Astraea! I was happy to see your list because I've got the first three books on it, so that's good news.

Hi Mari, I'm afraid I can't even think about decanates yet, I'm still trying to absorb what Pisces means!

-- Lee

Lee,

Try writing down your own interpretation using planet meanings and sign meanings and then see how they compare to a good cookbook, like Arroyo's. Then ask

How much is my interpretation common to Arroyo's (or whomever)

What did they get that I didn't - why did the say that?

Did I get anything that they didn't ? Why did I say that?

You will find that you can learn from a good cookbook - not only as Astraea says because some are produced by Gourmet Chef's but because you can begin to deconstruct them back to first principles and begin to undertand their thought processes and methods of interpretation.


You can then begin to develop and affirm your own approaches. Don't worry if you differ on some matters from the cookbook - if you know why you differ and can see the Astrological or symbolic arguments then your view is in a way as good as theirs.

I love recipes, but I love more the ability to vary and improvise on their themes - getting the basics helps to develop individual style.

Lee, another good way to get a feel for it, is to just get cooking! After you've read the recipes, if it's possible, try them out on ppl ^_^

Minderwiz, I'm going to follow your excellent suggestion, thanks!

-- Lee

Lee,

I'm sure it will work for you - you are already much of the way there - trust in your own intuition but make sure that you know the basic symbolism of planets, signs and houses.

Just a memory...

Hello Lee, I do admire your studying in a very organized fashion. I've been doing 'relational' studies by starting from an art tarot or seeing playing cards and art from a certain period...then exploring what historians or hobbyists say about that time in history. So I've only been getting tastes, 'flavorings' and a stew-and-bread kind of sips. You sound as if you are sitting down to a lovely meal that starts with an appetizer and ends in a cleansing salad or sorbet.
It's not the same way that you are studying astrology, so the questions that I have won't really pertain to your studies...but I am amazed at how period certain used astrology books feel...I remember my mother's bedside reading for fun was "Linda Goodman's Sun Signs" and my younger sister thought it was a charming storylike chattyness...in the same way, we both enjoyed the food writer, MFK Fisher. Kind of sweet, confidential and as if people were talking about relational ideas and people you knew. I wouldn't say it was actually accurate, but we got the feel for the general 'flavors'. For instance, Gemini being light-hearted and chatty, but scatter-brained at times or Leo being fiery and sensual and proud, etc...that's a popular personality-sun sign sort of slant we grew up on.