Aeclectic Tarot
Tarot Cards & Reviews          Free Tarot Readings           What's New           Tarot Card Meanings

How To Laminate Cards?

  > Aeclectic Tarot Forum > Tarot > Tarot Deck Creation




 
tarotlyn's Avatar
tarotlyn  tarotlyn is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 17 May 2007
Location: Spirit World in California, USA!
Posts: 6,702
tarotlyn 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregory
Has anyone here been given a cold laminated deck that started to peel and put it trough a hot laminator to fix ?? (not the CARD peeling, ONLY the laminate...) My cold laminator won't take single cards that I can see...
Yes, I tried that with the cards that were separating, and it does not work.

So, first they were cold laminated, then used a lot, then separated
(not all of the deck but probably about 1/3 of the cards in the deck).

I did run them through a hot laminator and it did not seal the separation because
the separation was actually the card stock (in the center) that separated.

So the cold laminator works perfectly...and I am thinking it is the paper that is
the problem. The cold lamination film with the Xyron 9 or 5 does NOT peel off the corners.
It is the paper separating actually.

So, you only have need for a cold Xyron laminator with ROLL lamination...
it is so easy and looks great and wears great, but it is so strong on the
corners that it pulls on the card stock, thus causing the card stock to
separate from itself. It tends to pull from the FRONT not the back.
So you then have a very thin front corner laminate that still has the 'image'
of the card adhered to it, but most of the rest of the card stock has separated
from this. The back corner is stable because it has most of the card stock
still adhered to it.

So, I am inclined now, to think that maybe there is a process in which we
might be able to 'strengthen' all of the corners BEFORE lamination! What a
great idea, thank you, aurarcana.

I think, maybe, we should pursue along the lines of 'sealing the corners' before lamination.
Note: I have tried a sealant on the face and the back of the cards
but it tends to leave lines and shows through the lamination. I have tried thinning
down the sealant with water, but then it 'curls' the card stock way too much.
I never thought about JUST sealing the corners only...what a great idea!

Except, if you want to do that BEFORE lamination (which makes sense),
then you would have to cut the cards out BEFORE lamination and that
means you couldn't use the Xyron 9 machine and you would have to use
the Xyron 5 machine instead...at a GREATER COST...only 18' per roll verses
about 40 to 50' per roll. YIKES...that is a big difference.

So, since I only make my cards for 'myself'...I do not sell cards I make...
then it probably makes better sense, for me, to just 'glue' the corners when
the fluff and separate. If someone is selling them, then they would have to
cut out each card from the card stock page, then seal the corner somehow,
then laminate on the manual cold xyron 5" laminator. It adheres much better
than the hot lamination pouches talked about here. As I said above, the main
drawback this way, is the cost effectiveness.


RE: corner rounder
Then, after laminating, I cut the cards out, and then I use my manual corner rounder
(Lassco model 20) that I bought on ebay for around $149. BUT worth it...every penny)
The very thin lamination from the Xyron machines is NOT a problem with my
corner rounder machine and the process for rounding a whole deck only takes minutes.
The corner rounder instructions say you can do many at once, but I only do
one at a time because I want it 'precise'...since I am a very detailed and precise person...

A word about the 'cold' Xyron lamination.
I find it so much better than hot lamination because it is never stiff ... very
nice and flexible. And if you want thicker cards, just up the paper weight you use.
Thinner cards? ...of course, lower the paper weight.

BTW, since gregory is using a 120 gsm card stock (which is a 32# weight in the usa),
she probably doesn't have as much problem with the card stock itself separating.

For me, the 32# paper with a 3 mil hot pouch would be thinner, but I think,
still to 'stiff.' I am thinking of experimenting with a 58# paper next and see
if it is too thin with the xyron lamination. I think it will be too thin, for me.

Re: 12 mil card stock
I recently found that different 'brands,' that list the same 12 mil thickness,
are actually not the same. Some brands say 12 mil but are a little thinner than 12 mil! ...go figure
So then that can make a difference. You just have to do a lot of experimenting.

If anyone has any ideas on how to 'reinforce' the corners BEFORE peeling,
that would be very helpful to post in this thread...

tarotlyn
Top   #41
Alta's Avatar
Alta  Alta is offline
Golden Silvery Dionna
 
Join Date: 06 Aug 2001
Location: Canada
Posts: 27,056
Alta 

I made this thread a Sticky, great reference info!
Top   #42
tarotlyn's Avatar
tarotlyn  tarotlyn is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 17 May 2007
Location: Spirit World in California, USA!
Posts: 6,702
tarotlyn 

I just had another thought, regarding 'sealing the corners first' then laminating:

A while back, cardlady22 mentioned 'gilting' the edges with a metallic INK PAD...
...something I am also interested in doing.

I think I have the links somewhere and will post them in the thread when I find them...
...also I will look for that 'glue the corners' article again for everyone.

What if, we cut out the cards BEFORE lamination, then 'gilted' all four edges,
maybe even doing 'double gilting' on just the corners? I am thinking that the
gilted paint (ink?) might be enough to seal and hold the card stock together
on the corners. This would be done BEFORE lamination. I think it just might be the solution.

As I said in a previous post, the drawback would be that then you would have
to use the Xyron 5" cold lamination machine and run each (precut) card through
at a time, WHICH IS going to cost you more than using the Xyron 9" machine.
BUT, I am pretty sure the corners would not have a problem this way.

Any other thoughts, anyone?

tarotlyn
Top   #43
gregory's Avatar
gregory  gregory is offline
Cat on a cold stone roof
 
Join Date: 01 Jan 2004
Location: The world of the things that could have been.
Posts: 72,249
gregory 

No - tarotlyn - my paper is not separating; it is the laminate that is peeling off. I even thought to FINISH peeling it off, and running the affected 2-3cards through in a new hot pouch - but those cards then wouldn't match.... So what happens if you hot laminate cold laminated cards in their cold laminate - do they - MELT ?????
Top   #44
tarotlyn's Avatar
tarotlyn  tarotlyn is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 17 May 2007
Location: Spirit World in California, USA!
Posts: 6,702
tarotlyn 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregory
No - tarotlyn - my paper is not separating; it is the laminate that is peeling off. I even thought to FINISH peeling it off, and running the affected 2-3cards through in a new hot pouch - but those cards then wouldn't match.... So what happens if you hot laminate cold laminated cards in their cold laminate - do they - MELT ?????
gregory, that was what I was talking about previously, when I used
the hot lamination 3 mil pouches, they DID PEEL...I was able to just grab the
corner lamination and peel it right off of the card...it felt like it had more of a
'suction' than an adherence. There is no adhesive inside the hot pouches,
whereas, the cold laminate (roll or pouches), does have adhesive on the inside.

I also tried running some cold (Xyron roll) laminated cards through the hot laminator
on a LOW heat setting, and they do not melt, BUT IF you cold laminate, there is
'no need' to run them through the hot laminator because the cold laminate
(any cold lamination pouches, or any cold lamination -on the roll- machine) really adheres to
the card stock strongly.

gregory, your 120 gsm paper (32# in the usa) is thin enough to 'not' separate.
BUT...the hot pouch is the problem I think...at least that is what I found out
in my experimentations. IF you switch to the cold lamination, you may find
that your 120 gsm may be too thin and you may want to switch to a thicker
card stock. I think you would like the 'flexibility' of the more supple cold laminate
verses the awful 'stiffness' of the hot laminate pouches.

If you want to stay with your present method of hot lamination, then it might
help IF you DON'T cut the lamination all the way up to or off at the exact
edge of the card. In other words, if you leave a slight edge of laminate showing,
it should keep the seal, because the hot pouches stick to EACH OTHER, NOT to the paper.
My problem with this, is that I just don't like the sight of
the card having a visible laminate border showing Plus, I don't like
the overall stiffness of the hot laminate. Some people may perfer this stiffness
and strength over the more flexible cold laminate. (just not me! LOL )

I am still in the experimental stages with different weights of paper. But I will
continue to use the 'cold' lamination process, as the best for myself.

Each person will have their own preferences in regard to thickness of the paper,
the thinness of the laminate, and whether they prefer cold verses hot laminate.
It really just takes a lot of experimentation...and also USING the cards a LOT
to find out if they peel or separate at the corners, and how well they wear overall.

gregory I hope that helps some?
tarotlyn

ETA:
Hot pouches DON'T stick to the paper at all.
They just seal around the edges and INCASE the card.
Top   #45
gregory's Avatar
gregory  gregory is offline
Cat on a cold stone roof
 
Join Date: 01 Jan 2004
Location: The world of the things that could have been.
Posts: 72,249
gregory 

We are getting TOTALLY cross confused here !!

ALL my hot laminated cards are fine. Even cut right to the edges and everything - I never had a problem there.

BUT - I was given a cold laminated deck. On a few of the cards the cold laminate is peeling off. (Clearly the glue isn't quite that 100% !) What I don't really want to do is finish peeling them (the paper is fine ) and hot laminate them as they will feel quite different. But what happens if I run them (complete with cold laminate) through a hot laminator - does anyone know or can anyone test to find out (I would use a carrier; I am not having them melt all over the roller... !)
Top   #46
tarotlyn's Avatar
tarotlyn  tarotlyn is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 17 May 2007
Location: Spirit World in California, USA!
Posts: 6,702
tarotlyn 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregory
We are getting TOTALLY cross confused here !!

ALL my hot laminated cards are fine. Even cut right to the edges and everything - I never had a problem there.

BUT - I was given a cold laminated deck. On a few of the cards the cold laminate is peeling off. (Clearly the glue isn't quite that 100% !) What I don't really want to do is finish peeling them (the paper is fine ) and hot laminate them as they will feel quite different. But what happens if I run them (complete with cold laminate) through a hot laminator - does anyone know or can anyone test to find out (I would use a carrier; I am not having them melt all over the roller... !)
...ah...now that is a different horse of another color

...sorry, gregory, if I misunderstood you (and it's not even Mercury retrograde! LOL)

Now doing what you want to do "run them (complete with cold laminate) through a hot laminator"
might get them so hot, in that case I could not say if it would melt or not.

I see your situation though, 78 cards, are a lot of cards to peel off and
carefully too!

Maybe someone else has had this experience?

Note: that is really weird, cold laminate that didn't stick! I have never seen that before.

I can try it for you, but I think it would be different if you are using a different
hot machine than I am and probably a different cold laminate than I am using.

If this helps: I can set mine to 3 mil heat. Can you set yours the same?
If so, then I can try this for you to see if it melts. Keep in mind that my
cold laminate will have a lot of adhesive to the card, whereas yours do not.
So I don't know if that will have a different effect because of that.
tarotlyn
Top   #47
gregory's Avatar
gregory  gregory is offline
Cat on a cold stone roof
 
Join Date: 01 Jan 2004
Location: The world of the things that could have been.
Posts: 72,249
gregory 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tarotlyn
Note: that is really weird, cold laminate that didn't stick! I have never seen that before.

I can try it for you, but I think it would be different if you are using a different hot machine than I am and probably a different cold laminate than I am using.

If this helps: I can set mine to 3 mil heat. Can you set yours the same?
If so, then I can try this for you to see if it melts. Keep in mind that my cold laminate will have a lot of adhesive to the card, whereas yours do not.
So I don't know if that will have a different effect because of that.
tarotlyn
I wouldn't worry YET. I am not with them just now anyway, but it occurs to me that I could try with an iron on very low heat and up it slowly till they stick.... TOTAL control !

Thanks for trying; in a few weeks I may get back to you !
Top   #48
tarotlyn's Avatar
tarotlyn  tarotlyn is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 17 May 2007
Location: Spirit World in California, USA!
Posts: 6,702
tarotlyn 

Quote:
Originally Posted by gregory
I wouldn't worry YET. I am not with them just now anyway, but it occurs to me that I could try with an iron on very low heat and up it slowly till they stick.... TOTAL control !

Thanks for trying; in a few weeks I may get back to you !
gregory, that is an excellent idea...maybe use a 'waxed' paper between the
laminate and the iron... not sure if the wax would come off on the laminate though

Let us know how that works for you?... excellent idea!

ETA: 'duh' ... I just had an afterthought...you put the 'waxed side' on
the hot iron, not on the laminate! ... too much thinking over here...LOL Ha Ha
Top   #49
strings of life's Avatar
strings of life  strings of life is offline
Citizen
 
Join Date: 24 Jun 2009
Location: .
Posts: 6,658
strings of life 

tarotlyn, this is the thread on gilt edging. I'm one of the people that does it often : an experiment at gilt edging.

I'm going to add gilt edges to the first deck I laminate. I didn't think about that being a good sealant! Great idea .

I'm only going to be laminating decks for personal use and I liked the small size of the 5" Xyron, but I can see how the 9" would save me money when it comes to larger rolls of laminate. So far, I only have 2 decks I want and will laminate (so far): my Book of Kaos and my Tarot Nusantara. I have a back-up of the Tarot Nusantara, but not the Kaos. Yes, I'll be laminating the actual decks, both of which are too thin for use.

I'd love to see if there is some kind of bonding agent, like a glue, that I can apply to the edges after I laminate the cards, perhaps with a small paint brush, to further seal the edges. Do you think that would be going overboard? Based on your feedback (which is again, much appreciated ), it seems like the corners are the only major issue with cold lamination, and only after extensive use.
Top   #50




 

 


Tarot Cards & Reviews          Free Tarot Readings           What's New           Tarot Card Meanings
Aeclectic Tarot Forum Links
· Tarot
· Tarot Special Interest
· Beyond Tarot
· Forum Library

Aeclectic Tarot Categories
· Angel Decks
· Dark & Gothic Decks
· Goddess Decks
· Fairy Decks
· Doreen Virtue Decks
· Beginner Decks
· Cat Decks
· Pagan & Wiccan Decks
· Ancient Egyptian Decks
· Celtic Decks
· Lenormand Decks
· Rider-Waite Decks
· Marseilles Decks
· Thoth Decks
· Oracle Decks
· List All Decks
· Popular Tarot Decks
· Available Decks
· Tarot Books
· What's New

Copyright © 1996 - 2020 Aeclectic Tarot. All rights reserved. Privacy Policy. Contact us.