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Lynda  Lynda is offline
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Hey Guys
When reading the Symbols, one reads the degree plus one for the actual degree as the zodiac starts at 0 and the Symbols at 1. This means that a planet or point at 0 Aries is Aries 1 -

e.g. Mercury at 15.27 Scorpio is read Scorpio 16... in fact, even 15.00 Scorpio is read as 16.

Fascinating insights can be seen by reading the degree before (every degree holds the 'impulse' of the degree before). This I see as being the 'karmic condition' of the planet or point (of any zodiac point for any reason). It describes the things (talents, abilities, ideas perfected, habits, life situations, etc, that feel very 'present' as well as 'past'). These are brought over from past lives in every sense of the expression.

The actual degree describes the personality, the outward expression, what we do with our lives. We have that talent, obsession, compulsion, habit) behind us; we have transits of planets, etc, over the degree before every time we move into an exact aspect.

The degree after the degree is what was laid down in our personalities in the first year after birth. These things are showing us ways to our future. Reading the degree after often shows what needs to be embraced in order to move on in our lives.

Hence, one would read 15.27 Scorpio as

Actual Symbol: Scorpio 16
Degree before: Scorpio 15
Degree after: Scorpio 17

This sounds like a lot of work when one looks up their Sun, Moon, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, etc, etc! But after a while it all starts to make sense. It's very illuminating, to say the least. Having said that, it can best be experienced as an unfolding, taking time to integrate the meanings into your life. The zodiac acts as a giant hologram around the earth; acting as the earth's aura. The Symbols hold a 'charge' in the degrees through their symbolisms.

Every single factor in a chart may be read with great insight, whether it's a planet, asteroid, ascendant, midheaven, Arabic part. My take on it is that where one seeks significance (for whatever reason), one will find significance.

Watching your life unfold through transits and progressions reveals a rich tapesty of life experience. It's all aweinspiring and the Symbols provide a field of energy in which one can create alchemies in one's life. Huge shifts of consciousness can occur swiftly with realisations and insights into how one can come to embrace the true self.

It's an exciting journey!

Greetings from Avalon
Lynda
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Lynda  Lynda is offline
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Planets and their meanings


Hi Pipistrelle
I won't post all the meanings of planets, perhaps someone else would like to do it. Lots of information can be found on the net...

But, yes, you read the planets with the Symbols, but the Symbols seem to be a bit 'slippery' and squeeze out of the confines.

To clarify, I've seen someone who approached their relationship issues through the Symbol of their Jupiter. Venus would normally be thought of for issues to do with love, but this woman's philosophical stance (her Jupiter) was coloured by the Symbol being in Libra (the sign of relationships) on Libra 18: Two Men Placed Under Arrest. She saw relationships as being 'arrested' in many ways.

Her Venus described her philosophical stance more than her relationships. Her Venus was Libra 30: Three Mounds of Knowledge on a Philosopher's Head. She thought with her head more than her emotions. She analysed relationships, which if course can lead to 'people being held under arrest' as no one could get close enough to her. She was somehow 'handcuffing' her relationships through her mind-set (Jupiter).

I hope this makes sense - it's late!

Lynda
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Pipistrelle  Pipistrelle is offline
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Hi Lynda,

Thanks for that - it really helps. I'm looking forward to delving into the mysteries of my chart using the symbols (or vice versa!)

Also, thanks for the example in your second post...I feel much clearer now about what I'm supposed to be doing with them and I will be posting any insights here...

Night night.

Pip
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Lynda  Lynda is offline
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Hi Pipistrelle
After posting the piece about that woman's Venus and Jupiter placements, I had a look at my transits and found that right when I wrote it, transiting Venus was smack on my Jupiter! Such fun, the synchronicities. There I was, linking Venus and Jupiter and there Venus was, linking herself with my Jupiter.

I love this stuff. I'm glad that you're making sense of it. It can take a while to get into it all, but suddenly it all starts to pull together.

Lynda
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Elven  Elven is offline
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Hi All
Im going to have a go at the astrology aspect of the Symbols - bear with me - as I have no idea what Im doing!

I wanted to see if I could do someones chart. I went to the 'Astrodienst' and found these Planetary Positions and think this is what the Symbols are read from. (Please correct anything I have wrong, I think this is where I start from).

Is this correct?

Sun: Capricorn 12 degrees - Sabian Symbol Capricorn degree 13. House 03

Moon: Aquarius degree 18 - Sabian Symbol Aquarius degree 19. House 05

Mercury: Capricorn degree 0 - Sabian Symbol Capricorn degree 1. House 03

Venus: Aquarius degree 8 - Sabian Symbol Aquarius degree 9. House 04

Mars: Scorpio degree 16 - Sabian Symbol Scorpio degree 17. House 01

Jupiter: Pisces degree 13 - Sabian Symbol Pisces degree 14. House 05

Saturn: Libra degree 0 - Sabian Symbol Libra degree 1. House 12

Uranus: Scorpio degree 5 - Sabian Symbol Scorpio degree 6. House 01

Neptune: Gemini degree 6 - Sabian Symbol Gemini degree 7. House 08

Pluto: Gemini degree 7 - Sabian Symbol Gemini degree 8. House 08

True Node: Taurus degree 25 - Sabian Symbol Taurus degree 26. House 07


A couple of things here
Assuming that the above is correct - what role does the 'House' play in the reading, and how do I interpret that into the reading?

The list that I obtained also had 'House Positions' - example:
Ascendant Libra degree 27.
Does this also have a Sabian Symbol applied to it? - example:
Sabian Symbol Libra degree 28.

Next

The chart also had 'Major Aspects' - does the same thing apply? example:
Sun Sextile Mars degree 4-11.
Does this have a Sabian Symbol also? Im not sure how to interpret this with no Sun Sign attatched.

I hope some one can help.

Thanks guys !!

Blessings
Elven x
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Pipistrelle  Pipistrelle is offline
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Hi Elven,

Glad to see I'm not the only one venturing into the unknown

The symbols you've got seem correct to me (i.e. planet degree plus one) - apart from the Moon, which I think must be a typo Interesting no fire signs.

Regarding the "house", this quote from The Astrologer's Handbook might help:
"The relationships between planets, signs and the houses of the horoscope can be described in terms of a play. The planets represent the actors, indicating the major psychological drives in a person's makeup. The sign in which a planet is placed indicates the role the actor is playing: the approach or mode of expression he uses to obtain his objectives. The house in which a planet is placed, regardless of the sign, depicts the stage or setting in which the activity takes place. It indicates what department of life is affected."

I have also found this site http://www.north-node.com/tutorials excellent for a know-nothing beginner such as myself - it just deals with the basics and has descriptions for all planets, signs and houses.

As I am said know-nothing beginner, I don't mind at all if Lynda or anyone else jumps in here and corrects me if I've told you wrong. This might be a case of the blind leading the blind. However, I'm really interested in learning more about astrology so hopefully we'll be able to learn from each other. I've just ordered "The Inner Sky", which I'm hoping will help me better weave together the elements of planet, sign and house in a chart.

The Ascendant is considered very important and is usually one of the top three elements in a chart that is first considered: Sun, Moon and Asc. The Ascendant, from what I can gather, is the face you wear in public, how you present yourself to others etc.

Regarding aspects, I'm in "don't go there girl" mode with those at the moment - seeing as I can't even work out the simple stuff - so can't tell you anything about those!

Anyway, I hope this is of some help...

Pip
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Hi Pip, hi all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipistrelle
The symbols you've got seem correct to me (i.e. planet degree plus one) - apart from the Moon, which I think must be a typo Interesting no fire signs.
OMG, thanks for picking that up Pip, I didn't notice it - I'll go in and edit it - thankyou!

I had a look at the website you provided, and have printed out the meanings of the Planets - Houses and Ascendants - and am now the proud owner of Elvis Presleys natal chart by default! LOL! Pity its not his chart I'm doing.

Thanks for the info. Its like trying to learn another language for me, its going to take some time for it to sink in, but I'll do a bit at a time and post up to check with everyone that Ive got it right.

Thanks so much for your help! ... and Ive printed this out also.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipistrelle
Regarding the "house", this quote from The Astrologer's Handbook might help:
"The relationships between planets, signs and the houses of the horoscope can be described in terms of a play. The planets represent the actors, indicating the major psychological drives in a person's makeup. The sign in which a planet is placed indicates the role the actor is playing: the approach or mode of expression he uses to obtain his objectives. The house in which a planet is placed, regardless of the sign, depicts the stage or setting in which the activity takes place. It indicates what department of life is affected."

Many Blessings
Elven x
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Pipistrelle  Pipistrelle is offline
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Okay. I’m going to have a crack at this. Feel free to play along

I’m starting simply by looking at the Sabian symbol for my Sun degree, which is Sagittarius 6: A Game of Cricket. This is also the symbol for my Mercury, so things I say here may be more relevant to that planet, but at the moment I don’t know.

When I first looked up the symbols for my birthday (Sagittarius 5, 6 & 7) I had an instant connection with Sagittarius 5: An Old Owl Perched High Up in a Tree. The other two symbols – Sagittarius 6: A Game of Cricket, and Sagittarius 7: Cupid Knocking on the Door of a Human Heart – didn’t evoke such an immediate reaction. As a result, as I’ve been thinking about A Game of Cricket over the last few days and what it means to me, it has truly been quite a revelation. I am quite astounded how much resonance this symbol does have for me and how much its influence is visible in my personality.

So, I’m going to start with what this symbol means to me. Taken literally, there is quite a strong link between this symbol and my family: my brother, dad and grandad are/were all cricketers. When I was younger, we would often go on a Sunday afternoon to watch my brother play. I remember lazing in the shade on sunny afternoons, the crack of ball on bat, cricket whites and the typically English half-cheer of “howzat!” whenever a batsman was caught out. So it is this that I see in my mind when I think of “A Game of Cricket” – as opposed to the more modern version: international matches on TV, coloured uniforms, beer drinking spectators etc. I think this in itself is significant.

So, to me, A Game of Cricket represents:
Fair play
Civilised behaviour
Polite society
Everyone adhering to the same rules
The gentlemen’s game
Leisurely Sunday afternoons
Break for tea
“Whites” = purity
Both teams wearing the same colour
Observing the rules

I have written all this so you will have some idea of where I’m coming from for the rest of my post. I’ve tried to organise my thoughts so that I won’t ramble but it’s quite difficult so apologies if I do

I can see three ways in which “A Game of Cricket” affects me.

1. As a philosophy
Cricket is generally seen as the most civilised sport. Players receive polite applause when they walk out to bat. It is not a contact sport. It is played at a leisurely pace. The players on both teams wear “whites”, which represents purity and also gives the impression that they are not really “opposing” teams, they are all playing the game as equals. There are, in my experience, very few conflicts – no fighting or fouling. Cheating, although known, is not common.
In terms of a philosophy, this represents how I see the world (not so much now, since I married a realist and he is trying to “educate” me). I am very much a wearer of rose-tinted spectacles In my world, everyone’s intentions are pure, everyone is playing by the rules and everyone gets along. I have been extremely gullible in the past and so I’ve learned from experience that this isn’t always the case, but I do still hold these values dear. Good manners, etiquette (the being nice to people kind, not the stuffy rules for no good reason kind) and consideration for others are important to me – although, I hasten to add, I don’t always live up to my own standards. I abhor rudeness.

2. As a mask
Despite all civility and niceties, cricket is still a competitive sport. One team always has to win and in order to win, you have to beat the other team. Beneath the polite veneer, a battle is in progress. Yet, a game of cricket gives the impression that all is right with the world: it represents, for me, the way “polite” society doesn’t air its dirty laundry in public. Ironically, as I write this, my next-door neighbour is loudly cussing her dog (I believe, from the context, it has left a present for her in the house) and this is exactly the type of thing that I like to avoid. I am a very private person and there are certain things I don’t like to discuss. I keep my skeletons safely locked in my closet and I don’t discuss my bodily functions, my sex life, my indiscretions (which I don’t have, of course) or anything else that is nobody else’s business but my own. Unfortunately, I extend this rule to people I am close to, not just strangers, meaning that I have very civil conversations with my parents where I don’t talk about anything that is important to me but might be “socially unacceptable” – including, but not limited to, tarot and druidry. The only person in the world that I feel comfortable enough to be my “true self” with is my husband (and even then…)


3. As a limitation
This is probably the most important aspect of the symbol for me, and has been the most revealing over these past few days. Given what I’ve said so far about what “A Game of Cricket” means to me, you can probably tell that I focus on the behaviour of the players and the expectations therein. If you can imagine a big, bright, fiercely glowing sun and then try filtering that through “A Game of Cricket”, you will probably see where these limitations come in.
First, I would rather take a lie to my grave than admit something that might cause conflict. Conflict avoidance is a big thing with me (and I have Moon in Libra which probably has something to do with it, but I think it fits in here as well). I would rather “play nice”, pretend everything’s fine, than confront a problem and bring it out into the open. These “whites” that I wear can hide a lot. This does have a lot to do with being polite, I think – not wanting to embarrass or hurt others. I used to have big problems correcting anyone if they got something wrong – my name, for example! I would let them carry on calling me the wrong name for as long as was necessary. And that’s just a mild example...
I also experience limitation in my interactions with others. I touched on this in “as a mask” somewhat. Because I’m very private and keep all the interesting parts of my personality under wraps I think I can come across as rather aloof and “stand-offish”. Cricket is not a contact sport, and I am not a tactile person – literally or figuratively. I generally keep people at arm’s length and I don’t make friends easily. Actually, that’s not entirely true – I used to make friends all the time. Perhaps when I was younger, there was more emphasis on the “game” part of “A Game of Cricket”. I would play with the other kids just fine. Now, there seems to be more focus on the formality of cricket where my relationships with others are concerned. It takes me a long time to “open up” even a little, even though on the surface I will be polite and friendly, it is often just a role I play. I don’t mean that I’m nice to people and then bitch about them behind their backs! I mean that I rather brilliantly adapt to the social expectations of whatever company I’m in and act accordingly. Unfortunately, the person talking isn’t the real “me” and I reveal very little about myself.
Another limitation, or rather inhibition, that I think this symbol shows is not just playing by the rules but being bound by them. In school I was always the “goody-two-shoes” or teacher’s pet. I can’t remember the last time I “broke the rules”. I observe the speed limit, I keep off the grass, I settle my credit card bill every month. Quite frankly, I’m really boring…
I think this is at the root of a lot of frustration for me. I’m a Sagittarian – I think big! I have great ideas, yet I rarely make them a reality because that would mean “colouring outside the lines”. I’m constantly seeking out new things, yet I’m too scared to try a lot of things that appeal to me. I tend to read about doing things more than I do them. I’ve never been a rebel or a pioneer. I don’t make noise. I don’t rock the boat. This one aspect is to me quite upsetting. Although I believe that I’m just not a natural daredevil, which is fine – we are who we are – I DO believe that it does us good to do crazy things sometimes. And I can’t name one crazy thing I’ve done. I’m not saying I want to take up bungee jumping or get a tattoo, but I feel I need to act upon this, break the rules in SOME way, just so I don’t die of boredom

I realise all this probably makes me sound frightfully stuck-up, so I would like to point out that this is just my Sun degree (well, and my Mercury) and there’s a lot more to me! Also, my Sun is in the 7th house, which I’m told deals with relationships with others, so I think on the whole, this symbol affects how see others and how I communicate with others? Also, because I’ve been thinking about this, it is all very high profile at the moment, whereas I think normally, the influence of this symbol is quite subtle and is not quite as bad as I’ve made it out to be here!

Well, that’s all I’ve got and I know that it’s plenty and I apologise for that. I didn’t intend to write so much. Part of me doesn’t want to post this now I’ve done it because a lot of it is very personal but on the other hand I do want to be able to discuss the symbols in my birth chart. Comments are very welcome and highly valued. I think what I’ve written here is merely a “rough draft” in terms of my understanding of this symbol in my chart. I know that I’m not very clear on what the Sun represents – or rather, I know the keywords but can’t relate it to myself, so I’m sure there will be more revelations, but I’m glad I’ve got the ball rolling.

Pip
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Elven  Elven is offline
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Pip,
What you've posted is extraordinary and very valuable - obviously to yourself - but also to me, and I think anyone who reads it. You have shared so much of a piece of yourself here, which i realize can be difficult, but you have also illustrated so much about the Symbol and astrology.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipistrelle
So, to me, A Game of Cricket represents:
Fair play
Civilised behaviour
Polite society
Everyone adhering to the same rules
The gentlemen’s game
Leisurely Sunday afternoons
Break for tea
“Whites” = purity
Both teams wearing the same colour
Observing the rules
This is a great summary also. You reminded me of the 'old' cricket and my own family days. I can imagine this quite vividly.

The rest of the post, I hope you dont mind, but I have used certain pieces of it to add to my notes in my Symbol book. You provided so much insight that it has expanded this Symbol for me into a whole new 'ball park' - excuse the pun! Your manner of expression is great - its so clear - you have a great talent for writing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pipistrelle
Well, that’s all I’ve got and I know that it’s plenty and I apologise for that. I didn’t intend to write so much. Part of me doesn’t want to post this now I’ve done it because a lot of it is very personal but on the other hand I do want to be able to discuss the symbols in my birth chart.
Thankyou so much for sharing what you have written. Sometimes IMHO I feel if we dont chart these things somewhere they are lost, and I think one of the greatest things is to be able to come back here and see what what has been written by others (and myself) to get a better picture. It seems to me like they are all different pieces of the same jigsaw puzzle. Its so important. I have written posts I didnt want to send to, but have been so glad I have. Just take a look at the Elsie Wheeler post I did! I nearly died when I had that wrong, but after reading it again, I feel theres something there. We just never know.
I am finding with the Symbols more and more after all these posts, that the Symbol plays out over time, once its pulled, but my thoughts at the time keep me in touch with where I am, and I see this in other peoples posts too. It will be great in a years time to go back over these posts and see what we have all learned during the year. I should know alot more about astrology and reading the Symbols, and I cant do this without everyone elses help. That is the greatest journey for me, and you add to that dimension of my life, as each person who is exploring the Symbols have and will do. I am very grateful for your post!
It has certainly helped me to understand how a Symbol 'fits' into the astrology side of things from your example.

Its funny, when I open the SS book, and come across that 'Old Owl Perched Up In A Tree', I immediately think of your birth chart! as I did when I read your post! Lots of Wisdom!

Many Blessings
Elven x
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Pipistrelle  Pipistrelle is offline
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Elven,

Thank you for your post. When I woke up this morning, I cringed about posting all that stuff, then I read your post and felt much happier about it

I think what I wrote are just my first thoughts and I suspect I'm only just scratching the surface. But as I said, it has been a huge revelation - I really wasn't consciously aware of the effect "A Game of Cricket" has in my life. And everyday I am realising new things - this morning I realised that this symbol is what I have in common with the main character in the novel I'm currently working on, even though before I thought we were not alike at all! I think that will help me understand her better

I'm also seeing small ways in which I do go against social expectations and that's been good. I think in what I wrote yesterday I was focusing a lot on the restrictive qualities of that symbol and I perhaps need to look for the positives in it as well. But I am only at the beginning of this particular journey and I'm sure there will be many more revelations along the way.

As to being an example of using the symbols with astrology - well, I've no idea if I'm doing it "right". I suspect not But I was just thinking about what the symbol meant to me and then all that stuff came up!

I liked what you said about the symbols playing out over time. I am finding that they point to very subtle but powerful currents, things that we might barely notice but things that influence our lives greatly.

Anyway, I have much more thinking to do about A Game of Cricket so we'll see what happens. I am very much looking forward to reading more about others' symbols.

Pip

P.S. I'm curious about your "symbol book"...can you describe what you're doing with that? (even if it's better suited to a different thread)
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