When was Jesus born?

NightWing

Star of Wonder...

Interesting discussion. Glad to see Ace and others clarifying matters. I doubt we will ever get a closer date for Jesus' birth than "sometime between 7 and 4 BC", because the reality is that other than Jesus having had to be born sometime, most of the rest is conjecture, both ancient and modern.

Personally, I like the mythical image created by "We have seen his star in the east..." (Gospel of Matthew, chapter 2, verse 2.) though unfortunately there was no recorded Nova or other prominent visible event in the sky, other than the triple conjunction established by science and mentioned previously here.

It is part of the mystery, I like to think. And some mysterys are not meant to be solved.
 

Skydancer

Similia -
Can you recall the name of that book? I would like to read it!

I have always been fascinated by this topic - and have also seen shows on PBS about the astrology aspect, and so on. Indeed, it seems transcribers added to the stories as they rewrote them to help make them clearer to the readers (all learned men then). I believe it became something like telephone tag over the years.

I love The Story - for what it symbolizes, not for facts. Facts can be manipulated. So, I take the account as it was no doubt intended - as inspiration.

Has anyone read the short story (I think it was called) The Motel? It's about an archeologist digging up a motel room that has been long buried way in the future, and interpreting the "facts" - objects - as he saw them. Way too funny! But it points out how facts/events can be seen in a different light, just as we see facts now in our own light, not in the light of what was. At least archeology is making headway in that direction. So many mistakes have been made.

But I digress.

It's been my understanding that the calendar is off by 6 years because Augustus?? or someone got a date wrong when figuring it. And because it was a while before anyone figured that out, they just left it. That's one reason I thought that all the hoopla over the year 2000 was a bit amusing. :)

*S*
 

paradoxx

During the church's jubilation year, 2000, they celebrated the Sacred heart of the Virgin Mary and Jesus the Christos (the annointed one, the Christ) on June 20th, 29 Gemini. I think this is neat because June 20th is my birthday, and provides me a medium to translate the symbols of christianity right along side the U.S. Great Seal also a 29 Gemini item.
 

psychic sue

I'm not an astrologer, but I remember reading somewhere that Virgo was prominent in the sky when Jesus was born - and this somehow got wrongly translated into the Virgin Birth.
 

paradoxx

That does seem to be a possibility, it could also be close to leo since Jesus was a great and compassionate leader.
 

dadsnook2000

Paradoxx

Where does "Leo" and "compassionate" in the same sentance come from? Dave.
 

rainwolf

In The DaVinci Code, it said jesus was a picses and that makes sense to me...one because ive heard that the signs are slowly shifting signs every so many years (one reason people are skeptic) and two because jesus seemed to posess the picsean traits of psychism and depth. I dont know a lot about astrology, so dont stone me if im wrong >.<

I agree dadsnook-jesus wouldve been a southern baptist if he was a leo LMAO
...PRAISE THE LORD!
 

scorpio

I agree dadsnook-jesus wouldve been a southern baptist if he was a leo LMAO
...PRAISE THE LORD![/QUOTE]

That is the funniest thing i ever read on this forum LMAO TOO!!!
 

Minderwiz

We are tending in this thread to treat the birth as a factual event rather than a mythical event (that doesn't mean that there wasn't a historical 'Jesus' but that the gospel accounts of his life are mythical or allegorical)

A couple of examples out of many - Jesus rose from the dead on the third day. Any Astrologer (or Astronomer) knows that the Moon disappears from view for three days at the New Moon - it dies and is resurrected. Those who saw Jesus after the resurrection had difficulty recognising him. At the time Jesus lived (and indeed for Islam into the present day) identifying the the Moon's crescent after the New Moon was important - it marked the start of the new month or indeed holy festivals. It is not easy to do this by naked eye and many Astrologer/Astronomers would peer into the sky to catch the first glimpse - often failing to recognise it.

The Miracle of the marriage feast at Canaan was Jesus first miracle. Turning water into wine. Again a knowledge of Astrology tells us that the pitchers of Water are a symbol of Aquarius and the wine (or blood) is the symbol of Taurus. This was a very old allegory, even in Jesus day. It shows the triumph of the Sun at the equinox (once in Taurus) over the lord of Winter (Saturn ruler of the, then Winter Solstice sign of Aquarius). It's another allegory of the risen god and is a clear hint of who Jesus was.

There were 12 disciples - now I don't have to tell you the significance of that! There were 13 at the last supper - For civilisations that use a lunar based calendar, every few years a thirteenth month has to be added to correct the calendar and put it back in line with nature.

These myths can be found in different forms in other religions. The cycle of nature shows a cycle of a dying god (Sun or Moon) that is resurrected (New Moon or Vernal Equinox).

Was Jesus a Pisces? In Jesus' time Pisces was identified with Jupiter by the Romans (Zeus by the Greeks). Jupiter/Zeus is King of the Gods (King of Kings?) and Yes, equinoctial shift would soon take the Vernal equinox into Pisces. Whether or not the real Jesus was a Pisces is beside the point - it is the allegory that counts.
 

NightWing

Zodiacal Mystery

Rainwolf; "The DaVinci Code" is a work of fiction after all, so I wouldn't put too much credence there.

But I will toss in my two-bits.

A story I've heard was that in some sense the actual birthdate and time of Jesus' nativity was "hidden" and you could say secret, because being who he was supposed to be, he incarnated all of the positive characteristics of each and every sign. Another way of saying this is that it didn't matter when he was born, since to believers, he was Lord of the Universe and had partaken in the very creation of it all, including the stars and the constellations. If there was meaning to be found there, it had been placed there by the Triune God, of which Jesus was part. So the stars' meaning and direction came in a sense from Jesus the Divine, not the other way around.

You may or may not believe in the divine aspect of Jesus, but the point is that the early believers did, and so his "natal chart" was irrelevant to them. They had no need to record any details as he himself superceded them. And they might even have wished to deliberately obscure any such details, even if known.

The story above is likely no more than pious legend or theological speculation. But so is all the rest of it. Certainly authors of novels like "the DaVinci Code" have no great insights or information about Jesus' birthdate that scholars of the last 2000 years don't have. The Bible has no clear date or even season, and as far as I know, none of the Gnostic scriptures mention a birthdate either. Those are the only real sources, as far as they go. In general, to the ancient Jews, I understand that precise times of birth were unimportant as they didn't celebrate Birthdays and such. The Egyptians and Babylonians were a different matter.

In the end, anyone's guess is about as equally valuable. Which is to say: not very.