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Etteilla Timeline and Etteilla card Variants - background

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeH View Post
Thanks, Kwaw. So before 1860. I would have liked to see more description of the booklet...
Yes, me too!

In summary, in reference to publications by Paris : tous les marchands de nouveautés in relation to Etteilla Type decks we have:

Author: Julia Orsini (Simon Blocquel)
Title: Le Grand Etteilla ou L’Art de Tirer les Cartes,
Publisher : Paris : tous les marchands de nouveautés
Date: 1838
Editor: Blocquel – Castiaux
Printer: Blocquel-Castiaux
Bookseller: Delarue (Simon Blocquel’s Brother – in – Law)
With accompanying deck (Etteilla Type II) by Z Lismon (Blocquel-Castiaux)

Author: Simon Blocquel
Title: 'La Magie Rouge'
Publication : Paris : tous les marchands de nouveautés, (1843)
Includes the introduction from the Julia Orsini (Simon Blocquel) above with note that the accompanying deck (Etteilla Type II) is made by Z Lismon (Blocquel-Castiaux)

Author: Lemarchand, Mlle
Title: Les Récréations de la cartomancie, ou Description pittoresque de chacune des cartes du grand jeu de l'oracle desdames, avec des combinaisons pour expliquer le présent, le passé, l'avenir, par Mlle Lemarchant ["sic"] [Texte imprimé]
Publication : Paris : tous les marchands de nouveautés.
Date: 1856
With accompanying deck (Etteilla Type III) published by Delarue (Simon Blocquel’s Brother-in-Law)

Author: ?
Title: Le Grand Etteilla ou L’Art de Tirer les Cartes
Publication : Paris : chez tous les marchands de nouveautés.
Date: Pre-1860
With accompanying deck (Etteilla Type I) published by (? Similar to those published c. 1880-1890 by H. Pussey and 1890 by Grimaud)
Location: British Museum, with BM library acquisition stamp 1860.
A description of this deck can be found in A Descriptive Catalogue of Playing and Other Cards in the British Museum by Willshire, W. H., which was published in 1876. The deck can also be viewed online at the British Museum's site.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeH View Post
I am very interested in parts 2 and 3 of D'Odoucet, at least in summary. Especially I would like to know if he has a list of synonyms and related meanings for the cards, as Papus seems to suggest in Tarot Divinatoire. Any way of seeing parts 2 and 3?
Kwaw also told me he was interested in the book. The problem is that the pdf is huge (250 Mb).
Papus is right, there's a list of related meanings for each card. Here for instance Jugement :
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeH View Post
Philippe - on the d'Odoucet cards, what are the reversed keywords for cards 16 and 18? They seem to be cut off in the online images.
In fact they are missing in the book (see the pic on my previous post)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philippe View Post
Kwaw also told me he was interested in the book. The problem is that the pdf is huge (250 Mb).
That would be a problem if sending be email through an email service that limits the size of attachments. If you are willing and able to make it available the best solution is probably an online file sharing service? I should think it would be public domain and thus with no copyright issues pertaining to sharing.

Some (free) online file sharing services are listed here:

http://www.hongkiat.com/blog/15-grea...-alternatives/

Or perhaps some of our members can make recommendations re: ones they might use (re: ease of use and being free).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeH View Post
I have seen pictures of a third deck, exactly the same except for rather marked differences in coloration, a very different back, and no tax stamp on any card (indicating that it was done before April of 1890). This deck is in the possession of LeTarot Associazione Culturale in Italy. Some examples from that deck are below. First, for the back and 2 of Swords:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-6tjb6Q8QKp...eilla+010a.jpg
I wonder what the A.A stands for on the two of swords (reversed in upright postion, so like a W? and upright in reverse positions) ?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cerulean View Post
I just received this from Madrid:

LES RECREATIONS DE LA CARTOMANCIE ou description pittoresque de chacune des Cartes du Grand Jeu de l'Oracle des Dames.
(Esoterismo) LEMARCHANT, Mlle.

(Chez Tous Les Marchands de Nouveutes-Paris imprime chez Bonaventure et Ducessois, 55, quai des Austins)
Another two Etteilla inspired decks, published by Marchands de Nouveutes (Merchants of Novelties) were printed by Ducessois:

Le Nouvel Etteilla, ou Moyen infaillible de tirer les cartes et de lire dans l’avenir par l’interpretation des songes. Imprim. de Ducessoir, a Paris. – A Paris, chez les marchands de nouveautes.

Le Petit Oracle des Dames,* ou Recreation du curieux. Impr. de Ducessois, a Paris. – A Paris, chez les marchands de nouveautes.

Both are listed in ‘Bibliographie / de la France, or Journal General / De l’Imprimerie et de la Librairie, No 24, Saturday 12 Jun, 1841 – so both 1841 or earlier.

Kwaw

* La Veuve Gueffier, who published the deck Le Petit Oracle des dames ou Récréation des curieux c.1807, also published other (non-Etteilla related) projects with Ducessoir & Marchands de Nouveautes.

Ducessoir also published the 82 page Le petit oracle des dames , ou Récréation du curieux... / (par Alliette) - which BnF dates c.1770 - 1820, but I suspect it came out before Gueffier's deck (c.1807).

edited to add: Gueffier's booklet, with 42 coloured cards for Le Petite Oracle Des Dames, is listed in the 1806 Journal General de la Litterature de France.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philippe View Post
In fact they are missing in the book (see the pic on my previous post)
Thanks anyway. I suspect that he thought there was no need, because the keywords are the same upright and reversed. At least they are in Etteilla's own work. So what you posted weren't the actual cards, scanned separately, but just the pictures in the book? If so, that might explain why the reversed keyword is presented right side up--for easier viewing, as they are not meant to be cut out of the booklet (there is even writing on the other side visible in a few of the images). The cards themselves then might have had the reversed keywords upside down.

So the "c. 1807" is really "c. 1806", Kwaw?

And I've been curious: when we see "chez tous les marchands et de nouveautés", are we to think that everything after "chez" is the name of a a publisher, or is it merely telling people where they can buy the book: at all the merchants of novelties?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeH

So the "c. 1807" is really "c. 1806", Kwaw?
The booklet with the deck at the BnF is dated 1807.

But it is also listed in that Journal dated 1806 (but I have been confused by French post-revolution repubican dating before, all I can say for sure is that it has 1806 on the front).

Quote:
And I've been curious: when we see "chez tous les marchands et de nouveautés", are we to think that everything after "chez" is the name of a a publisher, or is it merely telling people where they can buy the book: at all the merchants of novelties?
Good question, and one I've been curious about myself and been trying to find an answer too.

"Marchand de nouveautés" and variants ("Libraires et marchands de nouveautés. Paris", "Tous les marchands de nouveautés. Paris") appear on some publications from 1763 - 1891, often on its own and listed in references as Publisher/Editor.* The distinction between printers/publishers/booksellers, production, retail & wholesale was not the same then. Often publisher/printer was one and the same, and even had their own bookshop(s). Booksellers would publish their own books or join with other booksellers/printers on joint publications.

So yes I considered "Marchand de nouveautés" and variants could have been some ‘Association of Booksellers and Merchants of Novelties’ with a line in publishing; but I began to doubt that when I coudn’t identify any such definite association, with identifiable body or official registration of members, or address. But then there are those references to books which list "Marchand de nouveautés" as printer, editor and/or publisher in references.

However, when pre-fixed by 'chez' I think it is pretty clear and leaves little room for doubt that it most likely just means 'available from all booksellers / merchants of novelties, [in Paris]'.

Kwaw

* For example, a copy of Le Petit Etteilla by Flamand has marchands de nouveautés recorded as editor/publisher by BnF ( Éditeur : les marchands de nouveautés (Paris) )
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kwaw View Post
The booklet with the deck at the BnF is dated 1807.

But it is also listed in that Journal dated 1806 (but I have been confused by French post-revolution repubican dating before, all I can say for sure is that it has 1806 on the front).
The 1806 is dated according to the normal Gregorian calendar, so yes it appears n the 1806 edition. However, while getting a link for you to check, I found Gueffier's Le Petit Oracle appears in earlier editions too.

For example, in the edition dated An X (year 10), which I think is c. September 1801 to September 1802?

But I get confused about French Republican Calendar dating -- so please check it out.

The entry is here, p.252 of the Journal général de la littérature de France: ou, Répertoire méthodique, Volume 5:


https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...0Dames&f=false

quote:

"Le petit oracle des Dames, ou Récréations des curieux, contenant 72 figures coloriées, formant le jeu complet de 52 cartes, avec la manière de tirer les cartes, tant avec ce jeu qu’ avec les cartes ordinaires. Gueffier."

The date of the Journal is given several pages up, p.225:

THERMIDOR An X de la Republique Francaise.

(I haven't checked earlier editions as yet)

If I have the above correct, then we have Le petit oracle des dames, by Gueffier, c.1802 or earlier.

I need to go to bed now -- iyi geceler.

edited to add:

iyi gunlar

There is also another 1802 listing in:

JOURNAL TYPOGRAPHIQUE BIBLIOGRAPHIQUE AVIS
Le Bureau du Journal Bibliographique
Du 24 Messidor an 10

p.334

Le Petit Oracle des dames, ou Récréation des curieux. Prix 3 fr. Paris, Gueffier, libraire, boulevard Cérutti.
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According to a listing of Etteilla publications in:

La France littéraire ou dictionnaire bibliographique des savants, historiens et gens de lettres de la France, ainsi que des littérateurs étrangers qui ont écrit en français, plus particulièrement pendant les XVIIIe et XIXe siècles: A - B, Volume 1, By Joseph M. Quérard, 1827

Gueffier probably deserves a larger mention in the Timeline than currently noted:

quote
__* Etteilla, ou manière de se récréer avec un jeu de cartes. Paris, Lesclapart, 1770 in- 12. -- Nouvelle édit. (sons le titre du Petit Ëtieilla) contenant 33 cartes dans un étui avec la manière de s’en servir, et le livre des rêves). Paris, (Gueffier jeune) in-18, 3 fr.

Jeu (grand) de 78 cartes eu figures hiéroglvphiques. Paris, (Guffier jeune), 36 fr.
Ou peutse procurer le jeu de caries séparément, 9 fr.

Zodiaque (le) mystérieux, oo les Oracles d’Etteilla. Paris, Gueffier jeune. ( Pey tieux), 1772 in-8, 4 fr.

I am not sure of the dates for the above, but if memory serves me right mention is made of a Gueffier jeune publishing reprints of some of Etteilla works c. 1820 in Wicked Pack of Cards?

(A copy of the Le mysterieux Zodiac at abebooks has: Amsterdam et Paris, Gueffier jeune, 1820. In-8°. 191 p. Cartonnage vers 1920. Caillet 217. - Réédition de la pemière édition de 1772.)

There is a copy of a Petit Etteilla by Mme Gueffier in the BM, dated 1806. So a Gueffier seems to have published at least three types of Etteilla -

c.1802 or earlier,Le Petit Oracles des Dames, originally by Gueffier, with later editions by the widow Gueffier, the rights of which are later (c. February 1823) sold on to M. Peytieux, libraire, passage du Caire, n.121, à Paris, by Mr. Gueffier the younger (presumably their son).

c.1806 or earlier, a Petit Etteilla, by the Widow Gueffier with later editions by Gueffier Jeune.

1817, February, Gueffier jeune acquires the the remaining few examples of the Book of Thoth, published by Etteilla, consisting of several volumes and a deck of 78 cards with symbolic figures:

Livre du Thot, a 4 in 1 volume.
Du Dictionnaire synonymique du livre de Thot (In a 1827 listing Petieux has the rights to this).
Du Cours pratique da livre de Thot
Grand Jeu, consisting of 78 cards, with hieroglyphic figures.
price 36-0 (Or the game of cards sold separately, price 9-0)

To be found from the same address :

le Petit Oracle des Dames composed of 42 cards, enclosed in a case with instructions. price 3-0
Le Petit Eteilla, composed of 33 cards, enclosed in a case with instructions, and a book of dreams for the lottery. 3-0
L ‘Introduction à la fortune, ou l’Art de corriger ses défauts à la loterie; avec les Reves, etc. 4-0

The acquisition is published under a notice of a transfer of funds (Mutations de Fonds), which implies the acquisition of the commercial rights (including for example publishing rights).

1823 M. Peytieux, libraire, passage du Caire, n.121, à Paris, purchases the rights and remaining stock of Le Petit Oracle des Dames & Le Veritable Etteilla from Mr. Gueffier the younger.

1827, Gueffier jeune is still listed as selling the Grand Etteilla, consisting of several volumes and deck for 36fr, or 9fr for the cards alone. Can't find any reference to him in relation to the Grand Jeu after that. It is not clear if he published reprints of the Grand Etteilla, as he did with other Etteilla books and decks, or just sold off the remaining stock he acquired in 1817.
__________________________________________________ ____________________________________

February, 1817 :Gueffier jeune acquires the rights to several Etteilla books/games:

MUTATIONS DE FONDS
M. Gueffier jeune, rue du Marché-Neuf , N. 48, vient d’acquérir le peu d’exemplaires qui restaient du livre de Thot, autrement dit Tarots, publié par le géomètre Eteilla.
Ce livre se compose 1 de 4 vol. in-12
2 Du Dictionnaire synonymique du livre de Thot, brochure in-80
3 Du Cours pratique da livre de Thot, brochure in-8o
Et d’un Grand Jeu, composé de 78 cartes, en figures hiéroglyphiques. Prix 36
L ‘on vend séparément le Jeu de cartes 9
On trouve à la même adresse le Petit Oracle des Dames composé, de 42 cartes, renfermées dans un étui, avec l’explication Prix 3 o
Le Petit Eteilla, contenant 33 cartes dans un étui, avec la manière de s’en servir, et le Livre de reves pour la loterie, Prix 3 o
L ‘Introduction à la fortune, ou l’Art de corriger ses défauts à la loterie; avec les Reves, etc. In-4 Prix 4-o

Transfer of Funds reported in the BIBLIOGRAPHI DE LA FRANCE OU JOURNAL GÉNÉRAL DE LIMPRIMERIE ET DE LA LIBRAIRIE, February 1817.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________

The rights to two of Gueffier jeune publications, Le Petit Oracle des Dames & Le Veritable Etteilla, were bought by publisher/bookseller M. Peytieux in 1823:

quote:
MUTATIONS DE FONDS
M. Peytieux, libraire, passage du Caire, n.121, à Paris, vient d’acquérir de M. Gueffier jeune le fonds et la propriété des deux ouvrages suivans:

Le Petit Oracle des dames, ou Récréation du curieux, contenant 27 figures symboliques coloriées, formant le jeu complet de 52 cartes, avec une Instruction pour tirer les cartes, tant avec ce jeu que celui de 32 cartes, le tout renfermé dans un étui. Prix 2 fr. 5o c.

Le Véritable Etteilla, ou Manière de tirer les cartes avec une instruction pour s’en servir, auquel on a joint le livre de rêves pour la loterie. Édition entièrement refondue et considérablement augmentée, le tout renfermé dans un étui. Prix 2 fr. 5o c.
end quote

Revue bibliographique du Royaume des Pays-bas et de l'étranger, ou indicateur général de l'imprimerie et de la librairie, Volume 2, by P.J. de Mat, 1823, February edition, p.64.

Transfer of Funds

Mr. Peythieux, bookstore, Passage du Caire, n.121, in Paris, has acquired from Mr. Gueffier young the funds and property of the two following books:

The Little Oracle for ladies, for Recreation or the curious, containing 27 coloured symbolic figures, forming the complete set of 52 cards, with instructions to draw the cards, as with this game not that of 32 cards, all enclosed in a case. Price 2 fr. 5o c.

The Real Etteilla or Way to draw cards with an instruction for use, to which book is attached dreams for the lottery. Edition completely revised and greatly increased, the whole within a case. Price 2 fr. 5o c.
__________________________________________________ _______________________________________
Top   #320

 





 


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