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Legends: #8 Strength Percivale's Vision

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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowy25
I've notesed you do dreams on them.
I prefer jumping in when I'm awake.
I think I would crush the cards at night with my sleeping habbits
Did you have a dream with this one you would like to share?
Hi Snowy - it looks like you've got the quoting technique working fine! I didn't have a dream about this card - I only seem to get dreams that I remember if the dream world actually has something important to say about a card. I did do what I feel became a beautiful meditation on the Connolly Strength card. If I ever post that to the Connolly Study Group I will send you a PM.
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Bit of a history lecture folks.. Sorry!


LOL - To be different from WalesWoman and David, I love this card!
Well, I love it because of its strange complexity and even the silliest of Old Percy's dreams and things. Its just one of those cards that makes me chuckle (crazy wack eyed druid-ness and alcohol is to blame me thinks!).
St George, to my knowledge, isn't well thought of as a druid hunter, but St Patrick of Ireland is! Legend says that he drove all the snakes from Ireland, snakes being another term used for Druids during the medieval period. Snakes and serpents and dragons all being of the devil I guess.

Also, another thought that has often chuckled me is that if a lion saw the lion in this card, he would think he's rather camp. He just lacks that something that even the 'mastered' lions of other decks has.
The two women, the crone of Paganism and the maiden of Christianity hold hand and in hand, which brings to my mind how early Christianity took more than a helping hand from Paganism during the time of conversion in the UK. Churches on pagan sites, with pagan iconography hidden within the walls of the church (by the pagan craftsman its believed), how people saw the relation of the dying god of the harvest and the dying jesus of Christianity - Christianity by its self couldn't have converted the pagans, so it used little and sometimes devious tricks, but very clever all the same.
The Strength though I think of this time (thinking with the 9 of Spears also) is the Strength of the time to have this strange period were there wasn't an 'offical' religion and that many of the peasents were still pagan and had their customs, customs and traditions that even the aristocracy kept to even though they were ranted on about how chivalric and honourable they were.
The two women also highlights how in this period of time you had two views of women - women were the bane of men for Eve ate the fruit from Eden and drove them from paradise, or (and a more minority view) is the cult of the virgin mary (David, perhaps a spark of balance even in this heavily masculine world?) where women were seen as figures of Mary if they kept themselves pure and chaste and spent all day darning men's socks With these thoughts at the time, its a wonder that women didn't revolt, but women had strength during this time as well. As men went off to crusade and defend against the invading scots, irish, vikings (take your pick!) women very much ruled the estates. Also women had the upper hand if she was a widow, and young men would fall all over eachother to win the heart of a rich and highly respectable widow.
Just with all that background history alone I think that makes the Strength card so great. I love how the tail of the serpent curves out of the picture and then appears again at the bottom. The legend of the card I really don't like, it doesnt gel with me, but I dont like Percy and I'm glad he doesn't appear in the Court cards.

Well, sorry for a history post folks, but I think the history is more important than the silly story lol.
Sezo
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Yes, I think that's a good suggestion to ignore the story, which I found it very annoying (obviously), and as you say just concentrate on the picture and the history behind its symbolism. The picture is looking less like my so-called "nightmare pizza" as I get used to it (hopefully Anna-Marie didn't read that unfortunate comment - there's so much of the imagery that I really do like in the deck, I guess you can't hope to satisfy everyone with the whole thing).

As far as female equality, there was a lot more of it in the so-called dark ages than in the medieval times. This is where the Arthurian stories can get a bit confusing - as they were retold and rewritten over the course of the centuries it can be difficult to pin down specific themes since so often the meaning morphed with the times.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sophie-David
Yes, I think that's a good suggestion to ignore the story, which I found it very annoying (obviously), and as you say just concentrate on the picture and the history behind its symbolism.
This is a fascinating discussion, and it points up some of the reservations I have about interpreting this deck.

I love the Strength card too (another Leo...I can't help it!). My first reaction to the image was, wow, this takes Strength to the next level, beyond the eyecandy of the woman and lion, to the deeper strength of the crone and serpent (less photogenic but a lot more powerful and wise). I actually liked the fact that the two women were holding hands - the link between the generations and the passing on of female wisdom is how I saw it.

However...then I went to the book and read the background legend.
Oh dear.

Often the background information on the legends is useful and helps me to deepen my understanding of the cards, but sometimes...it doesn't. And sometimes it gets in the way, because my reaction to the card's imagery is at odds with the written interpretation, and then I have to try and fit the two together and....then I end up with a headache! I can truly understand the struggle and the anger that Waleswoman so eloquently describes in her earlier posts

In the end, I have to trust my own reactions and "just concentrate on the picture" as David says. In the end, that's what *Strength* means to me; if it comes to a conflict between what my heart is telling me, and what the book says, I'm going to choose ME!
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lol - a pizza card!
I think this is one of the cards that I would really like as a print. This card enlarged would look great! I love the smallness of the deck, but at the same time I would like a larger copy or some larger prints to really give the artwork justice - Anne-Marie has talent oozing out of her ears in my opinion
When there is conflict between the book and my interpretation, I go with my own interpretation - I'm the reader, so you have to show the cards who's boss

Blessings
Sezo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inanna_tarot
lol - a pizza card!
I think this is one of the cards that I would really like as a print. This card enlarged would look great! I love the smallness of the deck, but at the same time I would like a larger copy or some larger prints to really give the artwork justice - Anne-Marie has talent oozing out of her ears in my opinion
Yes, I suspect if the card were larger the detail would show and it would be more attractive and effective. Yes Anna-Marie has a great deal of talent, this deck was inspired!
Quote:
Originally Posted by inanna_tarot
When there is conflict between the book and my interpretation, I go with my own interpretation - I'm the reader, so you have to show the cards who's boss
Absolutely, you bought the deck, its yours and you have the final say!
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Legend Arthurian Tarot: Strength


I really appreciate this series of close looks at one of my favorite cards in one of my favorite decks. Sorry to jump in abruptly-- this deck is a recent find for me, along with a few other celtic tarots. Just to add that the wise crone riding the snake is above the courageous maiden riding the lion, while both, as before noted, grasp hands. So strength is a joining of powers that tame and not a conquering of lower nature. Wisdom from experience joins the courage to face life of youth. Meanwhile, wisdom tames uncontroled instincts and courage tames uncontroled forcefulness. And all these elements blend, from the face of the snake to the foot of the lion, with myriad colors. It's a kind of alchemical mixing, rather than a triumph of good over evil. If pagan and christian symbols are in it, they combine rather than oppose. This reminds me of a grail legend (Parzival) in which a hermit tells the hero Parzival that he needs the wisdom of age to mix with the the folly of youth, in other words, that his strength is in balancing the opposites in him, not in dividing into a lower and a higher self. Back to the card: three gray trees in the background with golden leaves out their branches seem to hint at alchemical transformation, lead to gold.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank Hall
I really appreciate this series of close looks at one of my favorite cards in one of my favorite decks. Sorry to jump in abruptly-- this deck is a recent find for me, along with a few other celtic tarots. Just to add that the wise crone riding the snake is above the courageous maiden riding the lion, while both, as before noted, grasp hands. So strength is a joining of powers that tame and not a conquering of lower nature. Wisdom from experience joins the courage to face life of youth. Meanwhile, wisdom tames uncontroled instincts and courage tames uncontroled forcefulness. And all these elements blend, from the face of the snake to the foot of the lion, with myriad colors. It's a kind of alchemical mixing, rather than a triumph of good over evil. If pagan and christian symbols are in it, they combine rather than oppose. This reminds me of a grail legend (Parzival) in which a hermit tells the hero Parzival that he needs the wisdom of age to mix with the the folly of youth, in other words, that his strength is in balancing the opposites in him, not in dividing into a lower and a higher self. Back to the card: three gray trees in the background with golden leaves out their branches seem to hint at alchemical transformation, lead to gold.
Very nicely put Frank, with several additional insights along the way!
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