Waite's Christianization of Tarot

Richard

Every once in a while I see a reference to Waite's Christianization of Tarot, so I decided to do a comparison of the RWS with a typical TdM (the Grimaud). I chose Trumps which seem to have some sort of Biblical elements in them. Personally, I don't see the RWS as particularly more Christian than the TdM. The only cards which specifically refer to Christianity (rather than Abrahamic religions generally) are Popess/Priestess, Pope/Hierophant, and possibly Judgement, and Waite partially deChristianized the Popess and Pope by changing their titles.

I didn't include the minors, but the RWS Ace of Cups is blatantly Christian, while the corresponding TdM is probably a ciborium (receptacle for the hosts from the mass). The Queen of Cups in the two decks is apparently holding a ciborium. The RWS Queen's vessel has Kerubs on it, reminiscent of those on the mercy seat in the Holy of Holies. There is some profound symbolism here, but that goes astray from my topic.

Here are some rough observations on the attachment.


The World. Not much difference here. Waite removed the halo on the guy in the upper left corner.

The Devil. People are probably more familiar with the Waite Devil (Baphomet), but there's nothing Biblical about it. The TdM Devil has antlers, which reminds me of Kernunos in Celtic mythology.

Judgement. A Biblical image. Could be from Daniel or Revelation. Neither card seems more Christian than the other.

High Priestess. Waite changed the name from Popess to a title which is religiously more ambiguous and apparently changed the image to Isis. J and B refer to the Biblical Jachin and Boaz, and are important in Freemasonry.

Wheel of Fortune. Waite added kerubs (the four living creatures of Ezekiel), which stand for the four fixed astrological signs (and probably the four seasons of the year).

The Lovers. Changed title from The Lover. Waite uses an image from Judaic mythology. An angel is substituted for Cupid but serves a different function.

The Heirophant. Title changed from The Pope. Heirophant is not particularly associated with Christianity, but the image remains essentially The Pope.
 

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ravenest

I think it has do with issues around the GD being a system that uses some perceived 'Christian related' concepts ; stories about Waite's upbringing and natal religion; and ideas that he changed the GD to a more Christian system (as opposed to his own ideas that, by then, had gone a fair amount further than 'mainstream Christianity' ... other than what he showed on his cards - as many dont 'get' what he showed on his cards and come up with general allusions to Christianity ... his Freemasonry ... although ' in amity' with the established authority ... is not the 'usual' type ; as his 'Christianity' was not of a 'usual' type).

IMO a better example of a Christian mystical system (although a bit 'far out' and not utilising tarot ) is that developed by Rudolf Steiner (which had some similarities in background).
 

Richard

P. F. Case is a lot like Waite (whom he admired). He uses a Christian vocabulary. I've seen Case's book The True and Invisible Rosicrucian Order labelled as Christian Hermeticism, whatever that means. (The book is about the legends of Christian Rosenkreutz and the classic GD/Rosicrucian degrees.) Case is a Christian like I am a Zoroastrian.

I've read some Steiner, but I get all sleepy.
 

Rosanne

Do you not think that Waite considered his beliefs as an alternative to Christianity(because the Catholic/Anglican traditions never had or had forgotten the esoteric mystery ), and that therefore he might be called an esoteric rather than a mystic?
Somehow the RWS cards look less Christian than the TdM. They look Victorian pseudo something lol- like dress ups. Something like a Victorian play about something Eastern. (when one is not sure what Eastern is lol.) Reminds me of Gilbert and Sullivans operetta the Mikado.
On the other hand Waite did cultivate Christians with occult aspirations like Evelyn Underhill, who believed The Catholic Church held the secret of 'the universal Truth'.
~Rosanne
 

Richard

Do you not think that Waite considered his beliefs as an alternative to Christianity(because the Catholic/Anglican traditions never had or had forgotten the esoteric mystery ), and that therefore he might be called an esoteric rather than a mystic?
Somehow the RWS cards look less Christian than the TdM. They look Victorian pseudo something lol- like dress ups. Something like a Victorian play about something Eastern. (when one is not sure what Eastern is lol.) Reminds me of Gilbert and Sullivans operetta the Mikado.
On the other hand Waite did cultivate Christians with occult aspirations like Evelyn Underhill, who believed The Catholic Church held the secret of 'the universal Truth'.
~Rosanne
I think he is both an esotericist and a mystic. He is in search of a direct, ecstatic experience of the divine, which he sees primarily as an inward quest. It has been a long time (45 years?) since I read Underhill's description of the classic mystical experience in her Mysticism book, but I think Waite has the same end in view. Actually, the Latin Church is not particularly overjoyed when a mystic pops into view, because the Church regards itself as the proper avenue to God, the direct experience of God by the individual being a potentially heretical aberration. The mystic presents a challenge to the Church's assumed role as intermediary between the individual and God.

An English production of The Mikado is a good analogy. Pamela Colman Smith was a designer of stage sets and such for theater productions. Her so-called stage cards, such as the 10 of cups and the 5 of Swords, even look as if they are being enacted on a stage with a scenic backdrop.
 

Zephyros

Actually, the Latin Church is not particularly overjoyed when a mystic pops into view, because the Church regards itself as the proper avenue to God, the direct experience of God by the individual being a potentially heretical aberration. The mystic presents a challenge to the Church's assumed role as intermediary between the individual and God.

For that reason, and also because it admits there are crackpots galore. The tests for the canonization of saints and others who have reported mystical experiences are grueling, and may take centuries. This is to ensure that not everyone who has a vision is made a saint.
 

Rosanne

Actually, the Latin Church is not particularly overjoyed when a mystic pops into view, because the Church regards itself as the proper avenue to God, the direct experience of God by the individual being a potentially heretical aberration. The mystic presents a challenge to the Church's assumed role as intermediary between the individual and God.

Oh I am not so sure you are right about this. The Catholic Church has a long history of mystics and esoterics. Nuns were particularly prone to ecstatic visions and communions with Jesus/God/Holy Spirit.
They have a problem with what they view as pretend priests/ rebel priests and psuedo churches. If he had become a priest, and then left- he could still have said Mass, given communion etc. I am not sure where you live, or if you have an organisation called the brotherhood/order of Saint John? Big in the antipodes because of historic abuse cases. Still the church protected them- until those who were deviant set up their own Church.
I am probally not the right former Catholic to discuss this with, as my family are all head doctors of one sort or another and view a lot of mysticism and occult behaviour with scepticism. For example anorexics can be very mystical (Saint Catherine of Sienna for example) Severe Bi- Polar A can be very occult and believable in their writings etc.

Not that I am saying Waite was unwell.
~Rosanne
 

Richard

The Church opposes the view that the Beatific Vision can be attained in this life and insists that a mystic may have an enhanced awareness of the presence of God, but that a direct encounter with God is impossible, the mystical experience being no more than a preparation for that which occurs after death.

I have the feeling that the mysticism of St. John of the Cross was an impediment to his canonization, which was delayed until almost 200 years after his death. However, such things may be impossible to know with absolute certainty without access to the Vatican Library.

ETA. Technically this is off topic for the RWS forum, but it is intended as backdrop for Waite's position on the issue.
 

Richard

For that reason, and also because it admits there are crackpots galore. The tests for the canonization of saints and others who have reported mystical experiences are grueling, and may take centuries. This is to ensure that not everyone who has a vision is made a saint.
That is true. I suspect that mystics are especially subject to extensive review and evaluation before canonization, probably more so than other candidates.

My god, a mystical grilled cheese sandwich! :rolleyes:
 

BrightEye

In The Pictorial Key to the Tarot Waite makes it quite clear that his work is occult. He also says that 'occultism is not like mystic faculty'.