The Gra Tree of Life

GnosticTarotCards

Of course , im not going to start an argument. I've studied this system for a decade as well, not two. However I must agree with your point. As previously mentioned i've had my "battle" in the room to try and teach Kabbalah. As i've also read regardie's work, acquainted with Stephan Holler, studied with BOTA and PF Case writings and studied his "channeled" explanations of Hebrew letter placements that was derived from a "mystical" source, I've really thought about the pros and cons of the system of "Trees". Trust me no one wants to be more accurate than I upon the use of the Kabbalah (that's how i spell it from its literal meaning "to receive").

The reason I was so excited to proclaim to the world is because I've had the great fortune to be introduced to "schools" of people who have studied and worked with a "received" tradition, meaning I'm part of the "writers" group. In hopes of transmitting some of the teachings of these organizations, I was under the misimpression that everyone wanted to understand and do the practices that I hold as sacred and authentic. However, i was approached with the firm hand of investigation and my claims were based upon practice and instructions rather than verifiable historical records. That means that as far as this particular section of the Forum is concerned I've had my run in with the group for putting forth my "teachings".

The Sefer Yetzeriah as far as I'm concerned is a Meditative Symbol, and it was precisely this purpose that had shaped the earliest commentators perspective. Most if not all were not able to get a clear version of this Symbol due to the intentional "blinds" of the Jewish Kabbalists. That which was revealed was not according to the actual "secrets" but the general information that is applicable to the the bible but only as Mitzvot or Commandments and Laws. However, this should be known that the "purpose" of the TOL is for Merkabah and particular Maaseh Merkabah practice. The Ari understood the practices and wrote commentaries that are not available in English called "gates". It is the context of the "schools" that used this symbol as a Meditative guide.

As far as Daat, well that is a Philosophical container for the whole issue of "fallen" and "perfected" the Daat is very much in relation to the "serpent" naas. I've currently undertaken a study of Naaseene and Ophite , or so called , traditions by reputable scholarly works, and am getting a perspective of the whole situation from a comparison of both Academic and Occult versions. That is the most, and particularly best way of approaching the subject.

My forewarning was because I know from painful experience that "throwing" one's realizations around here can invite fierce resentment, misunderstanding and severe criticism. My full intent was to be kind and hopefully save someone from this embarrassment and humiliation.

GTC
 

Richard

GTC, no one is going to fault you for your convictions or your trying to explain them to the forum. As I think I've mentioned before, the problem is one of communication, the particular literary style which you have adopted for your posts. It is only natural that you feel a great deal of certainty about your ideas. That is a good thing. However, you sort of come across in the forum as a guru who is instructing his faithful disciples in truths which must not be questioned. I don't think you mean to project that image, and it may be due to an effort to be overly succinct in your statements in order not to use up excessive space in the forum. Suppose you had somehow made it clear that these are your ideas, and you hope that others will consider them seriously and find them enlightening, but that each person ultimately must find their own path. If you had been able to do this, then what you consider to have been militant opposition would not have arisen. No one is interested in persecuting you for your firm conviction of your beliefs or your generous attempt to communicate them to the forum. It's the illusion of you as a self appointed guru that arouses distrust and kneejerk opposition. I really don't think you mean to project that image. It's very likely a communication issue.
 

kwaw

The reason I was so excited to proclaim to the world is because I've had the great fortune to be introduced to "schools" of people who have studied and worked with a "received" tradition...

I'm an Old Man - I was around in the late sixties and seventies as a member of wicca groups when the 'received' tradition started to be questioned - I understand the pain and betrayal.

It appears to me that what you are teaching is not anything from a received tradition, but something I have observed developing as a member of several estoteric forums/goups/mail-lists since the 90's as part of Christine's developing speculative revisionism marked IMHO by poor scholarship, misrepresentation and misunderstanding of sources - which when questioned upon appeared to lead her to leave those forums where such might be questioned (being on the internet since the 90's , the evidence is still there if you look for it).

What you appear to be teaching is what Christine taught you which you seem to have accepted hook, line and sinker as being a part of a 'received tradition'. It appears to me that what Christine may teach [publicly], is from the evidence of her contributions to various forums over the years, more to do with her own evolving speculations (limited by biased pre-conceptons) than received traditions.

I may of course be wrong - most probably I am - I can only talk of how it appears to me - perhaps the fault is with me being a cynical skeptic.

If I have got the wrong end of the stick and what you have learnt from 'recieved traditions' has nothing to do with my opionion of Christine's speculations, but rather those of your fellow readers of the Nag Hammadi book club (a literary tradition is I suppose, received!?), my apologies for my presumption. What I can say with a fair degree of confidence is that you have portrayed as being a part of some historical 'authentic' received tradition is at odds with the historical evidence. However, what I can also admit is that in terms of practical exercise and experience that is irrelevant to its potential experiential value. As Crowley states in Liber O:

"2. In this book it is spoken of the Sephiroth and the Paths; of Spirits and Conjurations; of Gods, Spheres, Planes, and many other things which may or may not exist.

It is immaterial whether these exist or not. By doing certain things certain results will follow; students are most earnestly warned against attributing objective reality or philosophic validity to any of them."


Kwaw

ps: re- the 3d model, the original SY Sefiroth model was 3d, the problems come later with trying to apply it to 2d ToL models. The Gra redaction of the SY is the most furthest from the original [pre-Zoharic] SY not only in terms of time but of concept. However, a 3d model of the ToL may well be the best way to reconcile it with the 3d model of the SY (whether based upon the natural array or otherwise).
 

Richard

It's a bit annoying that people still find it necessary to bolster their creative output with the claim that it actually is part of an ancient secret tradition, to which very few special individuals are privy. It has been said that Eliphas Levi was deemed worthy to be admitted to the high degrees of "Continental Freemasonry" but Mathers, Waite, and Crowley were not, and they expressed their jealousy by stealing and corrupting Levi's system, which they morphed into a competing system with equally august (but false) claims to authenticity. This is an astonishing array of half truths. It is discouraging that people still feel the need to demonize the opposition in an attempt to thereby reinforce their claim of being in possession of the absolute truth. It is really an insult to the intelligence of anyone who has an interest in occult matters. While I see an element of humor in all this, it is still a definite turn off.
 

GnosticTarotCards

Its not about elitist groups withholding, the the theurgical work of the OGD is based on Agrippa. The continental or European, specifically the French systems are also theurgical in line with Pasqually and Swedenborg. There is a small theurgical practice and similitude in both streams. However when using tarot , the post zoharic and Kircher model is not the same strand of the Europeans. Mathers and Wescott were acquainted with Kirchers tree and the Zohar, not the same kabbalah as pasqually and Swedenborg, that passed from French lodges to Levi
 

Richard

Its not about elitist groups withholding, the the theurgical work of the OGD is based on Agrippa. The continental or European, specifically the French systems are also theurgical in line with Pasqually and Swedenborg. There is a small theurgical practice and similitude in both streams. However when using tarot , the post zoharic and Kircher model is not the same strand of the Europeans. Mathers and Wescott were acquainted with Kirchers tree and the Zohar, not the same kabbalah as pasqually and Swedenborg, that passed from French lodges to Levi
I believe the essence of my post is in one of CPT's ArkLetters, most of which I have read at one time or another. I can try to find it, but that's a lot of material to wade through.
 

GnosticTarotCards

Unfortunately the story is much more complex. Christine Payne Towler is an excellent teacher. Her work covers lots of facets. Centering on astrology the Astro Alpha Numeric system that lies at the core backbone of tarot is the sum and total of her message. The only difference is the placements. When the order of the golden dawn first recommended the tarot , initiates were introduced to it within the strict placements of GD Ritual. Riddle me this.. Why if the roots of that system was grounded in actual verifiable AAN did it seem so pivotal to incorporate it as a Deuiknumena of the rituals even though it supposedly existed 200 years before with Kircher? The answer? The translators were perpetuating the zoharic system in kabbalah unveiled and secrets of kabbalah that Mathers and Waite claimed to originate from secret Rosicrucian adepts. Guess who was head of the real Rose Croix? Not rose cross that is a mutation from its original form, not as a baconian scientific society, but as a initiatic organization for adepts practicing theurgy. It was European not English.
 

Richard

Nice attempt to obfuscate the issue with all the CPT buzzwords and revisionisms. So what? If someone is in possession of Ultimate Truth, it will stand on it's own, and flogging a dead horse will do nothing to enhance it's legitimacy. The founders of HOGD apparently did fabricate the usual bullshit about receiving authority to organize their order as an official repository of occult knowledge. Nothing new about that (*yawn*). By the way, Waite was neither a founder of HOGD nor particularly interested in ritual magic. He had his own agenda.

I suppose it would be advisable to steer the discussion away from personalities and back to the OP.
 

Zephyros

I suppose it would be advisable to steer the discussion away from personalities and back to the OP.

I agree, as well as this is doing a disservice to Laurel, who has unfortunately become embroiled in old matters. Laurel, I am curious about your new system though. Is there anything more you can tell us? Can you give us a schema of your Tree, complete with letters and astrological attributions? Can it work with Tarot?
 

Richard

I agree, as well as this is doing a disservice to Laurel, who has unfortunately become embroiled in old matters. Laurel, I am curious about your new system though. Is there anything more you can tell us? Can you give us a schema of your Tree, complete with letters and astrological attributions? Can it work with Tarot?
It is refreshing that apparently Laurel is going about this without rigidly dogmatic preconceptions. Here are the usual path attributions (from Aryeh Kaplan):
 

Attachments

  • gra.jpg
    gra.jpg
    75.8 KB · Views: 386