is there only one version of Thoth that have 3 magus?

Emily

I leave all three Magi in the deck too - My favourite isn't the one that comes with the standard decks so I leave that in but then couldn't bring myself to take the others out either so in they stay. I've never had a reading where I've had two Magi - not sure how I would read them so I'll wait and sort that out if it should ever happen. :)
 

Aeon418

Yygdrasilian said:
I welcome any clarification on these issues and suspect they may relate to the presence of the extra Magi in question, be they superfluous or otherwise.
Yyg, I just love how you can see a conspiracy theory in a mundane marketing strategy. :laugh:

Up until recently A.G.Mueller published three different sizes of Thoth deck. The large, the standard, and the pocket size. Most people agree that the large deck is the most desirable to own.

So, if it were your job to market the different decks, how would you make the standard and pocket sizes look more attractive? Simple, use a very common marketing hook and add a (useless) little extra to the less desirable products. This kind of thing is done all the time because it is a very successful strategy for getting people to buy the same product twice.

If you don't believe me look at all the excitement brewing up over the re-release of the same cards packaged in a new box. It just goes to show you, you really can get new money for old rope. ;)
 

Yygdrasilian

Illuminate Us

Aeon418 said:
Yyg, I just love how you can see a conspiracy theory in a mundane marketing strategy.
That may be all fine and good, but it hardly addresses the question of creative control and copyright. If you read over their surviving letters it is rather obvious that the means by which the deck was to be published and how it was to be made available became a very contentious subject between AC and LFH; one that by all appearances seems as if it were headed for litigation.

It is interesting that my request for clarity on this issue is met with the thinly veiled ridicule of 'conspiracy theory' as it is, in my opinion, a valid question regarding the history of this deck. Whether Crowley's own suspicions of 'trickery' were correct remains to be seen. To my knowledge there are few details available on how these events played out. However, given the 'mundane marketing strategy' that has been used to sell the Book of Thoth Tarot, one may easily conclude that it is not in accordance with Crowley's wishes.

If he did not approve or authorize the 'Magician' used in the Berkeley showing, which one did he authorize?
How were the 3 Magi sanctioned and by whom?
And why was this deck not available for some twenty years after Crowley's death?

Perhaps the answers to these and the other questions I have raised about the release of this Book of Thoth are mundane and AC/LFH settled out of court. I don't know one way or another - thus my request for clarification. But the questions still stand.

Are the answers forthcoming? ---or have you a less subtle means of deflecting the issue? :laugh:
 

Aeon418

Yygdrasilian said:
Are the answers forthcoming? ---or have you a less subtle means of deflecting the issue? :laugh:
Why not try to find them yourself? Email A.G.Mueller and ask them why they decided to include those two extra Magi. And, while you're at it, you can complain to them that their large decks are two cards short. ;)
 

Yygdrasilian

I & I

Aeon418 said:
Why not try to find them yourself? Email A.G.Mueller and ask them why they decided to include those two extra Magi. And, while you're at it, you can complain to them that their large decks are two cards short. ;)
No need for complaint as I reckon you are most probably correct about the extra Magi being an inclusion to use up blank spaces on the sheets. While I do still find the 3 renditions of the Magus useful and instructive, the structure and function of Thoth's Book makes much more sense as a set of 78:

78 = 0+77 = 0 + (7 x 11)
78 = 1+2+3+4+5+6+7+8+9+10+11+12

Regarding the question of creative control & copyright, I am making inquiries; but would still very much welcome any insight or recommended reading from Aeclectic members with knowledge of the subject. Provided, of course, you're not part of 'the conspiracy.' :laugh:
 

ravenest

Here is my take on the 'conspiracy'. (Re the OTO letter you quoted)

It might be a little TOOOO simple for some.
1)AC had some esoteric knowledge.
2)Some people got interested and associated.
3)AC became (more) infamous.
4)Some of the projects coming from 2) looked like they had potential, but the associates got woried about 3).
5) So they tried as they could to hide AC out of frame.

If I was an artist that spent years on a project with MR. SPECIFICKY-PANTS and then got an exhibit but my 'partner' got some bad press, I might see that as good publicity annd I wouldn't G.A.F. But someone a little more 'proper' than me, like Frieda, would.
 

chriske

Dr Octopus

Ravenest's description of the Magus card as Dr Octopus is wonderful. Thanks for making my day!
 

Konata

Le Fanu said:
I know it says on that link 80 cards, but does it specify that it is 78 cards plus two Magus cards? It may be the usual star card and the OTO card, rather than the Magus cards... (but then I don´t read German; cannot read the link...)

As far as I know, the "purple box" US Games deck is the only one which currently has the 3 Magus Cards. I love the middle one. An absolutely stunning card...

ETA;

this edition!
okay, this is very right. i bought the deck because they say it has "80-cards", but the two extras is STAR CARD and the OTO CARD. hell!

just remember Storm82, the AGMÜLLER's is the STAR + OTO card, not the additional Magus.

but the US Games' Crowley Thoth deck provides the two Magus cards.

both US Games' and AGMÜLLER's came in purple for the box, but the US Games' is purple pastel.
 

kernelkole

point of view

I have the 3 Magus, and I attribute great significance to the phenomenon, mostly because the Maus is "my card."

I like this posting below, because it reflects what I like to think of as the Tarot point of view - that is, we should not look for rational, temporal explanations for any phenomena we encounter in the Tarot. If we were to always do this, we would have to question, I don't know, the motivation behind the original Egyptian Thoth paintings.

For me, thinking of the Magus as myself, but in three states of evolution or consciousness, it is particularly powerful when the Magus appear more than once, in different positions in a spread.

Yygdrasilian said:
I'm not sure if 'rejected' is the word...

Put the 3 Magi next to each other and you may notice a progression - a rising, of sorts. This could be a clue to the instructions encoded within this Tarot.

Also, by adding 2 magi to the 78 we are given 80
8 + 0 = 8 : Hod (Thoth)

There were some schemes connected to his rendition of The Book of Thoth that Crowley rejected - schemes which have attended his deck since; but I suspect he may have wanted us to see these 3 Magi. As to the others, that may be a subject for another thread....