Wondering: A short list of Marseille conundrums...

Lights Eternal

When one considers how few decks have survived, despite the
fact that a lot of work went into carving the plates, etc., isn't it
clear there was a concerted effort to actively obliterate them?

I think there was a movement throughout Europe to propagate
the Tarot, with craftsmen going from town to town and creating
new decks as they travelled, perhaps staying just ahead of the law.

Tarot has always been an organic, living tradition, aimed at bringing
to the people the very thing denied them: Truth's invincible verities.
La Papess was their figurehead, and we are the modern benefactors.

Fulgour said:

When one considers how few decks have survived, despite the
fact that a lot of work went into carving the plates, etc., isn't it
clear there was a concerted effort to actively obliterate them?

I think there was a movement throughout Europe to propagate
the Tarot, with craftsmen going from town to town and creating
new decks as they travelled, perhaps staying just ahead of the law.

Tarot has always been an organic, living tradition, aimed at bringing
to the people the very thing denied them: Truth's invincible verities.
La Papess was their figurehead, and we are the modern benefactors.

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Hi Fulgour,

I don't think it's clear that there was concerted effort to obliterate Tarot cards, beyond prohabitions on gambling.... Why do you think so? After all, weren't tarot cards seen by the majority of users for centuries as a game.... printed on paper? I wonder how many of the cards we use today will be around in 300 years.. even with our laminated decks?

As far as craftsmen moving from town to town ahead of the police.. I've always been under the impression that the cards were generally created by long established guildsmen. Wouldn't cardmakers, while not the highest social status by any means, be seen more in the class of printer/publishers than outlaws?

I'd love to know what people of the past five hundred years thought of The Popess other than that it was either disrespectful of the church or a pretty low ranking trump. On what are you suggesting that the Popess is a figurehead?

respectfully,
robert

La Papess is the Goddess, our Mother Moon. Tarot isn't a game.
And how do you explain such generally poor craftsmanship and
sloppy colouring of the cards ~ and this by obvious Masters...

If you feel no need to probe the truths contained in the Tarot,
it yet will continue on as always ~ but why even bother then?

We share an interest in something sacred ~ it is our friendship!
Never imagine I would criticise you, or feel a need to justify me.

Hi Fulgour,

I do value our friendship, so will happily drop this discussion if it endangers it. I meant only to question some of your suggestions.

I have great interest in probing the truths in Tarot, that is why I question everything, to find the truth. When people make definitive statements contrary to what I understand to be the truth, I will question them on it.. it too is what truth seekers do.

For 500 years we have documentation of Tarot as a game. We have very little, if any, reference to it as anything else until the the 18th Century. You can suggest that it is more than a game if you want to, but you cannot state that it is not a game... Tarot has always been, and for many still is, a game. If anyone can prove otherwise, I'd be happy to change my mind.

As for the sloppy coloring, I assume it has to do with mass producing cards for game playing using stencils.. not because of risk of persecution.

robert

Peace

Tarot cards do sort of beg to be used for something, and for many
down through the ages that certainly looks to have been to play.
Put any two kids together with a box of what-nots and soon, viola!
But how very odd that here, there, everywhere, these Tarot cards?

An aside on production values: To me it seems that an innocuous
pack of 78 crudely fashioned and lazily coloured illustrated cards
would be able to hide as easily as a knife between a fork and spoon.
Irreligious? these old things? Taxes? but just look at them, Sire.

Major Tom said:

These discussions certainly inform my own interpretation of the Tarot of Marseilles. (...) So what do you think Rusty, Le Pendu, Kissa, Silvia, Moongold, Wolfy, Shallot, Jmd, and others?

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Fulgour said:

Tarot has always been an organic, living tradition (…)

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Major Tom! I’ve been following the “construction” of your own re-creation of a Marseilles deck for a long time. Look forward to see it complete. One of the things I like most, in your deck, since you wanted to translate it to English, is to see a literal translation of La Maison-Dieu.

But, most of all, THANKS FOR KEEPING IT ALIVE.

Silvia