switching from RWS -TdM.

Wendywu

Yes, the essays are extracts from the book

. I was lucky enough to get a reprint from Four Hares press a few years ago but they sold out pretty fast. That, the Jean Michel David and EE's stuff are my foundation library. Also in there is Yoav Ben-Dov's book which although it refers specifically to his deck is a really good intro to TdM for anyone wanting to read with pip decks. What I like most is that they all say you must learn what the cards mean to you; not "what the cards mean".

Richard

Freddie said:
I use the Golden Dawn system for all of the decks I read with. It makes the most sense to me and it is quite complete with Astrology/Qabalah correspondences as well.

Freddie

So do I.

The Waite images apparently illustrate the Golden Dawn titles rather than the 'traditional' divinatory meanings given in The Pictorial Key. Waite comments that anyone with appropriate intuitive insight should go directly by the images rather than by the traditional meanings.

Robert Place noted that the images did not always illustrate the traditional meanings, but he mistakenly attributed this to his assumption that Waite was not interested in the minors and left their design to PCS.

ivanna

LRichard said:
So do I.

The Waite images apparently illustrate the Golden Dawn titles rather than the 'traditional' divinatory meanings given in The Pictorial Key. Waite comments that anyone with appropriate intuitive insight should go directly by the images rather than by the traditional meanings.

Robert Place noted that the images did not always illustrate the traditional meanings, but he mistakenly attributed this to his assumption that Waite was not interested in the minors and left their design to PCS.

I would like to have a look to the reading system by the G
D. Could you recommend me any?

Richard

ivanna said:
I would like to have a look to the reading system by the G
D. Could you recommend me any?

The card meanings are given in Book T, but they are not easy to find in that document. A slightly easier source to navigate is Liber Theta, which slightly modifies Book T so that it fits Crowley's Thoth deck. Both of these books are rather technical, so they may not be suitable for your needs. The reading method they recommend is the Opening of the Key, which mostly is used by hardcore Thoth and GD enthusiasts.

ivanna

LRichard said:
The card meanings are given in Book T, but they are not easy to find in that document. A slightly easier source to navigate is Liber Theta, which slightly modifies Book T so that it fits Crowley's Thoth deck. Both of these books are rather technical, so they may not be suitable for your needs. The reading method they recommend is the Opening of the Key, which mostly is used by hardcore Thoth and GD enthusiasts.

Ok, so I think I have enough, thank you.
My tarot mentor tought me how to do the Opening of the Key reading, with its 5 steps. But it is sooo big that I felt overwhelmed. Do you read using the 5 steps, or you just shuffle according to the GD system, look at the pile where the SG is, and then you do just a simple reading instead of the 5 steps?

Sulis

3ill.yazi said:
If I was looking at pips, I would likely be doing that anyway. What is there to see?

The intuitive reading I do is informed by whatever I've ever learned about the meanings of the cards. As I retain anything in my brain about as well as a sieve, I don't feel like I'm in much danger of being locked into book meanings too much.

I don't react too much to what the images look like. It's not, the magician is pointing at the Empress. It's more, oh, that's the Magician. Probably because I use different decks. So far my experimenting with an individual deck with meanings specific to it (etteilla) has not been successful IMO. So it's more that I have a platonic form of the cards in my head, not so much a visual image, so to speak, and they are in line with the RWS I grew up with. But I have had great success with the TdM.

I feel I have to answer this as you've suggested that there is nothing to see in the TdM pips and I'm wondering whether you're looking at the same cards as I am

.

There are the vines, the flowers and whether they are open, closed, growing, wilting.. The patterns made by the suit symbols surely say something to you (they certainly do to me), the empty space or whether the card is crammed full - all of these things can be interpreted in a reading…
Then on top of that there are the numbers and the actual elements (and another wonderful thing with TdMs is that you can assign whichever element you like to whichever suit you like).. Link the Minors to the same numbered Majors and the possibilities are endless.

Without looking at the symbolism on the pips, we'd just be using memorised meanings and I personally don't think that's using tarot to its full potential or the reader's full potential..

Like Wendywu said, the TdM pips are very, very chatty and I'd say much more chatty than a scene that comes from someone elses view (the deck creator) of how a card should be interpreted…

Richard

ivanna said:
Ok, so I think I have enough, thank you.
My tarot mentor tought me how to do the Opening of the Key reading, with its 5 steps. But it is sooo big that I felt overwhelmed. Do you read using the 5 steps, or you just shuffle according to the GD system, look at the pile where the SG is, and then you do just a simple reading instead of the 5 steps?

I don't even use the first operation of the OOTK. I just select a single card (or sometimes three cards) and read it. I do take into account the titles/keywords/meanings given in Book T or Liber Theta.

3ill.yazi

Sulis said:
I feel I have to answer this as you've suggested that there is nothing to see in the TdM pips and I'm wondering whether you're looking at the same cards as I am .

There are the vines, the flowers and whether they are open, closed, growing, wilting.. The patterns made by the suit symbols surely say something to you (they certainly do to me), the empty space or whether the card is crammed full - all of these things can be interpreted in a reading…
Then on top of that there are the numbers and the actual elements (and another wonderful thing with TdMs is that you can assign whichever element you like to whichever suit you like).. Link the Minors to the same numbered Majors and the possibilities are endless.

Without looking at the symbolism on the pips, we'd just be using memorised meanings and I personally don't think that's using tarot to its full potential or the reader's full potential..

Like Wendywu said, the TdM pips are very, very chatty and I'd say much more chatty than a scene that comes from someone elses view (the deck creator) of how a card should be interpreted…

My apologies if my comment came off as disparaging. I am fairly novice, and don't have the best eyesight or memory, so I do lean on scenic pips.

As for the TdM, I confess that I possibly switch between too many decks to comprehend anything from what are to me fairly small details. Plus, I am now in possession of a lovely little deck and am currently wrangling with the fact that there are several cards in the deck for which I cannot tell when they are reversed or not.

My reading is informed by the meanings I have learned, but not vetoed by them. I will look closer at the leaves etc. Time to update my prescription.

Richard

3ill.yazi said:
.......I am now in possession of a lovely little deck and am currently wrangling with the fact that there are several cards in the deck for which I cannot tell when they are reversed or not......

I solved that problem a long time ago. Don't use reversals.

ivanna

LRichard said:
I don't even use the first operation of the OOTK. I just select a single card (or sometimes three cards) and read it. I do take into account the titles/keywords/meanings given in Book T or Liber Theta.

So simple. And so difficult. Ah ah.
Just one or three cards?
Nothing to do with the extra complicated system of the GD and its 5 steps. I would need a new table big enough to read the 5 steps.