Do you feel the authors of guidebooks get too much credit?

Personally, I believe the person that actually designed the deck should be recognized. I don't know of too many decks in which the artist didn't have the meanings of the cards in mind when they were creating the artwork.
And to be completely honest, I've never bought a deck because I liked the book

My answer is...it depends.

Sometimes the author was the one with the ideas, but needed help with the visual expression of those ideas, so they hire or pair with an artist/illustrator. If not for the author, the deck would not exist. They deserve the credit for creating the deck.

Sometimes an artist has the ideas and creates the deck, but needs help to verbalize what they have expressed in their art, and they hire or pair with a writer. Then the artist deserves most of the credit.

Sometimes it is truly collaborative and both deserve the credit.

Most of the time, it's not easy to determine which scenario applies to a particular deck. An exception is the New Orleans Voodoo Tarot. The book's cover page states "Concept by Louis Martinié and Sallie Ann Glassman, Text by Louis Martinié, Artwork by Sallie Ann Glassman". I think the 'Concept by' is really the key, and I wish more tarot sets would be as forthright.

If the author of the guidebook is the one giving overall direction to the deck, the author should get the greater credit. Without them, the artist has no deck to offer his/her artwork.

As the author of an oracle deck in development and hopefully a tarot deck in the distant future, I decided my artwork has diminished over the years to the point where bringing in someone to do the art would be a better option. The majority of the imagery is my idea and the artist brings them to life, so I would think in this situation my contribution to the deck is substantially more than authoring an LWB.

cSpaceDiva said:

Most of the time, it's not easy to determine which scenario applies to a particular deck. An exception is the New Orleans Voodoo Tarot. The book's cover page states "Concept by Louis Martinié and Sallie Ann Glassman, Text by Louis Martinié, Artwork by Sallie Ann Glassman". I think the 'Concept by' is really the key, and I wish more tarot sets would be as forthright.

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I agree, the concept is important starting point.

I like how the New Orleans Voodoo Tarot mention so clearly and open the artists involved in its creation.

tarotbear said:

Possibly for the same reason that so many 'great' artists never sold a painting in their lifetimes - which now fetch millions of dollars - and died obscure in poverty?

How many authors never sold a book until after they were dead?

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I honestly don't understand what you're implying with the first question, which I assume is rhetorical. Sure, many great artists struggle in their lifetimes -- I don't know how that is related to tarot decks.

Re: authors, there are plenty of authors who never sold a book until they were dead (I believe Melville is one), and there are still more who struggled to earn a buck all their lives but made a fortune posthumously (Raymond Chandler comes to mind, but there are many others).

But we are drifting way off topic, and rather than repeat my point over and over, I'll step out now.

cSpaceDiva said:

My answer is...it depends.

Sometimes the author was the one with the ideas, but needed help with the visual expression of those ideas, so they hire or pair with an artist/illustrator. If not for the author, the deck would not exist. They deserve the credit for creating the deck.

Sometimes an artist has the ideas and creates the deck, but needs help to verbalize what they have expressed in their art, and they hire or pair with a writer. Then the artist deserves most of the credit.

Sometimes it is truly collaborative and both deserve the credit.

Click to expand...

Exactly. Plenty of artists do work 'on assignment,' so to speak. Plenty of authors work 'for hire' (meaning the author doesn't get royalties but is paid a flat rate).

And if the artist in question is fine with the arrangement, it's really none of our business what their relationship with the writer is.

I think it absolutely depends. For example with Dreaming Way, author Rome Choi simply needed an artist to bring his vision to life. So he had the concept and would direct how he wanted the artist (Kwon Shina) to do the art. His name appears on the box, but credit to the artist is given in the LWB. I am not sure she is even interested in tarot.

With Chrysalis, there would be no deck had artist Holly Sierra not wanted to create a deck of her own. However it was a genuine collaboration where the author (Toney Brooks) had some ideas of his own in creating a new system. Their names are on the box in equal sized font, with "Paintings by Holly Sierra" on top and "Written by Toney Brooks" on the bottom.

To me, this is like similar debates in the music industry, where the performers thinks it's unfair that the songwriter gets all the royalties.

An artist can do an "entire deck" to brief without knowing the first thing about tarot. They can do 78 comissioned illlustrations and, while that's a lot of physical work, it's not the intellectual property or idea-ownership that is behind the invention or conceptualisatiion.

The creator getting the lion's share of the intellectual property income is perfectly fair and there's only an issue if the artist hasn't also been rewarded commensurately for their work. If they have, where's the issue?

In the music scene, the performer gets the fame and attention and remuneration for their labours (when it goes well), but if they're not writing the music, then they're going to miss out on all the creative royalties. This is exactly the same

A clear no from me. It's great that the artists gery credited today, even those who were not mentioned in their days (like Coleman-Smith and Lady Harris).

But I have to write texts at work, too, that can be very difficult. Especially to get your thoughts straight, so others can follow them.

And of course it depends on the book. For example, the Tarot of the Spirit is a great deck but you will need the companion book to understand the symbolism. This book has also enhanced my understanding of the Tarot a great deal. I personally have a deep respect for the artists as well as the authors, when the work is great!

Same.... it's also worth mentioning that the bulk of the credit goes to the risk partner. If the creator/writer is hiring the artist for the project... then it's clear who owns the project, who's making the investment, who's taking the risk, who deserves the royalties (be they framed as fortuen or "credit")

I haven't seen too many artists hiring people to create the ideas for them. It usually goes the other way around.