Jewel
JMD Thank you so much for expanding on the origins of the Qabalah being blended with the Tarot and for the deck recommendation. I will see what I can find 
I Le Bateleur
catboxer
Hello all.
This is a very interesting topic, and I've wanted to post something about Kabbalah and Tarot. But I think I'll do so on Riley's thread of that name.
I'll see you all at V The Pope.
(Cb)
This is a very interesting topic, and I've wanted to post something about Kabbalah and Tarot. But I think I'll do so on Riley's thread of that name.
I'll see you all at V The Pope.
(Cb)
Jewel
P.S. JMD I ordered the Camoin
Kaz
please gimme a link to see those camoin cards?
me is starting to like the pip decks, so a camoin maybe would make a nice asset
kaz
me is starting to like the pip decks, so a camoin maybe would make a nice asset
kaz
jmd
Jewel... Camoin should give me a commission ! I hope those cards give you many decades of pleasure and insight.
Kaz: the Aeclectic site view is here. Through the 'order' button, you will get to the Camoin site. If you have problems getting to their page showing all Major Arcana and some minors, it is located here.
! I hope those cards give you many decades of pleasure and insight.Kaz: the Aeclectic site view is here. Through the 'order' button, you will get to the Camoin site. If you have problems getting to their page showing all Major Arcana and some minors, it is located here.
Kaz
thanks jmd.
that's an interesting website btw......
edited to add that i ordered the deck
kaz
that's an interesting website btw......
edited to add that i ordered the deck
kaz
Umbrae
Considering conjurers of old (jugglers, magicians) a three legged table is pretty standard. They do not wobble on uneven ground. You also have to be portable, to travel to the next town. Magicians (legerdemain) or today still use three legged tables (most are on a tripod).
It has also been said that pockets came into being because of early conjurors. They wore aprons, and had pockets placed in them to facilitate acquiring and disposing objects, both seen and unseen. Tailors thought it was a clever idea and copied it (so it has been said).
It has also been said that pockets came into being because of early conjurors. They wore aprons, and had pockets placed in them to facilitate acquiring and disposing objects, both seen and unseen. Tailors thought it was a clever idea and copied it (so it has been said).
Kaz
Kaz
catboxer
Cary-Yale replacements
Kaz:
I wanted to say again that your posting of the Visconti decks really adds a lot to these discussions. I always feel like I'm looking at the ancestor of all tarot when I see them, although the fact is we really don't know for sure if they were the earliest decks or not. They may have been preceded by much more humble woodblock packs, which would have been less likely to survive than the deluxe models. Who knows? tarot may have working-class origins.
I need to point out, however, that the Cary-Yale Magician posted here is a modern card rather than part of the original deck. There are 19 cards (at least -- there may be more) missing from that pack, and in 1983 the Italian artist Luigi Scapini recreated what he thought the missing 19 might have looked like. He used a combination of the press proofs from reproduction of the originals, some collage application, and some overpainting.
I noticed that Scapini dutifully included the four suit signs on the three-legged table. This is a feature much beloved by modern tarotists, but I seriously doubt that it was included in the lost original. Notice that the objects on the Magician's table in the Visconti-Sforza are odds and ends, some unidentifiable.
The other missing Cary-Yale cards recreated by Scapini were: the Fool, Justice, the Hermit, the Wheel of Fortune, the Hanged Man, Temperance, the Devil, the Tower, the Moon, the Sun, the Male Knight of Swords (there were six court cards in each suit), the Male Page of Swords, the Queen of Cups, the Male Page of Coins, the King of Batons, the Male Knight of Batons, the Female Knight of Cups, and the three of Coins. These are included in some of the published versions of this deck.
(See Kaplan, Volume II, pages 36-41)
(catboxer)
Kaz:
I wanted to say again that your posting of the Visconti decks really adds a lot to these discussions. I always feel like I'm looking at the ancestor of all tarot when I see them, although the fact is we really don't know for sure if they were the earliest decks or not. They may have been preceded by much more humble woodblock packs, which would have been less likely to survive than the deluxe models. Who knows? tarot may have working-class origins.
I need to point out, however, that the Cary-Yale Magician posted here is a modern card rather than part of the original deck. There are 19 cards (at least -- there may be more) missing from that pack, and in 1983 the Italian artist Luigi Scapini recreated what he thought the missing 19 might have looked like. He used a combination of the press proofs from reproduction of the originals, some collage application, and some overpainting.
I noticed that Scapini dutifully included the four suit signs on the three-legged table. This is a feature much beloved by modern tarotists, but I seriously doubt that it was included in the lost original. Notice that the objects on the Magician's table in the Visconti-Sforza are odds and ends, some unidentifiable.
The other missing Cary-Yale cards recreated by Scapini were: the Fool, Justice, the Hermit, the Wheel of Fortune, the Hanged Man, Temperance, the Devil, the Tower, the Moon, the Sun, the Male Knight of Swords (there were six court cards in each suit), the Male Page of Swords, the Queen of Cups, the Male Page of Coins, the King of Batons, the Male Knight of Batons, the Female Knight of Cups, and the three of Coins. These are included in some of the published versions of this deck.
(See Kaplan, Volume II, pages 36-41)
(catboxer)
