help! [which Hebrew letter correspondence?]

Lady Orchard

have just started reading 78 degrees and was interested in the idea of the majors relating to the hebrew alphabet.

however there seems to be some discrepancy on the internet as to what letters relate to what cards?
I have found one site that says aleph is the magician and the fool is tav; but another said the fool is aleph.

help! which is correct before I read further on this??
 

Ross G Caldwell

Hi Lady,

Lady Orchard said:
have just started reading 78 degrees and was interested in the idea of the majors relating to the hebrew alphabet.

however there seems to be some discrepancy on the internet as to what letters relate to what cards?
I have found one site that says aleph is the magician and the fool is tav; but another said the fool is aleph.

help! which is correct before I read further on this??

There is actually no "correct" correspondence. There are merely three different schools of thought, or doctrines.

The oldest, implied by the Comte de Mellet in 1781, would have the Fool as Tav (he starts his list with the World as Aleph, and counts the trumps down).

Many 19th century occultists assigned the Fool to the letter Shin.

The Golden Dawn gave him Aleph at the end of the 19th century.

I don't know anyone personally who follows the Fool=Shin method, but there are proponents for both Tav and Aleph.

I think most of what you find in English (I could be wrong) will have the Fool=Aleph. But in the end, you have to study everything and make up your own mind. It's the only way.

Ross
 

Lady Orchard

Thanks. I have decided in the 1st instance to take the Fool as Aleph.

To what extent to people believe that the majors are based on the meanings of the letters? Because if they are, surely there are many more interpretations of each card than we would usually think of?

Take for example the Tower being Peh - mouth; to swallow and be full. I see how the Tower relates to this - if you were to fill your mouth with thoughts, actions and beliefs, eventually you would have to swallow them. Then you would become full with the "truth" - which may feel uncomfortable, and quite different from how the food originally tasted. But of course you eventually digest that food, and can then start to eat again. And also the idea of swallowing being a quick downwards action, as is lightning or indeed people falling from a tower.

But we think of the tower as initially being a quite devastating force; and often out of our control. Surely swallowing though is a personal action? And although it may lead us to the truth, which may be uncomfortable to begin with, does it have to carry that same devastating force?

I hope this is making sense and would welcome what others think.
 

Aeon418

Lady Orchard said:
I hope this is making sense and would welcome what others think.
Interesting observations. The mouth is essentially destructive during the process of eating. All food taken in must be destroyed by chewing before it can be swallowed. Only by destruction can we continue to live.
But what comes out of the mouth, speech, can be just as destructive sometimes, if not more so.

The letter Peh and the Tower also have to be viewed within the context of their position on the Tree of life between the watery, intellectual sephira - Hod, and the fiery, emotional sephira - Netzach. And on top of that the astological attribution of Mars. No wonder Crowley in the Book of Thoth subtitles this card War.
 

ravenest

yeah ... I get, like, a war with the self ... or at the self; those things internally or externally that strip away the false or outmoded forms (the old tower) to get at what is essential and worthwhile (within the tower) and I guess this is a bit like digestion, extracting the nourishment that is locked up in the form which must be 'destroyed' in the transformation process.
 

Aeon418

It's also interesting to note that Yesod = 80 = Peh. ;)
 

Fulgour

Hermes Mercury Magus & Pointy Hats

Lady Orchard said:
Thanks. I have decided in the 1st instance to take the Fool as Aleph.
The Fool was switched to Aleph by The Golden Dawn
ao that The Magician would be able to have a planet.

Letter 2 (Beth) clearly is feminine, and so the Moon...
Imagine trashing the entire Major Arcana to "promote"
The Magician to Mercury, all to satisfy a few big egos.

All 22 attributions were changed so the boys could be
Mr. Mercury Magus~ did they even care about Tarot?

I'm Fulgour :) and that's my rant!
Thanks, one and all!
 

Aeon418

Fulgour said:
all to satisfy a few big egos.
I'm Fulgour :) and that's my rant!
Hmm... ;)
 

Aeon418

Fulgour, aside from the childish nature of your comments (which is revealing in it's self ;)), might I suggest that instead of spouting endless torrents of narrow minded and dogmatic opinions, you refer back to Ross's previous comments on this subject:
Ross G Caldwell said:
There is actually no "correct" correspondence. There are merely three different schools of thought, or doctrines.
Lady Orchard subsequently decided to use the Aleph = Fool correspondence. Wouldn't it be more constructive to actually post comments that help to explain this attribution of the hebrew letters, rather than posting rants about your personal dislike of it.