Dating an IJJ Swiss?

Chiska said:

Mine was cool - it came with absolutely PRISTINE minors and used majors. I found in the 1JJ Swiss book that he did mentioned that to do readings, one needed to take out the majors and use them only. So, who ever had this deck first, did just that.

Click to expand...

When I bought my 1JJ Swiss, my first deck many years ago, from an occult shop the lady owner offered me a Majors only 1JJ Swiss. This deck was in slim box, it hadn't been parted from its Minors. It was a Majors only 1JJ Swiss.

She told me then that I could learn these cards and they were fine to use on their own. But being young and a playing card reader, I was eager to use a full deck. I was then offered free lessons but I turned them down. But in all the years past, I have never seen a Majors only 1JJ Swiss again.

I wonder if that was done because of what Mr Kaplan said in his booklet about taking the majors only out of the deck and doing readings with them.

It's interesting to me how many people around the boards say that the 1JJ was their first deck...I'm a little surprised at that; I guess people find it extremely attractive.

Mallah said:

It's interesting to me how many people around the boards say that the 1JJ was their first deck...I'm a little surprised at that; I guess people find it extremely attractive.

Click to expand...

It was the first Tarot deck published by USG, hence the 1 in 1JJ. It was my second deck, if I recall correctly, the first being an Albano-Waite.

Mallah said:

I wonder if that was done because of what Mr Kaplan said in his booklet about taking the majors only out of the deck and doing readings with them.

It's interesting to me how many people around the boards say that the 1JJ was their first deck...I'm a little surprised at that; I guess people find it extremely attractive.

Click to expand...

No surprise there. There were a whole two decks easily available at the time in North America - this and the University Books Waite/Smith (USG hadn't done theirs yet; it was a year later and the 1JJ was still easier to find and cheaper.)

I got mine in KMart.

YES, I do mean KMart. In Kitchener. I remember it well !

So I think availability has a lot to do with it

In the Preface of Kaplan's Encyclopedia Vol.1, he says:

"At the close of the Nuremberg Toy Fair, I returned to New York, and the following week I showed the 1JJ Swiss Tarot deck to Henry Levy. Levy was then a buyer at Brentano's and placed a small trial order for tarot decks with the admonishment to be certain to include with each deck a booklet of instructions about the origin and use of the cards."

I don't know for sure, but I think the trial order decks might be the ones with "Fabrique des Cartes" only on The Emperor's shield and no reference numbers.

A brief history of AG Muller in Kaplan Vol2., page 364 says:

"From 1901 to 1948 Heinrich Julius Albert Muller maintained the firm, still in Schaffhausen and called J. Muller & Cie. Since 1960 the cardmaker has operated in Schaffhausen under the name AG Muller & Cie."

But it's interesting to note that all those early US Games version still say "J. Muller & Cie." on The Emperor's shield and Two of Cups.

They were still PRINTED by Muller... maybe that was part of the deal ?

Kaplan wasn't the only one to import the 1JJ - Wehman Bros. did also, and probably before Kaplan. They come in a plain white box with a paper label on one side stating - Fabrique Schaffhousoise de cartes a jouer, Cartes Tarocs No. 1JJ. Then there is the Wehman Bros. label stuck on top of that! There are also physical tax stamps stuck over the tuck flaps at each end of the box. The best thing however, is the ivory card stock and the superior printing, with richer, yet more subtle colouring. L'Empereur's shield has on mention of Muller - just Fabrique des Cartes.
So I believe this deck was available in the States, and called 1JJ long before Kaplan even saw it at that toy fair!

Sumada said:

Kaplan wasn't the only one to import the 1JJ - Wehman Bros. did also, and probably before Kaplan. They come in a plain white box with a paper label on one side stating - Fabrique Schaffhousoise de cartes a jouer, Cartes Tarocs No. 1JJ. Then there is the Wehman Bros. label stuck on top of that! There are also physical tax stamps stuck over the tuck flaps at each end of the box. The best thing however, is the ivory card stock and the superior printing, with richer, yet more subtle colouring. L'Empereur's shield has on mention of Muller - just Fabrique des Cartes.
So I believe this deck was available in the States, and called 1JJ long before Kaplan even saw it at that toy fair!

Click to expand...

Fascinating. Though I will say that my 1970 (?) one has ivory stock and feels just gorgeous in the hand. Much nicer than the one that comes in the Fortune-Telling kit - which is very white by comparison. I'd forgotten that till you mentioned it. DAMN I wish I had it here... I would get Him to bring it over next week - but explaining to him where it IS would be tricky ! (I know EXACTLY - but there is in that drawer potential for error from the non-tarotist and I'd feel awful if I had to say it was the right one when it wasn't !)

I know what you mean Gregory. I'm currently adding exact location for each deck to my own catalogue exactly for this purpose!

Sumada said:

I know what you mean Gregory. I'm currently adding exact location for each deck to my own catalogue exactly for this purpose!

Click to expand...

Oh, that info is in there. I could hit the deck in seconds. But to tell him - "bring the one in the red box in the third row from the left in the top drawer of the chest immediately next to you as you enter the room" - sounds easy, but when you can SEE one with the same title in the next row, and...

And he's not actually that big on right/left correspondence And I can't do east/west (I'm not even sure which compass orientation our HOUSE is on, never mind that room !!!)

When we make our catalogues, we don't expect to have someone else needing to use them