Grand Cardinal Cross

LovelyMissAries

How do you know how and if the Grand Cardinal Cross is / will affect you?

I have an Aries stellium in the 11th and a Capricorn stellium in the 7th. I'm not feeling anything in my personal relationships, but I have thought of quitting my job a few times (stronger than normal.)

Barleywine

LovelyMissAries said:
How do you know how and if the Grand Cardinal Cross is / will affect you?

I have an Aries stellium in the 11th and a Capricorn stellium in the 7th. I'm not feeling anything in my personal relationships, but I have thought of quitting my job a few times (stronger than normal.)

This is an interesting question. With a T-Square, the (at least modern) expectation is that a planet passing over the degree opposite the apex (or "focus") planet, thereby filling the "empty leg" and creating a temporary Grand Cross, is the "trigger" that energizes the qualities of the apex planet, with lesser stimulation to the other planets involved. I suppose, starting with a Grand Cross, you would first have to decide which planet in the configuration is the strongest (by angularity, element, essential dignity, etc.) of the complex (kind of the "director"), and then watch for transits or directions that trigger it in the same way that the T-Square apex planet is activated. That house is where I would look for the action to initiate, but the stimulus could come from any one of the other quarters, depending on the strength of the planet doing the "energizing." I'm not sure I would look for trines or sextiles to do the job, but that's just me

Minderwiz

LovelyMissAries said:
How do you know how and if the Grand Cardinal Cross is / will affect you?

I have an Aries stellium in the 11th and a Capricorn stellium in the 7th. I'm not feeling anything in my personal relationships, but I have thought of quitting my job a few times (stronger than normal.)

I agree with Barleywine, it's a good question. I tend to start with angularity, and which planets are involved. You don't mention which, if any planets are involved at the other two vertices but you certainly have angularity (indeed if Whole Sign Houses are used then the Aries bunch will be tenth House). So what's in your Ascendant (Cancer) and in Libra?

I'd also take into account the same things as Barleywine plus the houses they rule.

LovelyMissAries

Minderwiz said:
I agree with Barleywine, it's a good question. I tend to start with angularity, and which planets are involved. You don't mention which, if any planets are involved at the other two vertices but you certainly have angularity (indeed if Whole Sign Houses are used then the Aries bunch will be tenth House). So what's in your Ascendant (Cancer) and in Libra?

I'd also take into account the same things as Barleywine plus the houses they rule.

*cracks knuckles*

My ASC is in Gemini, but Cancer does consume much of my 1st house.

Sun, Mercury, and Venus are all in Aries and they all square Saturn in Capricorn in the 7th.

Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune are in the 7th.

5th house is ruled by Libra, with Pluto sitting near the 6th house in Scorpio as a singleton.

So, 1st and 7th house are angular houses. Me vs. Relationships?

Barleywine

LovelyMissAries said:
*cracks knuckles*

My ASC is in Gemini, but Cancer does consume much of my 1st house.

Sun, Mercury, and Venus are all in Aries and they all square Saturn in Capricorn in the 7th.

Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune are in the 7th.

5th house is ruled by Libra, with Pluto sitting near the 6th house in Scorpio as a singleton.

So, 1st and 7th house are angular houses. Me vs. Relationships?

Sorry, I'm still not connecting here. In order to have a Cardinal Grand Cross you have to have one or more planets in each of Aries, Cancer, Libra and Capricorn; if they are involved in cross-sign squares, some astrologers won't count them, others call them "disassociated" or some such. The traditional astrologers I've read wouldn't take the Ascendant as one leg of the Cross even if it were in Cancer (which it isn't). I see Aries and Capricorn tenanted; what is in Cancer and Libra?

LovelyMissAries

Nothing is in Cancer or Libra except them ruling the 1st and 5th house respectively. In my OP I was meaning the Grand Cardinal Cross that's occurring this April in general, and how that general Grand Cross would affect me since I have Aries and Capricorn heavily in my chart. I don't have any planets in Cancer or Libra though but I didn't know you had to have those as well to be affected.

Barleywine

LovelyMissAries said:
Nothing is in Cancer or Libra except them ruling the 1st and 5th house respectively. In my OP I was meaning the Grand Cardinal Cross that's occurring this April in general, and how that general Grand Cross would affect me since I have Aries and Capricorn heavily in my chart. I don't have any planets in Cancer or Libra though but I didn't know you had to have those as well to be affected.

Ah, now I see. There was a lot of foaming-at-the-mouth last year about the Grand Trine in Water that was about to occur up in the sky, but, unless it ties into something in an existing nativity, it would really only make a difference in the charts of those people, entities or events "born" at that time. Even some alleged astrologers missed this point, or chose to ignore it to exploit the stir it created.

So you have a Cardinal square configuration in your birth chart involving several planets that will be turned into a Grand Cross briefly by the transits of other planets through Cardinality? Or that will be "touched" by the moving Grand Cross at the sensitive points in your natal chart when it forms in the sky? I guess I would read these as individual squares and oppositions instead of a major combination of influences that will be pulled into your life by the contacts. Certainly all of the natal conjunctions and squares could be activated by those transits that directly hit them. But I don't know of any mechanism that "funnels" the energies of a major transiting aspect pattern, in toto, through a natal planet that happens to be at a sensitive point. Minderwiz should weigh in.

Minderwiz

LovelyMissAries said:
Nothing is in Cancer or Libra except them ruling the 1st and 5th house respectively. In my OP I was meaning the Grand Cardinal Cross that's occurring this April in general, and how that general Grand Cross would affect me since I have Aries and Capricorn heavily in my chart. I don't have any planets in Cancer or Libra though but I didn't know you had to have those as well to be affected.

Thanks for the explanation. Yes there is a claimed Grand Cross involving Mars (Libra) Jupiter (Cancer) Uranus (Aries) and Pluto (Capricorn). They all reach the same degree of their respective sign (13 degrees) but they never reach the same minute, at the same time. In reality the four squares do not perfect simultaneously. They are spread over about four days. That's one of the problems of using aspect patterns, they rarely perfect at the same time, Many modern Astrologers would argue that perfection is not important, it's the lines on the chart that matters or at least very close proximity.

Whether or not simultaneous perfection matters, the planetary transits to natal planets may well perfect you may experience or have experienced several transits to your natal planets in Aries and Capricorn by Conjunction, square or opposition. I can't tell you when without your chart to hand but I can tell you that they will not occur at the same time and indeed they may well be spread out over several months or longer. So if all the transits work, and they don't always, you may be in for an interesting time (or already in the middle of it).

Given that you've got several planets in cardinal signs, I'd look at how they are affected and when, and the houses involved. You will probably have your work cut out looking at those without worrying about the 'Grand Cross'

Ronia

I know it will affectme because I have points and planets in three out of the four cardinals. But it has been going for months, so whoever is affected felt it long ago.

Barleywine

Ronia said:
I know it will affect me because I have points and planets in three out of the four cardinals. But it has been going for months, so whoever is affected felt it long ago.

In looking at my ephemeris, it appears that the Grand Cross won't perfect until Mars retrogrades back to 13 degrees Libra, while Jupiter is at 13 Cancer, Uranus is at 13 Aries and Pluto is at 13 Capricorn. This only lasts for a couple of days later this month. I looked back a bit and didn't see that they ever came together at any time earlier this year. Of course, the Uranus-Pluto square has been ongoing, off-and-on, for months, and Jupiter has been in the picture for a while, but Mars is only briefly passing through. If it were Saturn instead of Mars completing the pattern, I might expect something more substantial to result. As it stands, I'd say that Shakespeare had a play title that would perfectly fit the occasion.