Thinking out loud about tarot history

wandking said:

After posting my last entry I noticed you said "I work with the old books of this Bishop of Béziers" and wondered if you had ever come across any record of religious practices in Béziers in the decade prior to 1209 CE.

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LOL - unfortunately not! I could make a career of it, however, if I ever did find some.

This library I work in has books collected and inherited by Joseph-Bruno de Bausset de Roquefort, Bishop of Béziers from 1745-1771, and from schools and private individuals around the area from 1480 to the Revolution (the library also has books from the 19th century to the present, of course). It is primarily a theological and legal collection of 4600 books. There are plenty of books on religion, but nothing about Catharism, or Albigenses, except mentions in collections about heresy - they are part of "the dualist heresy".

The earliest book actually from Béziers was written by a clerical poet, whom some call a "troubadour", Ermangaud, in the late 1200s. He was a good Catholic, not a Cathar, however. The manuscripts are all in Paris now. The oldest book still in Béziers is a book of statutes and laws, starting in the late 1300s. It has been transcribed, but I haven't studied either the transcription or the manuscript for years.

Catharism is an extremely important study, and I'm not really qualified to speak much about it.

Most Cathar texts are later than the 13th century, after they had been reduced by persecution and had gone into exile in Italy and elsewhere.

wandking said:

Ross, you mentioned "Some Mantegna like images (planetary images) also show up in the Tempio Malatestiana c. 1450, Lazzarelli "De Imaginibus Deorum" of 1471, and Ghisi's "Labyrinth", a game in a book form (16th century, don't know exact date)." think you refer to Tempio Malatestiana at Rimini, which is one of the first entirely classical buildings of the Renaissance and a book by Lazzarelli. Those "planetary images" occur in examples of Renaissance art too. What I find curious is no mention that Mantegna images (other than planetary) bear a striking likeness to examples of Trionfi cards of that period, which leads to my question: Do you believe The Fool in the Marseille Deck somehow derived from a Mantegna depiction of the beggar?

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Yes, it's San Francesco in Rimini. I have never seen a full series of all of the paintings and reliefs in there (nor visited it yet), but I know they were done by Agostino di Duccio and Matteo di Pasti. Both had connections to Ferrara, and Matteo di Pasti has the distinction of being the first artist noted to have illustrated a manuscript of Petrarch's Trionfi, in a commission from 1441. The work hasn't survived, however.

The iconographic connection between the Mantegna Misero and the Tarocchi Matto suggests to me that, at least in some decks, there is a common motif of an allegory of "Poverty". Sheer dejection. I wouldn't say that the Fool in the Marseille deck derived from Mantegna, but that they both depict the same idea roughly. There is an important difference though, in the tarot Fool depicts madness, whereas Mantegna doesn't, I think.

So I would say they share the poverty and misery, but not the insanity.

The dog represents different things too, depending on where you find him. It could be that dogs chase vagabonds, which both the Mantegna and Marseille clearly are depicting; but dogs are also faithful companions of vagabonds, and protect them from others who might wish to hurt them, rob them, etc.

Ross, I appreciate your response to last posting but you seem to have missed an earlier posting of mine that asks " Do you believe The Fool in the Marseille Deck somehow derived from a Mantegna depiction of the beggar?" and what fo you think about the striking similarity between Renaissance Trionfi cards and Mantenga images?

oic

thanks, you were posting at the same time as me.

what fo you think about the striking similarity between Renaissance Trionfi cards and Mantenga images?

Ross G Caldwell said:

I don't think this is a good solution, for two reasons -

1) The Bolognese "Papi" continued to show a Papessa, or even two Papesse, depending on how you read the images -
http://geocities.com/anytarot/earlybologna.html
They are clearly papal figures, and are in no way an attempt to "replace Pope and Popess".

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Interesting deck and I'm interested to know, what date it has.

Nonetheless, I see simply popess, Pope, Empero, Empress

2) Other places, far removed, observe the same rule. Such a specific thing is unlikely to have been an independent invention, in these places, and Dummett calls it one of "unsolved problems of playing-card research"
http://i-p-c-s.org/problist.html
"Two questions relate to Piedmont. The first is this: Various features of Tarot games played in Piedmont indicate a connection with Bologna:
the treatment of the four ‘Papi’—Empress, Popess, Emperor and Pope—as of equal rank, any one of them played later to a trick beating one played earlier;
the superiority of the Angel to the World.
Can any early connection be found between Bologna and Piedmont, or Tarot players in both places, be discovered to account for this?"
(number 3)

I found a solution, which is that the earliest game among the Milanese nobility was the same as the earliest game in Ferrara and Bologna (and Florence?).

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The specific problem of Dummett can have many other reasons. Rule observations shoud be (at least) datable only from very young date.

Ross,

what more is known of Bembo? What corporation would he have belonged to (the painter-illuminators? did they regroup in that fashion in Northern Italy?) do we know where he was from, who his master was? did he travel?

I think your concentration on him - or on any other other artisans who worked on early cards and tarot - is crucial. I can't help thinking that by concentrating on Italian (or even French) Courts we are barking up the wrong tree, and that the answer to many of our questions - "who made the tarot, why, what hidden -or not-so-hidden - symbolism can be found there, where does it come from , what was its intellectual history before it ended up on cards and after?" - is to be found in the makers, the artisans, the guilds, and those companies of men who travelled widely throughout Europe, and some even beyond, and who transferred not only their various skills and art to each other, but specific beliefs. I feel the history of Tarot is closely linked to the wider history of artisans and their works in Europe, their known links to unorthodox or not-quite orthodox religious movements, more than the to the courts, always fickle and always more interested in power than in ideas and imagery; and to the beliefs that circulated thanks to these artisans.

Occitan, Italian, Catalan, Northern French, Southern German, Flemish - and even English artisans (who were in great numbers in France during the Hundred Year War), although often rivals, were also vehicles of transmission of each others' customs and built a remarkly coherent sub-culture, which was not infrequently in trouble with the Church (a link can probably be made there with Cathar history - I mean the wider Cathar culture, not the strict communities of Perfects - and Templar history; as well as the obvious one you wrote about, with alchemy).

I have read of the comparison - and the direct link made by some - with the masons who built and decorated cathedrals. As we know, the answers to many of the "Cathedral connundrums" (green men, devilish-looking gargoyles, a number of signs and symbols, etc.) are not to be found in Church records or in the tastes and propaganda of the patrons, but in the - unfortunately often oral - history and customs of the masons, carvers and verriers. Much of the history of masons and their brother artisans is romanticised, but I think there is much to be investigated on the link with Tarot symbology which might enlighten us on tarot history (and better still, a fascinating wider study!). Possibly much has been done already in that field. Do you - or anyone else (Huck? JMD?) have any leads? (in French, English or Italian? or Spanish at a pinch?)

First and then questions

First, a thanks for the thoughtful reflections.

I pulled out my 'smallest' reference to address the thoughts first proposed by Ross Caldwell. My smallest reference is Michael Dummett's 1986 publication of the "Visconti Sforza Tarot Cards."

From what I understand of Dummett is how he looks at several authors and playing card history patterns and his summaries, while seemingly dry and full of notes, pulls together many threads.

Dummett references the possible sources of trump patterns to include Milan, Ferarra and Bologna in distinct regions.

After examining the notes in the first posts, I think the Ferarra thoughts by Ross are referenced in the B pattern suggested by Ross' reading of Dummett and others. Even in the Visconti book, Dummett suggests that the order of the trumps comes from looking at known literature and the G. Bertoni poem for the ladies of Isabella D'Este of Mantua is a verification of ordering for the pattern. Isabella D'Este to me was a conservative in terms of how she dictated her considerable patronage and likely to dictate to poets as well as painters her choices and preferences. Her influences and kindliness to the courtly governor of Modena, M.M. Boiardo, who did the tarocchi verses for her brother's court (Alfonso), was in part because of his closeness and fidelity to the Estensi throughout the years. Yes, the Bertoni poem is later than the early references of Ferarra trumps, but it was to me, it shows how Isabella retrospectively celebrated the gilded card games she likely saw in her sister Beatrice's court and her brother Alfonso's court...and its courtly associations with showing a poetic pattern for cards in the Mantua/Ferarrese region is a nice backup detail, typical of the playing card historian Dummett trying to trace backward from the more established game French patterns of the 1600s-1800s. In terms of the Ferarra patterns, it is clear to Dummett that the regional association with tarot or trump poetry and games fell out of favor when the Estensi family were no longer rulers of the region.

I have some superficial thoughts of the Milanese pattern Dummett suggests that seems to find a backup in the trump order from a Giovanni Susio poem--but all I can find is Dummett and other online historians referencing the poem, no translations or publications that write the poem out. Dummett also suggests other things that contributed to his suggestion of the trump pattern, but the Susio poem seems to be the 'confirmation'. Alas, does someone have any information on the poem itself or see information updates in the 2004 expensive reference of Dummett himself? I think it might be relevant to the discussion of the Milanese pattern.

Regards,

Cerulean

P.S. I admire the thoughts put forth by everyone and only bring up this reference from my limited access and some looks into Ferarra and Milan history.

helvetica

You asked "what more is known of Bembo? What corporation would he have belonged to (the painter-illuminators? did they regroup in that fashion in Northern Italy?) do we know where he was from, who his master was? did he travel?"

Although Tarot previously existed for centuries, significant historical research of Visconti-Sforza Tarocchi did not occur until 1966 CE, when librarian, Gertrude Moakley, investigated the cards as a means of testing usefulness of the library as a research platform. Her book, The Tarot Cards Painted by Bonifacio Bembo, opens with an imaginary procession in fifteenth century Milan to furnish period context but Triumphal Processions actually occurred during the Renaissance. Moakley accurately conveys detailed descriptions of festivities that begin Lent, a time of repentance, soul-searching and sacrifice leading to Easter. In the Renaissance, abstaining from meat evolved into a custom still practiced by Catholics. Current versions of Triumphal Parades include Carnival and Mardi Gras. Derived from Latin, Carnival means “farewell to meat.” Most examples of the Visconti-Sforza cards from two decks exist as museum collections and clearly represent figures or floats in these parades. Although modern equivalents of the processions offer little similarity to Tarot, period art proves a distinct connection. Named for collection contributors and museums currently exhibiting the cards, existing decks include the Pierpont Morgan-Bergamo and Cary-Yale Visconti-Sforza Tarocchi Packs, which appear markedly different. Seventy-four Pierpont Morgan cards exist, while sixty-seven Cary-Yale cards obviously represent a larger deck that not only offers extra suit cards but also the Cardinal Virtues of Hope, Faith and Charity in the Major Arcana. Additional Minor Arcana cards include female Knights and Pages, although women never held the positions in society. Knights and pages represent people in divinatory readings and associating a Lady in a Renaissance Court with masculine figures likely constituted an insult; however, only sketchy evidence of using Tarot for divination exists from the period.

Thanks, Wandking, for the answer - very interesting background details on the early days of Tarot in Renaissance Italy - I'd not made the connection with the Carnevale!

But my point was really about the craftsmen who made the cards, who, in my view, played an essential role in its iconogrpahy and its symbolism - I wondered if there were any studies made on that, as there had been on cathedral builders (where it is now clear that the master builders, carvers and stained glass masters - and their guildsmen - were a crucial influence on what we actually see in cathedrals, and who had an important role in transmission of beliefs in the Middle Ages and right up to the early modern times, whether these were orthodox or heretical beliefs).

I am very curious about those craftsmen. Much focus is on courts - at the expense of the makers of the cards, the initiators and keepers of the tradition!