USG Cagliostro Editions

lunakasha said:

Umbrae said:

go to the ace of disks and tell us what number is below the big coin

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Thanks, Umbrae!

The number is 0055.

Luna

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Well, this is rather interesting. I won a copy of the Messis Summa Cartomanzia 184 from an eBay seller in Italy. My deck also has the number 0055 on card 78! The number is really hard to see though because

DISTRIBUTED BY
U.S. GAMES SYSTEMS
New York 10016

is printed(?) over it.

Comparing this new deck to both my Cagliostro and my Cartomanzia 184, the writing in the pentacle on card 78 says "CAGLIOSTRO TAROT" in bold around the yellow part and "MADE IN ITALY" at the top arc of the white circle and "S.A. MODIANO TRIESTE" on the bottom arc. And everything on the cards is in English just like my Cagliostro. The writing in the pentacle on card 78 in the Cartomazia 184 is in Italian. It's all in regular font and all in the yellow band - at the top arc it says, "FABBRICA CARTE DA GIUOCO" and at the bottom arc, it says, "S.A. MODIANO TRIESTE".

Looking closer at the various editions, the number on card 78 is closer to the bottom of the circle on the Caglistro and closer to the center of the space between the bottom of the circle and the bottom of the card on both the Cartomanzia 184 and the Messis Summa. The Cagliostro has the same Distributed By info that's on my Messis Summa, so I'm guessing USG shifted the number up in the Cagliostro to accomodate the additional info. The number in the Cagliostro is also in black whereas it's blue on both the Cartomanzia and the Messis Summa.

Back in post 71, lunakasha described her cards and booklet as being Italian. The version I just got is in English, but otherwise appears to be the same as the version she asked about. And they both have the same number on card 78.

Is it possible that both the Italian and English versions of the deck would've been printed in the same run and that's why they have the same number on card 78?

Rodney

rwcarter said:

... that has a blank card with it. The deck I've had for many years doesn't have a blank card with it.

The only clue from the boxes to them being different editions is the address for USG. The edition with the blank has the New York address while the edition without has the Connecticut address. Looking at the LWBs, inside the cover of the edition with the blank are the numbers 10 9 8 7 6 5 4 3 (which I believe means either 2nd or 3rd printing) while the edition without the blank has the numbers 10 9 8 7 6 5 (4th or 5th printing). I think the edition without the blank was shrinkwrapped when I got it (meaning it was new), so it never contained a blank card.

Does anyone know if the blank was missing from that deck or if USG stopped including the blank sometime between the two editions?

Rodney

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I too have the Cagliostro Tarot and mine has 2 blank cards and at the bottom of the box it says Stampford, CT. And its a US Game product.

To add another wrinkle to this mystery, I was Metaphysical Bookstore shopping over in Berkeley with an ATer (hey you! ), and we ran across a shop owner who had her own personal edition of this deck that she said was bought in France in the 70s. It came in a 2-part red slipcover case, the cards are in Italian, and there is no number on card 78! There is a very faint blue stamp inside the coin on the card, but it was really hard to see. And of course I didn't have the presence of mind to remember that my iPhone has a camera on it, so I didn't take a picture of the card or box!

Her deck had been used (there was a coffee stain on one of the cards), but the cards were in otherwise good condition and the box was in fair condition.

Rodney

The red box from the 1970's....a green box from the 1940"s

ouI think the red-box one from France is one that I have seen..and may be what Umbrae has now.

I am not certain, but there might be a green or gray leatherette Modiano boxed version with cards with a tax stamp from the late 1940's...red backs to the cards.

No...Not the same booklet from Dr. Marius! The minor cards from Modiano 1948 do not
have Etteilla numbering, nor dates and are smaller than the modern 1981 Cagliostro or circa 1970's Italian Modiano!

New thread soon....


I have to gather all my versions together now!

Cerulean

Cartamanzia 184, Nov 1948 on Ace of Coins

This circa 1948 version comes in a lidded light green 'leather' box and the booklet cover is white with decorative symbols of French pips and a leaping deer.

There is no Etteilla numbering on the cards. That seems to be an addition that I see to both the Modiano and U.S. Games re-issue of the deck, circa 1970's-81.

The majors in description and pictures seem similar to Papus' Divinatory Tarot....however the instructions for Papus minors are a bit different . For instance, Card #45, Five of Cups in Papus Divinatory Tarot has a date of July 10-20, while in the Cagliostro 1981 version, Card 45 is the six of cups...the five of cups in the Cagliostro seems closer in meaning, despite a 'card number'

When I get through processing everything, hope to post soon.

Here's the thread with the 1948 Modiano Cartomanzia 184 details I was able to post and perhaps add photos:

http://www.tarotforum.net/showthread.php?t=151890

Mari

I wonder if this thread will jump back to life?

gregory said:

Hum. Just found another link that says both the 184s were issued in the 60s. And one was in a CREAM box (the owner - Sumada - has it, so it's not just a wild stab.) Anyone have one of THOSE ?????

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Mine arrived today. As per the pics, it is a cream slip box (with a gold inner).
AceP tax stamped 1961 - so it all fits nicely.

The card stock and laminate of the 60's Modiano Cartomanzia Lusso 184 is incredible.
The waxy, lightly textured feel reminds me very much of Thomson-Leng's fabric finish.
It's a very seductive deck indeed!