Help choose another marseilles deck

piscesdreamer

I've been thinking about getting another Marseilles deck.I currently have the Claude Burdel deck(not the universal Marseilles) but i'd like to get something a little more interesting to look at,something with some better definition and color but still retaining it's tdm authenticity.any suggestions?I was thinking of either the hadar or the fournier but i'm open to suggestions.thanks
 

Bertrand

Hello,

piscesdreamer said:
something with some better definition and color but still retaining it's tdm authenticity
I'd say both Flornoy's Noblet and Dodal fits that description in my opinion, but you may not agree about the colors ; Hadar and Fournier are colourful deck, but this may be antinomic with the idea of authenticity.

Bertrand
 

shaveling

piscesdreamer said:
something a little more interesting to look at,
something with some better definition and color
but still retaining it's tdm authenticity.
Personally, I think nothing's more interesting to look at than the Burdel.

But that aside, I'd recommend the Grimaud, or the Duserre edition of the same deck. It's a classic, the lines are clear. The palette is limited, with mostly red, blue and yellow. (I'm not certain what you're looking for in terms of color.) The blue is famously dark in the Grimaud, it's a bit easier to see the line work, especially the crawdad in The Moon's pool, on the Duserre version. But if you're trying to get away from the black outlines and wood block print look, with shaded artwork instead, then Fournier would be the way to go.

If you're willing to go one step away from the strictly defined TdM, there's the AGM TdM, which most any Marseille queen will tell you is "really a Schaffhouse." It's packaged as a Marseille, and doesn't differ from the TdM's more than they differ among themselves. The lines are clear, if a bit coarse. The colors are greyed a bit, like the Hadar, but with a more autumnal palatte than his. It's currently listed on ebay for under ten dollars.

You are on the horns of a dilemma balancing clear line work and authenticity. The most authentic decks will be the photoreproductions. But the lines will be indefinite here and there, raising questions of "what it that?" The modern redrawn decks give you lines that are clear and distinct. But the artist has answered those questions, and the card will have that artist's answer and that one only. So the authenticity is muddied as the lines are clarified. I think it's generally agreed that the Grimaud is less radical in that area than the Hadar or the Jodorowsky-Camoin. Flornoy's decks are also at the conservative end of the sprectum.
 

piscesdreamer

thanks for the reply's,so in keeping with a more traditional Marseilles deck should I stay away from the fournier deck?
 

shaveling

The short answer is Yes.

The long answer is; It depends on your priorities and the other decks you're looking at. The old cards were first printed as black line drawings, using carved wood blocks. The colors were added by using stencils. So the decks using solid, unshaded colors and black outlines are more traditional in using art that follows that use of line and color. (Even though today's cards aren't carved on blocks of wood and colored by stencils, not by a long shot.)

On the other hand, most of us think that the actual pictures on the Hadar and the Jodo-Camoin depart here and there from the images of any specific historical TdM. The Hadar combines images from various different decks, the Jodo-Camoin purports to restore details that had become obscured in the history of the Conver deck, on which it is based. The Fournier images, in the sense of who, dressed how, is doing what with what, are those of the Conver, without such notable changes. Or perhaps more accurately, they reproduce the Grimaud's images, which are basically Conver images. They are shaded paintings, not the pseudo-woodcuts of other decks. But what those paintings show are pretty much what you'll see on an original Conver, in a different rendition.

But the change in style is a really big change. So the short answer to your question is "Yes." And I suspect that's the answer you were looking for. I'd still recommend the Grimaud.
 

Le Fanu

The Flornoy Noblet or Dodal. Both are stunning and easy to get...

The Flornoy Dodal, which I received today, is so big and coloured and detailed and expressive. I'd really recommend it!
 

Yves Le Marseillais

What about real Tarot decks

shaveling said:
Personally, I think nothing's more interesting to look at than the Burdel.

Hello,

Burdel is a very nice deck and an historical one.... if you get (impossible) or see real deck (possible).
if you get or look at all Burdel decks on the market, you don't get truth.

So my question is: Have you a real one ?

Secundly as real thing I would also suggest a Pierre Madenié deck.
same problems as Burdel but also fact that no Madenié is on the market.

I was lucky enough to see both of them in hand and after this, let's say that commercialised decks are quite inférior in quality and sensations.

A little bit like if you see a Van Gogh at 50 cm and compare it to his poster.

If you go to Old €urope contact me and I will informs you how to see them.

Salutations from Marseille

Yves
 

Bertrand

Hello,

the Burdel... great but there's no way you can get a copy, and as you point out neither for the Madenié by the way.
Yves, What is your opinion on the Jean Proché published by Il Meneghello ?


Bertrand
 

firecatpickles

Another vote for the Noblet or their new Dodal...
 

emmsma

What is a "Real" TdM? And where does one acquire such? What makes all the others listed here "not real"?

Confused.